Why do Americans not travel more internationally ?

wrote in message
...
On 7 Nov 2005 11:39:34 -0800, "markbyrn" wrote:

Jeff,

Better yet, let's move this entire thread to the wrestling newsgroups -
we might some get some rational discourse. Alternatively, we could
move the thread to the alt.bash-america newsgroup, and those who have
the need to build their self-esteem by ragging on the US, can post
loaded questions & make sweeping generalizations.

Mark

Do you really think there has been a lot of American bashing ( ragging
) ? Actually I think, for a newsgroup, the thread has been quite civil
and at times a little humerous. Like most threads, a little short on
factual info but perceptions are still valid and interesting.

Why is it that when people outside of the US have a criticism of the
US it is called "bashing" ? When an American criticizes the US, is
that "bashing" or are they just written off as "lefties" or
"liberals"?

America, perhaps more than ever before in its history, is highly polarized
along political, educational, and class lines. You will find it extremely
difficult to generalize about "Americans," as whatever generality you come
up with will be contradicted by, more or less, half of the population.
While there is nothing inappropriate about criticizing "America" in the
context of actions it takes as a nation, assuming that Americans are an
homogenous group that think alike about issues is grossly inaccurate. No
one likes to be told what they think by others.

"Alan S" wrote in message
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On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 20:16:49 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:

Big country. Lots to do and see here. Europe is actually a lot of small
countries. So a 2 hour drive gets you international travel, while a 2
hour
drive in California, does not get you out of the state. Statistics are
marvelous aren't they?

Have you driven two hours south of San Diego? Or two hours
north of Buffalo?

Cheers, Alan, Australia

Actually yes to the San Diego question, and I have driven across Canada from
Winnipeg to Vancouver. But I have also been to Europe and Asia several
times, both pleasure and business. As well as Oz twice on business, both
Perth and Sydney. Will probably return to Oz for the Queensland and Great
Barrier Reef areas. But as to international travel for US residents, You
can get most of the same destination type activities without leaving the
English speaking USA. Without the 9 or 10 hour flights. You will not see
the different architecture you find in 5-600 hundred year old towns and
villages of old Europe, but the money is familiar, the skiing can be better,
and you can read the menus, by staying in North America, except for Mexico,
and most of those places know enough english to talk you out of your money.

Julie wrote:

Go to their country and talk to them - the things they believe about
the rest of the world is unbelievable.

And to whose country you'd visit that not to apply?

Ilkka

"markbyrn" wrote in message
ups.com...
Larry,

Let's take a commercial break to have a serious moment. I recently
completed a 2 year assigned at the US Embassy in Armenia and in my
travels within Armenia and other Former Soviet Union States, I met
exactly one Australian outside of Russia. Meanwhile, there are
hundreds or thousands of Americans in each of the countries; volunteers
with the Peace Corps, workers from multiple government alphabet soups
(USAID, USDA, DoD, DOS, etc.), many more Americans working for NGOs,
diasporans, business people, teachers, and religious missionaries. So
while Americans are living and working in Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia,
Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Georgia,
Armenia, Azerbaijan, Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova, how many Australians
are in each of these countries? A handful and the Australian's
government's interest is minimal; one Embassy in Russia. Talk about
lack of information to make foreign policy decisions.

So even if we accept the premise that Americans are less likely to
travel overseas as tourists than country X (haven't seen the hard
evidence so far), your sweeping generalization about insularity and not
knowing anything about other countries is absurd. Do you think typical
the backpacking, camera toting tourist is suddenly enlightened &
worldly smart by cursory visits to foreign countries? It might make
them smug & urbane with a tendency to make ignorant sweeping
generalizations on the Internet, but they're still essentially
clueless, especially compared to those who have spent years studying,
living, and/or working in a foreign country.

Now let's get back to humorous ribs. Did you not tell us before that
you a director of the one of the largest travel agencies in Australia?
How did you find the time to do that plus be a mercenary in Vietnam,
Angola, and Iraq?

Mark
Firstly I was never a mercenary.
Secondly,in Angola the US troops there were 'advisors' to SA special
forces.Henry Kissinger was Sec of State then and came to SA at that time to
discuss all these matters.I was attached to SA special forces which first
invaded
Angola in 1975 with USA intelligence and equipment to back us up.In fact SA
only entered that bad situation because of US pressure.Another case of an
unwinnable war supporting the wrong side etc.Sound familiar?
Thirdly many Aus fellows fought,got disabled and died in Vietnam fighting on
the side of the Americans.You seem to be totally unaware of this which again
illustrates the lack of general knowledge .
A famous battle we were involved in - not me,thank God, was Long Tan in
which a handful of Aussies(less than 300 I believe) fought more than a
battalion of Viet Cong and held them off against incredible odds.I spent a
very unhappy tour of duty there praying I would survive.
After that I went to SA for a few years before returning home and regaining
citizenship.In SA I was a part-time soldier as most of the population were.
The first Iraq war was easier as a member of a specialist team we never saw
any action as we could not run as fast as the Iraqis andcould never quite
catch them!
Finally,back on civvie street I entered business and that's how I ended up
in travel.
Believe it or not,some people are capable of walking and chewing gum at the
same time.
Now stop being sensitive and trying to get personal.

"Doug McDonald" wrote in message
...
Alan S wrote:
On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 20:16:49 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:


Big country. Lots to do and see here. Europe is actually a lot of small
countries. So a 2 hour drive gets you international travel, while a 2
hour drive in California, does not get you out of the state. Statistics
are marvelous aren't they?


Have you driven two hours south of San Diego? Or two hours
north of Buffalo?


Well, yes .... but most of the USA is nowhere near an international
border. Only three countries actually border on the USA. One
does not count because it is very expensive to get there directly
(Russia). One other only touches the USA at two or three highly
populated spots (Mexico: San Diego, Phoenix/Tucson, and arguably
south Texas.) Only Canada has a long border and it is populated
only at the extreme ends. Most of the USA, such as where I live, is
well out of a one day reasonable drive to another country. The closest
drive for me is to cross over at Detroit: and that's an 8 hour drive.

In fact, I am 60 years old and had never been to Mexico until I
was 57, whereas I had been to England, Italy, Greece, Iceland, Kenya,
Tanzania, Israel, India, Nepal, Peru, Ecuador, Australia, and Papua New
Guinea, (as well as Canada) already. It was as easy to get to most of
those places as to Mexico, if somewhat more tiring.

Doug McDonald

Why do so few Americans visit South America?

Ilkka wrote:

Julie wrote:


Go to their country and talk to them - the things they believe about
the rest of the world is unbelievable.


And to whose country you'd visit that not to apply?

When we were in Turkey we talked to someone who was absolutely sure that
every family in the United States had two cars (we have one) and owned a
gun (we don't own one, nor so far as I know, do most of our friends).

--
Evelyn C. Leeper
A passionate commitment to social justice is no substitute for
knowing what the hell you're talking about. --Thomas Sowell

In message "larry"
wrote:

Why do so few Americans visit South America?

My ex-g/f is currently taking a gun training course in preparation for a
trip, as advised by her current boyfriend who happens to be from there
and won't return without a gun...

--
I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not so sure.

"Evelyn C. Leeper" wrote in message
...
Ilkka wrote:

Julie wrote:


Go to their country and talk to them - the things they believe about
the rest of the world is unbelievable.


And to whose country you'd visit that not to apply?

When we were in Turkey we talked to someone who was absolutely sure that
every family in the United States had two cars (we have one) and owned a
gun (we don't own one, nor so far as I know, do most of our friends).

When I was working in Nice one of the engineers (college degree mind you)
didn't understand why his boss was not in the home office in California yet,
after all, he left Nice five hours ago. So I asked how much he traveled.
He'd been to Germany...according to the original post he would be considered
an international traveler.

On Mon, 07 Nov 2005 22:10:14 +0100, B Vaughan wrote:


On Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:45:12 -0500, Dave Smith
wrote:

FWIW, my wife was navigating on a trip a few years ago and was totally messed up
in Holland. We had a map the same size as our provincial road map. One one
occasion we were headed for a small town north east of Arnhem. She told me the
exit was a few miles after we crossed a river, but the exit was about 200 yards
past the river. Not a problem, there is a place ti turn around about 10 miles
down the road. It turned out to be less than a mile. She was having a really bad
time adjusting to the difference in scale of the map. It took us less than 4
hours of easy driving from the very north of Holland to Belgium. It takes me
longer than that to get to an annual vacation site, and it is not even half way
up on the map of the southern half of our province.

My (Italian) husband has a similar problem when driving in the US. He
thinks we can stop for lunch in a town that we won't reach until the
next day.

How long can it take to traverse one inch on the map? It's just 500 miles or
so.

My record for a day's driving was 1250 miles. I was ready to quit while in
western kansas on my way to denver colorado. Just a little more and I could be
home. Another 4 hours; another 300 miles.

"DevilsPGD" wrote in message
...
In message "larry"
wrote:

Why do so few Americans visit South America?

My ex-g/f is currently taking a gun training course in preparation for a
trip, as advised by her current boyfriend who happens to be from there
and won't return without a gun...

--
As bad as LA then?But not as bad as Detroit?
Kidding aside I was in Chile 3 months ago.Great but bloody expensive hotels.
Terrific place with great contrasts from volcanos to mountains,ski,desert
etc.
People in country are very hospitable.