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US Tourist Visa



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 28th, 2003, 04:47 PM
Yaofeng
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Default US Tourist Visa

Many of us know that after 9/11, the US State department raised Visa
processing fees for citizens of those countries that need a Visa to
enter the US across the board to $100, citing additional costs due to
security and background checks. Naturally many of those countries
reciprocated the favor by charging the same amount to US citizens
applying Visas to visit them.

Recently over a casual conversation with a friend from China, I was
outraged by the action of the Visa section of US Consulate in Beijing.
The parents of this young man, who live in Shang-Dong, probably a few
hundred miles from Beijing, wanted to come see him. So they travel by
train to Beijing to apply for Visa. AFAIK, there are only 5 or 6 US
Consulate offices across all of China. Shang-Dong is under the
Beijing Consulate Office jurisdiction. His parents paid $100 each to
get Visa and was denied. The reason was they were suspect of
immigration incliniation. Naturally the $200 was pocketed by the US
Consulate. If they want to apply again, they risk another $200 loss
not knowing if the Visas will be granted.

Is the State Department in the business of making money? When we paid
$100 to get Visa to go to any God forsaken country, we don't like it
but one thing we know is we will get the Visa. Plus $100 is just a
nuisance, not a big deal. But $100 to folks in many other countries
is a big deal. It may be several months salary. And to get their
money then deny entry. That's robbery.

How much we have changed from "give me you tired, your poor..." to
"give me you affluent, your brightest.."
  #2  
Old September 28th, 2003, 05:22 PM
USA
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Default US Tourist Visa


"Yaofeng" wrote in message
om...
Many of us know that after 9/11, the US State department raised Visa
processing fees for citizens of those countries that need a Visa to
enter the US across the board to $100, citing additional costs due to
security and background checks. Naturally many of those countries
reciprocated the favor by charging the same amount to US citizens
applying Visas to visit them.

Recently over a casual conversation with a friend from China, I was
outraged by the action of the Visa section of US Consulate in Beijing.
The parents of this young man, who live in Shang-Dong, probably a few
hundred miles from Beijing, wanted to come see him. So they travel by
train to Beijing to apply for Visa. AFAIK, there are only 5 or 6 US
Consulate offices across all of China. Shang-Dong is under the
Beijing Consulate Office jurisdiction. His parents paid $100 each to
get Visa and was denied. The reason was they were suspect of
immigration incliniation. Naturally the $200 was pocketed by the US
Consulate. If they want to apply again, they risk another $200 loss
not knowing if the Visas will be granted.

Is the State Department in the business of making money? When we paid
$100 to get Visa to go to any God forsaken country, we don't like it
but one thing we know is we will get the Visa. Plus $100 is just a
nuisance, not a big deal. But $100 to folks in many other countries
is a big deal. It may be several months salary. And to get their
money then deny entry. That's robbery.

How much we have changed from "give me you tired, your poor..." to
"give me you affluent, your brightest.."


They lost the $100 per visa and were denied issuance based on "immigration
inclination".
That basis would not exist if the problem of illegal immigration by chinese
nationals
wasn't a problem with the US, or many other countries for that matter.
Chinese emigration itself would not be a problem if China were a country
that provided
a sound economy, population planning and a democratic lifestyle so that so
many people
living in China would not want to emmigrate.
So who do you blame?




  #3  
Old September 28th, 2003, 06:46 PM
Limp Tomato
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Default US Tourist Visa

USA wrote:
Beijing Consulate Office jurisdiction. His parents paid $100 each to
get Visa and was denied. The reason was they were suspect of
immigration incliniation.


That basis would not exist if the problem of illegal immigration by chinese
nationals wasn't a problem with the US,


The issue isn't the decision to refuse the visa, it is the bloody USD $100
that the consulates charge for the privilege of asking permission to visit the
USA to spend money in the USA. If they refuse a visa, they should give back
the money, or at least part of the money.

Do american consulates realise that this will kill the USA tourist industry ?
Or are they convinced that the USA tourism industry lives off solely of
domestic tourism ? Perhaps they think they are doing foreigners a favour by
allowing them to enter the USA, instead of realising that it is the foreign
tourists that do the USA a favour by spending foreign money inside the USA.
Does the USA now have foreign trade surpluses ?

Had friends go through the same process (but they got their visa). What ticked
them wasn't so much the $100 but rather the bloody charges for making the
telephone call to make appointment. If you want to go beyond a certain point
in their telephone system, you need to provide credit card so they can then
bill you by the minute (including holding time). (not all countries have the
equivalent of the USA 900 telephone numbers where the telco bills you).

Another frustration is that the USA doesn't consider Canada as a foreign land
as far as VISAs are concerned. So if you are granted a 30 day entry in the
USA, you are not allowed to cross to Canada after 30 days in USA and spend
another 30 days in Canada. You must fly out of north american within 30 days
of arriving in the USA. (solution is to visit Canada first when possible).

In the end: if the USA doesn't want tourists, then tourists should simply
avoid the USA. In the days of the soviet union, only the truly adventurous
would manage to have a visit into the soviet union and jump through all the
red tape to get their visas and travel documents. Perhaps the current USA
administration finds that such a totalitarian state is the only way to control terrorists.

If the parents really want to see their son, then perhaps they should meet in
Canada or Mexico.
  #5  
Old September 28th, 2003, 07:55 PM
mrtravel
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Default US Tourist Visa

Limp Tomato wrote:

USA wrote:

Beijing Consulate Office jurisdiction. His parents paid $100 each to
get Visa and was denied. The reason was they were suspect of
immigration incliniation.



That basis would not exist if the problem of illegal immigration by chinese
nationals wasn't a problem with the US,



The issue isn't the decision to refuse the visa, it is the bloody USD $100
that the consulates charge for the privilege of asking permission to visit the
USA to spend money in the USA. If they refuse a visa, they should give back
the money, or at least part of the money.


The goal is for US Taxpayers not to bear the cost of administration for
the Visa program. The State Department doesn't give passports away,
does it?

The US also has higher standards for entry than most countries. As
someone else posted. If you are from a poor country, it is more
difficult to prove that you are going to return to that country.
If people from these countries didn't abuse the system, then there would
be no need to make it more difficult for people from these countries to
visit.

  #6  
Old September 28th, 2003, 10:50 PM
Starched Underwear
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Default US Tourist Visa

mrtravel wrote:
The goal is for US Taxpayers not to bear the cost of administration for
the Visa program. The State Department doesn't give passports away,
does it?


When you leave your country, it doesn't do your country any economic good
because you will be spending your money abroad. When a foreigner comes to the
USA, it generates lots of economic activity in the USA. Giving the visas
should be seen as a wise investment.

Some countries spend a lot of money to attract tourists. The USA is spending
lots to repell tourists.

Should they charge $100 to all those mexicans illegally crossing the borders
into the USA ? Are mexicans allowed to visit the USA ? Or are they such a high
risk of wanting to stay in USA that the USA refuses all but a few requests to
enter the USA ?

The US also has higher standards for entry than most countries.


You can have whatever standards you want for immigration. But for tourists you
are stupid to block so many simple tourists.

How can you claim to have "higher standards" when your country doesn't even
control its exit points to be able to know who is in or out ? If you want to
know which tourist has overstayed their visit, you should have official exit
control points at airports and land border crossings. Many countries do this.
The current system is so flawed that you have, since 9-11 illegally arrested
and detained a great number of legitimate visitors simply because some piece
of paper had not been processed years ago leading officials to conclude the
tourist had stayed in the USA all this time).

If people from these countries didn't abuse the system, then there would
be no need to make it more difficult for people from these countries to
visit.



Perhaps the USA should start checking ships before blocking legitimate
visitors who seek an official visa. The illegal immigrants from china tend to
enter through illegal means (containers, boats, forged papers etc).

If the person has a legitimate visa, passport and airline ticket, then they
are not very likely to drop all their papers in the toilet on the plane and
then claim political asylum when they reach the USA. If you checked in with
all the right papers, and then you claim asylum and have no papers on you,
then the immigration forlks will get the passenger manifest and know what your
real identity is.

Ironic that you would be blocking legitimate requests at the consolate, but
the illegal immigrants bypass the consulate and simply get forged papers that
allow them to board aircraft and then claim asylum when they reach the USA.
  #7  
Old September 28th, 2003, 11:01 PM
Yaofeng
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Default US Tourist Visa

Not the Karl Orff wrote in message ...

That's why Chile, Brasil and Turkey charge U.S. citizens USD 100 to
enter/get a visa. I do hope more follow their example.


They should if they havn't already. I wonder if anyone calculated the
economic impact on affected countries because of declining tourism due
to this added bureaucracy. It will not be easy. This tends to to be
obscured by the lingering effect of 9/11.
  #8  
Old September 28th, 2003, 11:38 PM
Miguel Cruz
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Default US Tourist Visa

mrtravel wrote:
Limp Tomato wrote:
The issue isn't the decision to refuse the visa, it is the bloody USD
$100 that the consulates charge for the privilege of asking permission to
visit the USA to spend money in the USA. If they refuse a visa, they
should give back the money, or at least part of the money.


The goal is for US Taxpayers not to bear the cost of administration for
the Visa program.


But the problem here is that there's no incentive for the State Dept to be
efficient about it.

They can let costs grow and grow, and they'll just get passed on to
applicants. There is no competition and really no significant force exerting
downward pressure on these rates except for diplomatic protests.

It may be that they could be adjudicating these for $20 apiece if they were
more organized, but since nobody who has fiscal oversight authority over the
State Dept has reason to care, we'll never know.

miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Site remodeled 10-Sept-2003: Hundreds of new photos, easier navigation.
  #9  
Old September 28th, 2003, 11:41 PM
Miguel Cruz
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Posts: n/a
Default US Tourist Visa

Yaofeng wrote:
Not the Karl Orff wrote:
That's why Chile, Brasil and Turkey charge U.S. citizens USD 100 to
enter/get a visa. I do hope more follow their example.


They should if they havn't already. I wonder if anyone calculated the
economic impact on affected countries because of declining tourism due
to this added bureaucracy.


You're contradicting yourself. And spite is not a valid basis for
policymaking.

If raising visa fees costs the US, or anyone else, net money because of lost
tourism dollars, then it's a dumb and shortsighted thing to do. It's dumb
for the US and it's dumber still for countries that do it as a retaliatory
measure.

miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Site remodeled 10-Sept-2003: Hundreds of new photos, easier navigation.
  #10  
Old September 29th, 2003, 12:31 AM
Philip George
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Default US Tourist Visa


I'm not sure that the US charging $100 for visas is going to hurt tourism
that much as most of the big money comes from citizens of states on the
Visa Waiver Program. However what will damage tourism is the US's insistence
on biometric passports from next year. (No biometric passport = have to
apply for a visa = pay $100). This will apply to all countries, and of
course nowhere in the world has biometric passports yet. The EU are about
to start issuing them, but as people's passports only expire once every 10
years there will be a lot of people who put off their visits to the US...

phil



In article ,
Miguel Cruz wrote:
Yaofeng wrote:
Not the Karl Orff wrote:
That's why Chile, Brasil and Turkey charge U.S. citizens USD 100 to
enter/get a visa. I do hope more follow their example.


They should if they havn't already. I wonder if anyone calculated the
economic impact on affected countries because of declining tourism due
to this added bureaucracy.


You're contradicting yourself. And spite is not a valid basis for
policymaking.

If raising visa fees costs the US, or anyone else, net money because of lost
tourism dollars, then it's a dumb and shortsighted thing to do. It's dumb
for the US and it's dumber still for countries that do it as a retaliatory
measure.

miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Site remodeled 10-Sept-2003: Hundreds of new photos, easier navigation.



 




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