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Electricity Question



 
 
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  #11  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 01:47 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Janet Wilder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 439
Default Electricity Question

AlmostBob wrote:
Hi Janet
Am an Aussie living in Canada
Just about every department store in Aus sells the same alkaline
rechargeable battery kit with a 240V charger and 4/8 batteries
Grandcell is one brandname.
brought my batteries with me, and brought a WalMart "Pure Energy" charger
kit, now have twice as many batteries and a charger for each continent, $20

watch for dropbears


thanks, what's a "dropbear"

--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life
  #12  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 01:53 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Janet Wilder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 439
Default Electricity Question

kangaroo16 wrote:


Well, if the "batteries" are rechargeable, they are probably
either nickel/cadmium or the newer NiMH [nickel/metal hydride]
cells.

If it uses standard "AA" or "AAA" size cells, no particular
problem. You could either charge them with a congenial
car battery with a limiting resistor, to control the current.

If this is so, you could probably get someone charge them off a
standard car battery which is 12 volts at a few hundred amps.

NOTE: Don't try this with tourist buses or trucks which may well
have 24 volt systems.

If the camera directly uses "AA" or "AAA" cells your instruction
book should tell you if you can use conventional "alkaline"
non-rechargeable cells of these sizes.

If uses either of these, again no particular problem. You would
be able to get a 240 volt AC charger to charge either of these
here.

However, I would consider your "best shot" is to go to a camera
store, explain that you are going to Australia, and ask them for
their "expert" advice when your only choice of charging is from
12 volts DC or 240 volts a.dc.

It isn't really all that difficult.

For instance, I have a "mini mag light" pocket torch [or
"flashlight"] that uses 2 "AA" size cells.

I could use two conventional "AA" zinc/carbon cells, but they
would have limited life. Usually use "alkaline energizers",
Mn02, cells.

If I wanted to use rechargable cells, would use either Ni/Cd
[nickel/cadmium cells] or the newer metal hydride cells,
designated as "NiMh".

Both are rechargeable, by several means, including solar
chargers.

Your instruction book for the camera should tell you what
it requires for operation, in terms of voltage and amperage.

Cars in Australia generally have a 12 volt D.C. battery. So if
you rent a car, your problem is solved. Even if you don't rent
one, am sure that someone will be willing to charge your battery
pack for you.

Firstly, if a 12 volt DC supply, all that is required is an
inbuilt resistor to limit the current to 500 ma.

Although trucks and tourist buses may have a 24 volt supply, so
beware of this. The resistor value would vary.

I cheerfully admit that I don't know much about the power supply
for cameras.

If the camera requires 12 volts at 500 ma [500 milliamperes] to
charge, then it presumably can be operated off a cell pack that
delivers about 1.2 volts per cell.

Does your instruction book say that you can use conventional
zinc/carbon cells which provide 1.5 volts each, six of which will
provide 12 volts?

Or "alkaline energizer" cells which will do it? [They have
lower internal resistance] Or rechargeable nickel/cadmium cells
in series, that provide enough voltage to operate the camera?
[Due to lower internal resistance]

In other words, does the camera directly require a power source
that provide enough amperage at the required voltage.

Not to charge its internal cells, whatever they might be, but to
directly operate it?

As far as I'm concerned, the easiest thing for you to do is take
your camera into a photo shop, tell them that you want the
easiest and cheapest solution for your problem, then let drop the
fact that you are coming to Australia where the standard voltage
is 220-240 volts R.M.S. at 50 Hz and you want a recommendation!

Hopefully this post will be helpful to you and others.


While I truly appreciate the help, I'm afraid I'm lost. I can use
regular over-the-counter AA batteries. The rechargeable ones are AA
batteries, too. I'm just going to take some extra AAs with me to last
through the 5 day trip to Ayers Rock and Cairns. I'm even thinking of a
disposable underwater camera for the Reef and that should spare my
batteries even more.

This will be my first and probably last trip to Australia and New
Zealand. This old grandma can't take the long plane flights for more
than one trip. g So I'm not about to spend on an adapter that I can
only use once. I don't do e-bay to resell it.

Thanks again. I'll be back with other questions, I'm certain.

Janet
--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life
  #13  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 03:11 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Alan S[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,163
Default Electricity Question

On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:47:28 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote:

AlmostBob wrote:
Hi Janet
Am an Aussie living in Canada
Just about every department store in Aus sells the same alkaline
rechargeable battery kit with a 240V charger and 4/8 batteries
Grandcell is one brandname.
brought my batteries with me, and brought a WalMart "Pure Energy" charger
kit, now have twice as many batteries and a charger for each continent, $20

watch for dropbears


thanks, what's a "dropbear"


Well, first you have to try to come to terms with the
concept that Bundaberg Rum, a product of our canefields,
uses a Polar Bear in it's advertising. An animal that is
never seen here outside a zoo:-)

Then you have to accept that the bear acts like a human
being in the ads. Just a couple of leaps of logic.

Then: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULEQpUY_crc


Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com/
latest: Slovenia
http://loraltraveloz.blogspot.com/
latest: Mossman Gorge in the Daintree Rainforest
  #14  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 06:19 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
kangaroo16
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 222
Default Electricity Question

On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:29:31 +0930, "John H"
wrote in
:

Kangaroo216 stated


I don't know who kangaroo216 might be if the pseudonym
exists at all. I post as kangaroo16 :-)

(1) "but US voltage is a nominal 110-220 volts"
Since when?
I have never known any supply to fluctuate that much!
I think you may mean 110 -120 volts


You are right, of course! I should proofread my posts rather
than just spell checking them.

As you probably know, though, A.C. voltages are usually given
in RMS [Root Mean Square] values rather than peak to peak.

The variation in RMS values depends on the tapping on the pole
transformer, and how far the consumer is from the nearest
one. There are conductor losses and other factors.

Of course, had you proofread yours, or included my post in your
reply, or checked the full headers, you wouldn't have made the
kangaroo216 error :-)

(2) " in US"
I think YOU mean AUST.


Dunno what you are referring to, which is a good argument for
not censoring the senders post. After all, plenty of bandwidth
these days, and it makes replies a lot easier for all concerned.
I usually don't snip the senders post in a reply, but sometimes I
do. When I do, I note that the post is snipped and the reader
is referred to the original.



(3) "It might be more convenient
and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA".
Using your vernacular, maybe "probably",
but would depend on many factors such as store at which purchased,
whether it was on sale etc. all which are actually about as relevant as your
statement.


Actually, was thinking more along the lines of simple
availability. Most tourists and travelers take a lot of photos
on a trip and don't want to be caught with a "dead" electronic
camera.

Could you guarantee that someone landing at Cairns international
airport on a Sunday afternoon could easily get a recharger? Have
been to Cairns by road, not by air, so admit I really don't
know.


(4) "Some tourists seem to assume that an "adaptor" plug changes the
voltage, which it doesn't.

Conjecture on your part!


Do try to be more clear in your replies! Most adaptor plugs just
provide a match between physical plug and socket. I don't doubt
that some adaptors consist of a transformer with a plug for the
Australian sockets and a U.S. two pin socket. Have one as a
matter of fact.

(5) "Make sure the power supply on the
appliance you intend to use has a switch to change the voltage
from 240 volts to 120 volts, and remember to switch to proper
voltage before plugging it in!


Think that this is a fair warning, as have heard of cases where
the tourist or traveler did exactly that.

AND (6)
So what if Janet's charger doesn't have a voltage change switch?
In that case, she would have to find an adapter that includes a
transformer, or buy a 240 volt charger to charge her batteries at
the proper low voltage and polarity.


Lots of appliances are nowadays "multi" voltage and will cover from
110v to 240v and 50 - 60 Hz without any voltage or frequency switch of any
kind.
Laptops are one that "springs to mind" as mine does exactly that.
My battery charger for the digital camera does, and also has the ability to
have the plug slide
off the back of the unit and another countries plug slid in to replace it
and no other "transformer " or anything else needed.


"Lots" doesn't mean "all".:-)

Your answer would only apply if her appliance was of an earlier vintage that
would only work on 110 volts,
thus need a 240v to 110v step down device, usually (but not always) a
transformer.


How do we know from her original post just what she has?
+++

Frequency difference (50Hz to 60Hz) on a small charger would have negligible
effect,
perhaps slight heating of the unit depending upon whether it is has a wound
transformer in unit .


True, but not important from a safety aspect.

The Earth pin may or may not be longer, The standard states 1.63 mm for all
of them,
some supplied are same length and some slightly longer, in fact some are
actually larger in height
and width ie 15 amp socket, where earth pin is same length, wider,
and higher, so they wont fit into the standard 10 amp socket,
but the standard 10 amp plug will fit into a 15 amp socket.



Perhaps most of my small appliances are obsolescent, then, as
most have a longer earth pin. Presumably the reason for this is
that the earth ["ground" in US] connection is established before
the active and neutral prongs reach the contacts.

There is also a 20 Amp plug & socket, where all pins are wider (thicker),

but rarely ever seen by 90% of population, never seen in domestic premises
AFAIK.


Depending on how you define "domestic premises" of course. Would
you define a farm shop as a part of a "domestic premise"? Some
do have 20 amp outlets, though will agree that 15 amp are
probably more common.

If we ignore other technical terms such as power factor,
conductor resistance, etc. a 20 amp socket at 220 volts will
theoretically provide 4,400 watts. At a line voltage of
240 volts, 4,800 watts.

A 15 amp outlet at 220 volts would provide 3,300 watts,
and at 240, 3,600 watts.

Want to dispute this? :-)

Also most small appliances do not even have the 3rd (earth pin) anyway as
they are invariably double insulated.
No double insulated appliance has to have the 3rd (earth) pin, but here
again some are supplied with plug that has it.


I might quibble about the "invariably", but would agree with the
rest of your statement.

However, I'm more concerned with safety than what is available,
or what a tourist or migrant might be trying to use.

The US system doesn't automatically provide a true earth
connection. With only two pins, and two conductors, whether a
given conductor is active or neutral depends on which way the
user plugs it in. A cheap, but not safe, way to do it, IMHO.

At one time, a lot of American mains operated valve ["tube" in
US] radios didn't have a transformer. They relied on using
valves of different voltage ratings in series. [ Can list some
typical valve types if you wish. ] They were once prohibited
imports on the grounds of safety.

They typically used a "chassis" ground, and relied on plastic
knobs, etc. to protect the user from the shaft of volume or
tuning knobs which were often at chassis potential.

O.K., what happens if the knob is missing, and the bare
shaft is exposed? What happens if the user is washing dishes and
touches that bare shaft?

Well, it depends on how the radio was plugged in. One way, and
the chassis is at neutral potential. Put the plug in the other
and the chassis is at "active" potential and they provide a path
to true earth ground.

I assume you know that even at a mere 110 volts from arm to arm
can provide a potentially lethal 10 milliamps to the heart. To
quote a bit from a book at hand "Australian Electrical Wiring:
Theory and Practice" by K Pethbridge and W.Williams, ISBN
0 07 93407 x. [In your local library you might find a copy under
Dewey Decimal Classification 621.31924, or you could always
request a copy on interlibrary loan if you want to dispute an
issue. :-)

On page 25 of my copy, chapter 2, "Electrical Safety"

------------------
"2.1 Effects of electric current on the human body

Electric shocks due to the use of electrical equipment occur
without warning and are often serious. The average worker is
frequently involved in a dangerous situations though not
realising that voltages as low as 32 V a.c. and 115 V d.c. can be
just as lethal as much higher voltages.
There are three ways by which electric shock may be directly
fatal. The following considerations refer to 50 Hz a.c. shock to
a normal, healthy, adult male."

No need to go into details, but if anyone is curious, they are
respiratory arrest, asphyxia, and ventricular fibrillation.

Naturally, there are a lot of variables...

but it is not wired/terminated as the cable to it is only two core anyway.


Agreed
See same url but another page ie
http://www.accesscomms.com.au/Refere...ugVariants.htm

+++
The url I supplied showed poster what it looked like a damn sight more than
your "stick drawing",


Well, actually I usually respond to posts line by line and
hadn't even read your reference when wrote my reply.

Easier and quicker just to give a rough illustration which most
people would understand. You could be an exception, of course
:-)

Some people read posts offline, and I thought my illustration
should be adequate.

and they would surely know what their own plug looked like.


Has the average American ever seen an Australian 3 pin plug on an
appliance?

BTW Do you always nitpick things others say? What was given was basically
all the person needed to know,
using her post as the basis for the reply.


When people criticise or get "nitpicky" with me, I can and often
do reply in kind. For someone claiming that I posted under the
nym of kangaroo216 you would seem to qualify. :-)

The poster didnt even elaborate other than to say it was a charger unit for
a camera.


When people are posting info on the group it does help to be
explicit as to details.
viz.
I would agree with the "should be able to", but that doesn't mean
you actually "will be able to" :-) It might be more convenient
and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA.

+++
Whilst the rest of your reply to Janet was very informative, it was not
anything the poster asked about,
Hell! I wonder what your reply to, a child who asked the question :"where do
I come from" would be?


Well, my wife and I don't have kids, by choice. If talking to
some other kid, I would probably be diplomatic and untruthful and
simply say "ask your parents".

Were I to be completely truthful, could always tell him or her
that they were probably an accident due to failure of the
contraceptive methods used. :-)

Do you believe that all children are "planned"? ...A very
optimistic and unrealistic view, IMHO.

Take a look at abortion statistics for any country. Check the
subject of "abortion" on
http://www.nationmaster.com/index.php

Or better yet,
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/he...alth-abortions

On second thought, will save you a bit of research. Of the top
19, Russia ranks #1, the USA #2. Australia doesn't make the
list, but I suspect we have much better sex education here.

In addition, "condoms" or "rubbers" are sold in supermarkets, and
most Australians wouldn't even raise an eyebrow at a 12 or 13
year old kid buying them, although the legal age of consent is
16 in most states.

Should a girl prefer the pill, we also have a free Medicare
system here, and kids can get their own Medicare card if
desired.

For privacy reasons, it is up to the physician, and he or she
cannot legally involve the parents.

Sorry if this information shocks you or other readers, but I
thought I should let readers know what living in a truly free
country involves. :-)

A diatribe on the reproductive systems of both male and female, which would
naturally be totally overkill.


Sorry about that, I believe in telling the truth to adults.

Perhaps you should jump back into your Joeys pouch.


Were I actually a "joey" I might be tempted to jump back
into the pouch of "mother kangaroo" rather than get hassled when
I post on the net.:-)

It is intended for the free exchange of information worldwide,
but perhaps you haven't realized this yet.

Will you, or others on the group bother to check on the
"nationmaster" links?

Perhaps they think that pregnant women only consider abortion
if they have been forcibly raped?

Easy enough to check on the "rape" statistics, no?

In your opinion, is abortion preferable to infanticide?

Looking forward to your reply to issues raised in this post.
Those who aren't interested in such issues are not required
to read my posts. :-)

John H

"kangaroo16" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:28:45 +0930, "John H"
wrote in
:


Ah, then you DID know that I was kangaroo16. Am not used to
"top posts". Why not reply to questions and statements line by
line?

Hi Janet,
Cairns like rest of Australia is 240 volts US is 110 volts.
SO if your appliance is shown as multi voltage ie 110 - 240 then all you
will need is an adapter plug to go from US two round pin horizontally in
line TO the Australian 3 pin.


Essentially correct, but US voltage is a nominal 110-220 volts
RMS at 60 Hertz [ cycle] , and uses a non polarized plug with
two vertical flat pins.

| |

Australia is a nominal 220-240 volt, 50 Hertz, uses a three pin
polarized plug with two angled flat plugs for active and neutral,
and a longer flat pin for a safety earth or "ground" in US.

/ \

|
Lots of chargers are multi voltage so you may indeed be OK for the voltage
situation
Have a look at this site for the plug shape
http://www.accesscomms.com.au/Reference/powerplug.htm
If you cant buy an adaptor in US then you should be able to buy one in
Cairns (at least at the airport if not the town).regards
John H


I would agree with the "should be able to", but that doesn't mean
you actually "will be able to" :-) It might be more convenient
and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA.

Some tourists seem to assume that an "adaptor" plug changes the
voltage, which it doesn't. Make sure the power supply on the
appliance you intend to use has a switch to change the voltage
from 240 volts to 120 volts, and remember to switch to proper
voltage before plugging it in!

Have heard of tourists forgetting to switch an electric razor to
the 220-240 volt range then trying to use it. The results can
be both spectacular and hazardous.

Admittedly, this probably happens more often when someone
assumes the voltage is the same in Australia and the US and
simply bends the blades of a US appliance at an angle to fit
an Australian outlet. This is not advisable.

So what if Janet's charger doesn't have a voltage change switch?
In that case, she would have to find an adapter that includes a
transformer, or buy a 240 volt charger to charge her batteries at
the proper low voltage and polarity.

Am sure if she takes her charger down to a camera store in the
USA, or checks the net, she can get more info.

I don't expect that US tourists would bring a portable TV set on
a trip, but if so, it won't work in Australia. The US uses the
obsolete NTSC standard rather than PAL used here. Channel
allocations are also different.

If bringing a mobile phone, they should check if it will work
here.

Incidentally, on a different topic, currency rates constantly
change. Radio news at 7.08 AM here says that due to loss of
value in US$ it is on a par with Canadian dollar for the first
time in 30 years. As to Aussie dollar:

At the moment
Live rates at 2007.09.20 21:13:37 UTC
1.00 USD 1.16020 AUD



United States Dollars Australia Dollars
1 USD = 1.16020 AUD 1 AUD = 0.861921 USD
http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi


At time that actually am finishing this post in my spare time:

1.15635 AUD=United States Dollars
1 USD = 1.15635 AUD 1 AUD = 0.864790 USD

Live rates at 2007.09.22 05:00:21 UTC
1.00 USD = 0.00136836 XAU
United States Dollars Gold Ounces
1 USD = 0.00136836 XAU 1 XAU = 730.800 USD

Again, if you or other readers are curious about current rates:
http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi

3:10 pm, or 1530 Saturday here, so cannot offer any info local
stock markets.

Looking forward to your reply.

Cheers,
Kangaroo16

To repeat: Kangaroo16:-)

=




Cheers,
kangaroo16
[I usually post on misc.immigration Australia+ NZ.]




"Janet Wilder" wrote in message
...
Will I need an electricity adapter in Cairns and at Ayers Rock to plug
in
my battery charger for the rechargeable batteries for my camera? The
charger is United States-flavor electric.

TIA
--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life


  #15  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 08:03 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
kangaroo16
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 222
Default Electricity Question

On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:53:16 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote in
:

kangaroo16 wrote:


Well, if the "batteries" are rechargeable, they are probably
either nickel/cadmium or the newer NiMH [nickel/metal hydride]
cells.

If it uses standard "AA" or "AAA" size cells, no particular
problem. You could either charge them with a congenial
car battery with a limiting resistor, to control the current.

If this is so, you could probably get someone charge them off a
standard car battery which is 12 volts at a few hundred amps.

NOTE: Don't try this with tourist buses or trucks which may well
have 24 volt systems.

If the camera directly uses "AA" or "AAA" cells your instruction
book should tell you if you can use conventional "alkaline"
non-rechargeable cells of these sizes.

If uses either of these, again no particular problem. You would
be able to get a 240 volt AC charger to charge either of these
here.

However, I would consider your "best shot" is to go to a camera
store, explain that you are going to Australia, and ask them for
their "expert" advice when your only choice of charging is from
12 volts DC or 240 volts a.dc.

It isn't really all that difficult.

For instance, I have a "mini mag light" pocket torch [or
"flashlight"] that uses 2 "AA" size cells.

I could use two conventional "AA" zinc/carbon cells, but they
would have limited life. Usually use "alkaline energizers",
Mn02, cells.

If I wanted to use rechargable cells, would use either Ni/Cd
[nickel/cadmium cells] or the newer metal hydride cells,
designated as "NiMh".

Both are rechargeable, by several means, including solar
chargers.

Your instruction book for the camera should tell you what
it requires for operation, in terms of voltage and amperage.

Cars in Australia generally have a 12 volt D.C. battery. So if
you rent a car, your problem is solved. Even if you don't rent
one, am sure that someone will be willing to charge your battery
pack for you.

Firstly, if a 12 volt DC supply, all that is required is an
inbuilt resistor to limit the current to 500 ma.

Although trucks and tourist buses may have a 24 volt supply, so
beware of this. The resistor value would vary.

I cheerfully admit that I don't know much about the power supply
for cameras.

If the camera requires 12 volts at 500 ma [500 milliamperes] to
charge, then it presumably can be operated off a cell pack that
delivers about 1.2 volts per cell.

Does your instruction book say that you can use conventional
zinc/carbon cells which provide 1.5 volts each, six of which will
provide 12 volts?

Or "alkaline energizer" cells which will do it? [They have
lower internal resistance] Or rechargeable nickel/cadmium cells
in series, that provide enough voltage to operate the camera?
[Due to lower internal resistance]

In other words, does the camera directly require a power source
that provide enough amperage at the required voltage.

Not to charge its internal cells, whatever they might be, but to
directly operate it?

As far as I'm concerned, the easiest thing for you to do is take
your camera into a photo shop, tell them that you want the
easiest and cheapest solution for your problem, then let drop the
fact that you are coming to Australia where the standard voltage
is 220-240 volts R.M.S. at 50 Hz and you want a recommendation!

Hopefully this post will be helpful to you and others.


While I truly appreciate the help, I'm afraid I'm lost. I can use
regular over-the-counter AA batteries. The rechargeable ones are AA
batteries, too.


I should have been a bit more specific. Firstly, "AA" is a
standard international designation for an "AA" size cell.

Technically speaking, it isn't a "battery". It is a single
"cell" which may have a fully charged output of between roughly
1.2 to 1.5 volts per cell, depending on type.

If your camera uses 4 "AA" cells in series, the cheapest
zinc/carbon traditional cells will produce a "battery" of
6 volts, as they have an output of 1.5 volts when fresh,
and 1.5 volts x 4= 6 volts. Zinc/carbon cells are traditional,
and are the cheapest.

Unfortunately, they discharge rather quickly when in use,
depending on the current [amperage] demand by whatever
device is using them.

Even more unfortunately, they "self-discharge" when in storage as
well, and when you buy a packet of them you may not know how long
they have been sitting on the shelf of the shop or store. They
aren't rechargeable.

The next step up, so to speak, for non-rechargeable cells, are
the
alkaline "AA" cells. These are recommended for "high drain"
applications, don't discharge much when unused, and have a
"shelf life" unused over a year.

There isn't any "rule" that can predict life of any cell. Say,
for instance, you have a pocket radio that uses a small
rectangular 9 volt battery.

If take one apart, you will find that it actually contains some
small 1.5 volt cells connected in series. 6 x 1.5 = 9 volts.

Can you "predict" how long a cheap 9 volt battery composed of
the traditional zinc/carbon cells will last in a transistor
radio application?

Not really, as it depends on the type of battery, the volume
control setting of the radio, how long it is on continuously,
the ambient temperature, and so on. [The cells composing it do
recover a bit from "rest".]

The next step up in a non-rechargeable cell [or "battery"] would
probably be "Alkaline Energizers". More expensive, but have a
long shelf life, at least a year from manufacture, will tolerate
higher current drain than zinc/carbon.

I don't know how much current your camera requires, or how
often you will be using it.

However, "AA" cells of either type are readily available in most
parts of Australia.

If I were an American tourist only coming down for five days, and
had an electronic camera, which presumably gives a "low voltage"
or "change battery" indication, I would feel perfectly safe to
have a set of non-rechargeable alkaline cells in the camera with
another set of 4 or more alkaline cells.

This should cover all the pictures you would want to take between
the U.S. and Australia.

I, of course, am not an "optimist" and would carry two "backup"
sets of four alkaline cells.

....After all, something might happen where I might like to take
lots and lots of photos and wouldn't have a source of the needed
cells.

Suppose, for example, the plane ditched in the ocean, and I and
other passengers survived it. [very unlikely actually, but "just
suppose".]

Once rescued, if rescued, my photos might be worth a lot of
money.

If my camera required 4 x 1.5 volt cells in series, I would be
carrying, on my person, 8 x 1.5 "AA" cells on my person as a
"backup".

The plane probably won't crash, so can arrive in Australia with
the alkaline cells in the camera, plus 8 cells backup. Will pay
less for them in the US than in Australia, still less if pick
them up in a "duty free"shop on the way.

For only a five day visit, I would consider having two sets of
alkaline batteries to be enough to cover most conceivable
circumstances, and I probably wouldn't even consider the
rechargeable cells or a charger for same.

If was going to stay longer, or was a migrant, would do so.

So how about rechargeable cells? Well, the choice once was
rechargeable nickel/cadmium (NiCd) cells, each of which would,
when charged, would provide 1.2 volts at 500 mAh.

To get a bit technical, if your camera requires 6 volts,
obtainable from 4 x zinc/carbon cells, how can it work on
4 NiCd cells?

Because they will also provide enough volts to operate it as they
have lower internal resistance.

Are they the latest variety of rechargeable cells? No, the
current technology uses NiMH or nickel/metal hydride cells.

Or am I getting to technical? To "boil it down", if I was a Yank
coming here for only 5 days, I probably wouldn't bother with
any sort of rechargeable cells.

Then again, I might, for NiMh are the best rechargeable cells
available to most people at the moment.

So if either a tourist or a migrant might consider rechargable
NiMh cells and a charger which could be used on both 220-240
or 110-120 volt power systems worldwide.

In my experience, an astounding number of fellow "Yanks" don't
understand basic electronic and electrical facts.

For example, suppose you have a 12 volt transistor radio which
operates on 12 volts at a few milliamps.

Can you safely operate it off a 12 volt automotive battery
which can supply several hundred amps? Sure, why not? It will
only take as much current [or amperage] as it needs.

But what happens if you connect it to a 24 volt supply? Not only
won't it work, but you might as well toss it into the nearest
waste or trash bin.

Does anyone on this group want to challenge me on this statement?

If so, why do I feel like a "German Shepard", or an "Alsatian" as
we call the breed here, using "cat language" to vocalize "Here,
kitty, kitty,kitty?

I really don't mind being "challenged" on my posts on any group.
I can usually mount an effective response if I am willing to
bother, as time permits.

In the same way that I deal with Aussie "flies" if they are
annoying me. Why bother to swat at them when can use the
rather primitive adhesive "flypaper"or an "aerosol spray"?

When you decided what to do, you might want to post on the group
initially, perhaps a bit of a "diary" on your trip to Oz.

If you cannot be bothered to do this, perhaps a post when you
return, stating what you have learned about Australia?

Also, would you consider migrating here?

I did so, decades ago, and I don't regret doing so.

Still, everyone has their own priorities.

Cheers,
Kangaroo16




























































































I'm just going to take some extra AAs with me to last
through the 5 day trip to Ayers Rock and Cairns. I'm even thinking of a
disposable underwater camera for the Reef and that should spare my
batteries even more.

This will be my first and probably last trip to Australia and New
Zealand. This old grandma can't take the long plane flights for more
than one trip. g So I'm not about to spend on an adapter that I can
only use once. I don't do e-bay to resell it.

Thanks again. I'll be back with other questions, I'm certain.

Janet

  #16  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 08:53 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
kangaroo16
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 222
Default Electricity Question

On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 12:11:37 +1000, Alan S
wrote in :

On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:47:28 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote:

AlmostBob wrote:
Hi Janet
Am an Aussie living in Canada
Just about every department store in Aus sells the same alkaline
rechargeable battery kit with a 240V charger and 4/8 batteries
Grandcell is one brandname.
brought my batteries with me, and brought a WalMart "Pure Energy" charger
kit, now have twice as many batteries and a charger for each continent, $20

watch for dropbears


thanks, what's a "dropbear"


Well, first you have to try to come to terms with the
concept that Bundaberg Rum, a product of our canefields,
uses a Polar Bear in it's advertising. An animal that is
never seen here outside a zoo:-)


Yep. At least I have never seen one here, outside of a zoo
anyway. As far as I know, no reports from any of the Antarctic
team either.:-)

Then you have to accept that the bear acts like a human
being in the ads. Just a couple of leaps of logic.


IMHO, most ads involve little if any "logic".

But then again, most humans don't require much logic in ads.

After all, is there any "logic" in a male buying a new car?

IMHO, about as much "logic" in flying "first class" on an
airline.

If it manages to get to the desired destination, the first class
passengers get to disembark first and save perhaps 10 or 15
minutes.

On the other hand, if the plane crashes, they are among the first
ones to impact on ground or sea.:-)

When I last traveled on an intercontinental flight, I watched the
stewardess demonstrate where the life jackets were, how to put
them on, and so on.

Admittedly a nice presentation, although noted that she didn't
mention the stalling speed of the aircraft I was on.

From memory, and the stalling speed would have been about
120 mph. Slow it down beyond this, and it loses lift and drops
out of the sky.

Even if the ocean is "dead calm" how long will it "float"?

In talking about "prop" planes with a slower landing speed,
perhaps a couple of hours. They usually float for an hour or so.

Lots of time to deploy the "life rafts" to ensure the "safety of
passengers."

These days, though, we rely on "raw power" and the landing speed
is closer to 120 mph. The engines will stall if dropped much
below that, and the chances even landing safely on even a
calm sea are very low.

Given the propensity of Australians and Aussie residents to
gamble, perhaps the steward or stewardess should run a "raffle"
of some sort?

After all, passengers who think that their "ass is fireproof"
don't have to play the game.

The "first prize" might be to get off the aircraft as quickly as
the crew may do, and share their life rafts. :-)

Will leave it to you to decide the second and third prizes.

Whatever you come up with, though, I would still prefer to fly
QANTAS, incoming or outgoing.

Cheers,
kangaroo16









Then: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULEQpUY_crc


Cheers, Alan, Australia

  #17  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 09:19 PM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Janet Wilder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 439
Default Electricity Question

Alan S wrote:
On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:47:28 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote:

AlmostBob wrote:
Hi Janet
Am an Aussie living in Canada
Just about every department store in Aus sells the same alkaline
rechargeable battery kit with a 240V charger and 4/8 batteries
Grandcell is one brandname.
brought my batteries with me, and brought a WalMart "Pure Energy" charger
kit, now have twice as many batteries and a charger for each continent, $20

watch for dropbears

thanks, what's a "dropbear"


Well, first you have to try to come to terms with the
concept that Bundaberg Rum, a product of our canefields,
uses a Polar Bear in it's advertising. An animal that is
never seen here outside a zoo:-)

Then you have to accept that the bear acts like a human
being in the ads. Just a couple of leaps of logic.

Then: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULEQpUY_crc


That was cute! I will definitely watch out for the "dropbears"

BTW, do they dropbears come with the good looking young men? g

--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life
  #18  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 09:20 PM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Janet Wilder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 439
Default Electricity Question

.. wrote:
On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:53:16 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote:

While I truly appreciate the help, I'm afraid I'm lost. I can use
regular over-the-counter AA batteries. The rechargeable ones are AA
batteries, too. I'm just going to take some extra AAs with me to last
through the 5 day trip to Ayers Rock and Cairns. I'm even thinking of a
disposable underwater camera for the Reef and that should spare my
batteries even more.

This will be my first and probably last trip to Australia and New
Zealand. This old grandma can't take the long plane flights for more
than one trip. g So I'm not about to spend on an adapter that I can
only use once. I don't do e-bay to resell it.

Thanks again. I'll be back with other questions, I'm certain.

Janet


Janet the dual voltage useage battery chargers I mentioned/have bought
from Radio Shack, you can use upon your return to the US. I have now
used mine for the past 4 years with no problems [except having to buy
new rechargeable batteries as the ones that came with it finally 'wore
out'].

Cath


Thanks Cath,

I'll stop in at one of them and ask for it.

Janet, in Texas, too.

--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life
  #19  
Old September 22nd, 2007, 09:39 PM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
Janet Wilder
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 439
Default Electricity Question

kangaroo16 wrote:

I should have been a bit more specific. Firstly, "AA" is a
standard international designation for an "AA" size cell.


That's good to know

snipped the techie stuff


However, "AA" cells of either type are readily available in most
parts of Australia.


If I run out, then I'll be able to purchase more. Thanks for the info.

If I were an American tourist only coming down for five days, and
had an electronic camera, which presumably gives a "low voltage"
or "change battery" indication, I would feel perfectly safe to
have a set of non-rechargeable alkaline cells in the camera with
another set of 4 or more alkaline cells.

This should cover all the pictures you would want to take between
the U.S. and Australia.


I want to take 5 days worth of pictures *in* Australia. We are doing a
cruise-tour package and the first part is a land tour from Sydney to
Ayers Rock then to Cairns then back to Sydney where we board a cruise
ship to visit Melbourne then sail over to New Zealand and go around the
whole country putting in at some of the ports.

I, of course, am not an "optimist" and would carry two "backup"
sets of four alkaline cells


...After all, something might happen where I might like to take
lots and lots of photos and wouldn't have a source of the needed
cells.


I'll bring a dozen with me, just to be safe.

Suppose, for example, the plane ditched in the ocean, and I and
other passengers survived it. [very unlikely actually, but "just
suppose".]

Once rescued, if rescued, my photos might be worth a lot of
money.


LOL!


So how about rechargeable cells? Well, the choice once was
rechargeable nickel/cadmium (NiCd) cells, each of which would,
when charged, would provide 1.2 volts at 500 mAh.


That was the subject of my OP. I have rechargeables but my recharger
won't work on Australian electricity. I'm going to check Radio Shack, as
Cath suggested for their charger.

Or am I getting to technical? To "boil it down", if I was a Yank
coming here for only 5 days, I probably wouldn't bother with
any sort of rechargeable cells.


Yes, but I am going to be on the ship for 2 weeks after that. My charger
will work for the rechargeables on the ship.


In my experience, an astounding number of fellow "Yanks" don't
understand basic electronic and electrical facts.


I certainly wouldn't judge the national population by *me*! LOL! I was
born electrically challenged. I'm also directionally challenged. The two
seem to be on the same chromosome g

When you decided what to do, you might want to post on the group
initially, perhaps a bit of a "diary" on your trip to Oz.


I shall post about the battery decision. I will not be on line during my
trip. Though Internet service will be available, I'm taking a *real*
vacation.

If you cannot be bothered to do this, perhaps a post when you
return, stating what you have learned about Australia?


I would be delight to post upon my return and share my impressions. I
get back 11 November.

Also, would you consider migrating here?


Probably not. All of our children are in the Northeast and we are way
down at the very, very tip of Texas on the border of Mexico where the
Rio Grande meets the Gulf of Mexico. The kids think we are too far away
as it is. They would disown us if we migrated.

Also, I'm not sure I can speak the language. I had to watch the dropbear
video 4 times to understand what the fellow were saying. g

I did so, decades ago, and I don't regret doing so.


Janet
--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life
  #20  
Old September 23rd, 2007, 03:42 AM posted to rec.travel.australia+nz
kangaroo16
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 222
Default Electricity Question

On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 15:39:14 -0500, Janet Wilder
wrote in
:

kangaroo16 wrote:

I should have been a bit more specific. Firstly, "AA" is a
standard international designation for an "AA" size cell.


That's good to know

snipped the techie stuff


However, "AA" cells of either type are readily available in most
parts of Australia.


If I run out, then I'll be able to purchase more. Thanks for the info.

If I were an American tourist only coming down for five days, and
had an electronic camera, which presumably gives a "low voltage"
or "change battery" indication, I would feel perfectly safe to
have a set of non-rechargeable alkaline cells in the camera with
another set of 4 or more alkaline cells.

This should cover all the pictures you would want to take between
the U.S. and Australia.


I want to take 5 days worth of pictures *in* Australia. We are doing a
cruise-tour package and the first part is a land tour from Sydney to
Ayers Rock then to Cairns then back to Sydney where we board a cruise
ship to visit Melbourne then sail over to New Zealand and go around the
whole country putting in at some of the ports.


Sounds like a great trip! Although I have never traveled on a
cruse ship, my only journey by passenger ship was long ago, from
Timor to Portuguese colony of Macao. A short ferry ride to Hong
Kong, or "Honkers" as Aussie travelers might call it. I found the
ship trip rather boring, and the water was entirely too close
for a non-swimmer.:-) I prefer air travel, actually. :-)

You will at least appreciate the size of Australia more than
those making a quick visit here.

I don't remember if have mentioned in this group that when the
Americas Cup was held off Perth a few years back that two Yanks
landed at Kingsford Smith international airport in Sydney,
cleared immigration & customs, then got into a cab and asked
to be taken to Perth.

The driver laughed and suggested that it would be quicker,
easier & cheaper to go by air. One of the yanks reportedly
looked at the driver with a puzzled expression and asked
"Why?, it's just across the island isn't it?"

True, in a sense, but it is a damn big island continent, almost
as large as the continental USA. Apparently they either hadn't
bothered to look at globe or a world map, and if they just looked
a map of Australia they didn't bother to check the scale.

Sydney to Perth by air is 4110 kilometers [2552 miles] and
travel time around 4 hours. By coach (bus) 56 hours. By
rail, 65 hours. Travel time by sea not available.

http://www.events.australia.com/Plan...Distances.aspx

I don't remember what the Sydney Taxi fares were at the time, but
current fares a
Hiring Charges: $3.00
Distance Rate:
Tariff 1: $1.79 per kilometre Between 6 a.m. and 10 p.m. daily.
Tariff 2: Tariff 1 + 20% Between 10 p.m. and 6 a.m. daily
Toll and ferry Charges: The hirer must pay all road,
bridge, ferry, tunnel and airport tolls that apply to the
journey.

http://www.taxiscombined.com.au/current_fares.htm


I, of course, am not an "optimist" and would carry two "backup"
sets of four alkaline cells


...After all, something might happen where I might like to take
lots and lots of photos and wouldn't have a source of the needed
cells.


I'll bring a dozen with me, just to be safe.

Suppose, for example, the plane ditched in the ocean, and I and
other passengers survived it. [very unlikely actually, but "just
suppose".]

Once rescued, if rescued, my photos might be worth a lot of
money.


LOL!


So how about rechargeable cells? Well, the choice once was
rechargeable nickel/cadmium (NiCd) cells, each of which would,
when charged, would provide 1.2 volts at 500 mAh.


That was the subject of my OP. I have rechargeables but my recharger
won't work on Australian electricity. I'm going to check Radio Shack, as
Cath suggested for their charger.


When I upgraded from Ni-Cad cells to NiMh about a year ago,
bought a 240 volt charger for four AA nickel metal hydride cells,
complete with 4 cells. From memory paid A$ 27 for it. NiMH
charge a lot quicker than nicads.

Radio Shack usually a pretty good source for such items. Might
be a good idea to ask them to check it on 240 volts before
purchasing it in store or having it sent to you.

Radio Shack operates here under the name of
"Tandy Electronics", actually owned by Woolworth's
Pty./Ltd. No connection with Woolworth's chain in the USA,
though. Doubt that they would honor a US guarantee.

If you want some good shots of Sydney and have time to do it
a trip to the top of Centre Point Tower observation deck might be
worthwhile.
-------

"Here's a tip to all the tourists coming to Sydney,
Australia.. Center Point tower is 300m tall and has the best 360º
views of Sydney. You could pay $23 to visit the tourist platform
OR take the free lift to the 360º bar and relax enjoy a cocktail
in comfort AND the view for only $14 "
http://www.flickr.com/photos/goz/119293715/

Lots of links from this site but I haven't explored them. The
site opens with interior photo of the bar.

A page with a better opening view of top of tower, bridge,
harbour, opera house, etc. at:
http://www.sydneytoweroztrek.com.au/

A quote from the "skywalk" link
Skywalk is Sydney’s newest and highest open air attraction -
Dare to step out over the edge!
Enjoy 360-degree open air views of Sydney Australia from the roof
of Sydney Tower, a breathtaking 260 metres above Sydney.
Harnessed onto a moving, glass-floored viewing platform that
extends out over the edge of the golden turret of Sydney Tower,
you can view Sydney beneath your feet from a whole new
perspective! With an adrenalin rush you can enjoy spectacular
views of all Sydney landmarks including the Sydney Harbour
Bridge, Sydney Opera House, Sydney Harbour, and the best views
all the way to the Blue Mountains.
http://www.skywalk.com.au/

There is also a tour where tourists can climb the Sydney
Harbour Bridge, but it is more expensive than the tower,
and as you can see from the photo links, the bridge is
nowhere near as high.

Or am I getting to technical? To "boil it down", if I was a Yank
coming here for only 5 days, I probably wouldn't bother with
any sort of rechargeable cells.


Yes, but I am going to be on the ship for 2 weeks after that. My charger
will work for the rechargeables on the ship.


In my experience, an astounding number of fellow "Yanks" don't
understand basic electronic and electrical facts.


I certainly wouldn't judge the national population by *me*! LOL! I was
born electrically challenged. I'm also directionally challenged. The two
seem to be on the same chromosome g

When you decided what to do, you might want to post on the group
initially, perhaps a bit of a "diary" on your trip to Oz.


I shall post about the battery decision. I will not be on line during my
trip. Though Internet service will be available, I'm taking a *real*
vacation.


You mean that you can go that long without e-mail? :-) Libraries
often have free public computers, can't you at least
let us know when you have arrived. :-)

Actually writing these words reminds me of a good
joke, but too long to post here. See
The Executive
sent by Dave of New York at following link.
http://www.tgifjoke.com/stranded-executive.html


If you cannot be bothered to do this, perhaps a post when you
return, stating what you have learned about Australia?


I would be delight to post upon my return and share my impressions. I
get back 11 November.


Looking forward to it. As it is getting into summer here, expect
warm or even hot weather. An nylon windcheater with parka could
be needed for occasional rainstorm.

You might like to check monthly climate and weather data for
various locations, there is plenty of info on Google.

The sunlight in Australia is more intense than anywhere in the
US, with lots of ultraviolet, so sunglasses are highly
recommended as well as high protection factor sun block cream,
especially if on a beach anywhere.

On my early journeys used a good 35 mm camera. Unfortunately,
seldom bothered to jot down notes as to time date location of
photos. Same for keeping a daily diary. Just became too much
trouble.

So something you might consider bringing is a pocket tape
recorder using standard tape cassettes so you can dictate
notes as go along. That is, if you can find one that uses
standard cassettes.

Most of the newer ones use mini-cassettes, or are totally
electronic. Mini cassettes can be hard to find out of the major
cities, and standard cassettes offer longer recording time
than mini-cassettes.

A couple of things that would urge all travelers and tourists
to carry would be as good torch ("flashlight") and if interested
in nature, a good hand lens.

For the torch, I would recommend the high quality Minimaglite,
the size that uses 2 "AA" cells. Is machined from aircraft
aluminum, waterproof, focussing head, spare bulb in base.
Not only useful at night, but very useful if get a power failure
where you are staying. :-)

For the magnifying lens, the small pocket one with three fold out
lenses used by biology and zoology students. Single or
combination gives you from 5x to 15x.

I don't know much about electronic cameras, but on my
35 mm film camera had a f1.8 50 mm lens, auxiliary close up
lenses and filters.

Australian flowering plants tend to be much more striking than
most plants in the US, and some very unusual animals and insects.

Of course, some insects don't really require a hand lens, such
as the
"titan stick insect (Acrophylla titan), in Dee Why
(suburban Sydney"

Tourists suffering from jet lag after a long flight from US or
UK, ...or those who have tried Aussie beer for the first time...,
probably wouldn't believe their eyes if ran across one.

" Its length, from the tip of the abdomen to the end of its
front legs was an astonishing 42cm (16.5 inches). Length from its
head to the end of its abdomen would have been approximately 25cm
(almost 10 inches)

To give you a better idea of how big that is, here's how it would
look beside some familiar objects - a CD, Zip disk and a pencil."

http://www.mdavid.com.au/insect/insect.html

No matter how much research you have done on your trip to
Australia, I would almost guarantee quite a few surprises. A
photo of you holding one would be a great conversation starter
in the USA when you return. They are harmless, incidentally.

Don't pick up any snakes, most are poisonous. Or Sydney
Funnel Web spiders, as their fangs can penetrate a fingernail.
Or any "redbacks" which are closely related to US "black widow".
Or the small cute blue ringed octpus commonly found in tidal
pools.

They are found around all Australian beaches.

"A Blue Ringed Octopus was not even known to be dangerous
until 1954. It all started in Darwin when a young sailor started
to head back to shore after going spear fishing with a friend. He
placed the blue ringed octopus on his shoulder for a few minutes.
He did not realise that he had been bitten. Shortly afterwards
his mouth became dry and he found it difficult to breathe. This
was followed by nausea and vomiting. He was immediately taken to
the Darwin hospital. He stopped breathing, many resuscitation
attempts were made, but all failed. After his death a tiny mark
was found on his shoulder."

As Sydney has been settled since 1788, it is a wonder to me
that there were no earlier fatalities recorded. Perhaps most
people had sense enough not to pick up strange creatures.:-)

"Following the loss of the American Colonies, Britain
needed to find alternative destinations that could take the
population of its overcrowded prisons. They were full mainly due
to the unemployment created by the Industrial Revolution[citation
needed]. Sir Joseph Banks, the eminent scientist who had
accompanied Captain James Cook on his 1770 voyage, recommended
Botany Bay as a suitable site. In 1787, the First Fleet of 11
ships and about 1305 people (736 convicts, 211 marines, 17
convicts' children, 27 marines' wives, 14 marines' children and
about 300 officers and others) under the command of Captain
Arthur Phillip set sail for Botany Bay.[1] On arrival, Botany Bay
was considered unsuitable and on January 26, 1788—a date now
celebrated as Australia Day—a landing was made at the nearby
Sydney Cove. Phillip named the settlement after Thomas Townshend,
1st Baron Sydney (Viscount Sydney from 1789), the Home Secretary.
The new colony was formally proclaimed as the Colony of New South
Wales on February 7."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...lia_(1788-1850)

So Australians are pleased by the outcome of the Revolutionary
War and American Independence. Otherwise Australia probably
would have been claimed and settled by the French, Dutch, or
others. :-)

" Sydney Funnel Web spiders are found 160 kilometers from
the centre Sydney. Their favourite places to hide are in
clothing, equipment that is stored in a garage, any type of shed,
sandpits and also in pools."

http://www.usq.edu.au/users/weppner/...web_spider.htm

I might add that it sometimes invades houses and hides in shoes.
In general, a good idea to shake out your shoes before putting
them on in the morning.

Also, would you consider migrating here?


Probably not. All of our children are in the Northeast and we are way
down at the very, very tip of Texas on the border of Mexico where the
Rio Grande meets the Gulf of Mexico. The kids think we are too far away
as it is. They would disown us if we migrated.

Also, I'm not sure I can speak the language. I had to watch the dropbear
video 4 times to understand what the fellow were saying. g

I did so, decades ago, and I don't regret doing so.


Janet


Perhaps you will change your mind after visiting Australia.
....At least your kids won't ask you to fly up and babysit for
them. :-)

This post is probably getting a bit long, but possibly you and
other readers will find some interesting info in it. Both this
group and misc.immigration.Australia + NZ strike me as very
slow groups, with few daily posts on either.

Cheers,
Kangaroo16
 




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