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Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?



 
 
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  #21  
Old July 22nd, 2004, 03:42 PM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...


Tchiowa kirjoitti:



Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...




Mark Pannell kirjoitti:





doesnt matter where the boarding pass is issued. Did it last month. You just
go through immigration and security as normal except you dont have to check
in.







Easy to believe. How do you "double check". Your file already resides in
the database. Changes to it are hardly generated at any airport just
because you have been outside the transit area. How does the personnel
at counters know whether you have been out or not. Tiotsiiva's friends
at the passport control escort you there?




If you leave the transit area then you return through the Immigration
counter and they can see that the boarding pass was issued somewhere
else. That shouldn't happen if you checked in at the local airport.





Heh heh. I have here one boarding pass/instapkaart (KLM) in hand. There
is no printed piece of information on it where it is "issued".



I see. So the original point of embarkation isn't there? It must be if
this is a direct flight. If not a direct flight, it will be marked
where it was issued and the original ticket stub will be attached. And
it will likely be physically different in appearance if issued in
Singapore rather than somewhere else.


Bull. Folks have appeared in here to tell you by their first hand
experience that it is not as you say. It is true that this boarding pass
of mine has nothing to do with Singapore. But is a direct flight (as you
assume) from AMS to HEL (I was changing planes after a direct flight
from MEX to AMS).

So, those who fly by one flight code (hardly available) from MEX via
AMS to HEL, will be routinely re-checked if they leave the transit area
at Schiphol while those who get their two boarding passes for a flight
from MEX to AMS and for another flight from AMS to HEL both at Mexico
City airport won't be checked ? Is this anyhow reasonable ?

For the shakes of security it is all different if KLM records show that
I have two pieces of boarding passes printed at one location from the
records which indicate that I have one boarding pass printed at the same
location (and for the same route) ?
  #22  
Old July 22nd, 2004, 03:42 PM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...


Tchiowa kirjoitti:



Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...




Mark Pannell kirjoitti:





doesnt matter where the boarding pass is issued. Did it last month. You just
go through immigration and security as normal except you dont have to check
in.







Easy to believe. How do you "double check". Your file already resides in
the database. Changes to it are hardly generated at any airport just
because you have been outside the transit area. How does the personnel
at counters know whether you have been out or not. Tiotsiiva's friends
at the passport control escort you there?




If you leave the transit area then you return through the Immigration
counter and they can see that the boarding pass was issued somewhere
else. That shouldn't happen if you checked in at the local airport.





Heh heh. I have here one boarding pass/instapkaart (KLM) in hand. There
is no printed piece of information on it where it is "issued".



I see. So the original point of embarkation isn't there? It must be if
this is a direct flight. If not a direct flight, it will be marked
where it was issued and the original ticket stub will be attached. And
it will likely be physically different in appearance if issued in
Singapore rather than somewhere else.


Bull. Folks have appeared in here to tell you by their first hand
experience that it is not as you say. It is true that this boarding pass
of mine has nothing to do with Singapore. But is a direct flight (as you
assume) from AMS to HEL (I was changing planes after a direct flight
from MEX to AMS).

So, those who fly by one flight code (hardly available) from MEX via
AMS to HEL, will be routinely re-checked if they leave the transit area
at Schiphol while those who get their two boarding passes for a flight
from MEX to AMS and for another flight from AMS to HEL both at Mexico
City airport won't be checked ? Is this anyhow reasonable ?

For the shakes of security it is all different if KLM records show that
I have two pieces of boarding passes printed at one location from the
records which indicate that I have one boarding pass printed at the same
location (and for the same route) ?
  #23  
Old July 22nd, 2004, 08:31 PM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...


Tchiowa kirjoitti:





I see. So the original point of embarkation isn't there? It must be if
this is a direct flight. If not a direct flight, it will be marked
where it was issued and the original ticket stub will be attached. And
it will likely be physically different in appearance if issued in
Singapore rather than somewhere else.



Bull. Folks have appeared in here to tell you by their first hand
experience that it is not as you say.





We were talking about the re-check in procedure you say has been
introduced at Changi since autumn 2001.

Who has said that the boarding pass is not identifiable? Other than
you?



It is true that this boarding pass
of mine has nothing to do with Singapore. But is a direct flight (as you
assume) from AMS to HEL (I was changing planes after a direct flight
from MEX to AMS).



If it is a direct flight then you have one and only one boarding pass.
It will be separated into the pass and your stub when you board the
first time. It will be rather obvious to Immigration in Singapore if
you show that stub rather than the full boarding pass.

If you have connecting flights then the second boarding pass is
clearly marked as to where it can from.



You have been told

So, those who fly by one flight code (hardly available) from MEX via
AMS to HEL, will be routinely re-checked if they leave the transit area
at Schiphol while those who get their two boarding passes for a flight
from MEX to AMS and for another flight from AMS to HEL both at Mexico
City airport won't be checked ? Is this anyhow reasonable ?



Read above. Both will be checked when they enter Immigration. You
*MUST* show your boarding pass.



For the shakes of security it is all different if KLM records show that
I have two pieces of boarding passes printed at one location from the
records which indicate that I have one boarding pass printed at the same
location (and for the same route) ?



Immigration will not look at the KLM record. They will look at the
piece of paper you have. If they have questions or problems with it
then they may look at airline records. If the record shows you left
baggage in the transit area while you actually left transit you will
be checked.


Left baggage in the transit area while you are somewhere else... you
will be checked? I don't follow. Where in the transit area you leave
your luggage when you are going to town?
  #24  
Old July 23rd, 2004, 05:34 PM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...


Tchiowa kirjoitti:






Immigration will not look at the KLM record. They will look at the
piece of paper you have. If they have questions or problems with it
then they may look at airline records. If the record shows you left
baggage in the transit area while you actually left transit you will
be checked.




Left baggage in the transit area while you are somewhere else... you
will be checked? I don't follow. Where in the transit area you leave
your luggage when you are going to town?



Have you been following the thread at all????? The statement was that
someone who was checked through to a destination beyond Singapore
could leave the airport even though he had checked baggage through.

That is what causes the problem. The checked baggage.


Why checked luggage causes any problems? One is travelling from point A
to point B by plane x and further by plane y (which may be plane x as
well) to point C. His (at point A security checked) luggage is moved by
ground personnel from plane x by carts to terminal in which it is sorted
and later loaded to the cargo of plane y (this will be done only in the
case planes y and x are two and different planes). As far as I know this
process is fully independent from the decision whether the owner of the
luggage leaves the transit area or not. At least you have said the
following:

************************************************** **************************

True. But if you don't know Singapore you're not going to see much
before you have to go back. And you'll have to check your luggage to
Singapore and retrieve it. Yes, you can leave it at the airport, but
you'll have to retrieve it, pay for the storage, then check it again
when you go back.

************************************************** ***************************

1. One can check the luggage at point A to point C (beyond Singapore)
if he decided not to leave the Changi (point B) airport ?

2. If he decided differently he should inform the check in staff at point A
that luggage is to be checked only to Changi because you are willing to
do some sightseeing in Singapore ? You will then physically collect your
luggage at the Changi arrivals and while in Singapore it will be
stored in
a location of your own decision and when it is time to go back to the
transit area you get your luggage and check it to your destination ?

Do I read you at all ? If so:

What about the staff at point A refuse to do so (as they very well might
do) and will clear your luggage all the way to point C no matter how
much you may protest against it ?

Hopefully you had it all differently in your mind and I am just confused
here. I admit, this above mentioned scenario is all crazy. I just get
such an impression for some reason.
  #25  
Old July 23rd, 2004, 05:34 PM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...


Tchiowa kirjoitti:






Immigration will not look at the KLM record. They will look at the
piece of paper you have. If they have questions or problems with it
then they may look at airline records. If the record shows you left
baggage in the transit area while you actually left transit you will
be checked.




Left baggage in the transit area while you are somewhere else... you
will be checked? I don't follow. Where in the transit area you leave
your luggage when you are going to town?



Have you been following the thread at all????? The statement was that
someone who was checked through to a destination beyond Singapore
could leave the airport even though he had checked baggage through.

That is what causes the problem. The checked baggage.


Why checked luggage causes any problems? One is travelling from point A
to point B by plane x and further by plane y (which may be plane x as
well) to point C. His (at point A security checked) luggage is moved by
ground personnel from plane x by carts to terminal in which it is sorted
and later loaded to the cargo of plane y (this will be done only in the
case planes y and x are two and different planes). As far as I know this
process is fully independent from the decision whether the owner of the
luggage leaves the transit area or not. At least you have said the
following:

************************************************** **************************

True. But if you don't know Singapore you're not going to see much
before you have to go back. And you'll have to check your luggage to
Singapore and retrieve it. Yes, you can leave it at the airport, but
you'll have to retrieve it, pay for the storage, then check it again
when you go back.

************************************************** ***************************

1. One can check the luggage at point A to point C (beyond Singapore)
if he decided not to leave the Changi (point B) airport ?

2. If he decided differently he should inform the check in staff at point A
that luggage is to be checked only to Changi because you are willing to
do some sightseeing in Singapore ? You will then physically collect your
luggage at the Changi arrivals and while in Singapore it will be
stored in
a location of your own decision and when it is time to go back to the
transit area you get your luggage and check it to your destination ?

Do I read you at all ? If so:

What about the staff at point A refuse to do so (as they very well might
do) and will clear your luggage all the way to point C no matter how
much you may protest against it ?

Hopefully you had it all differently in your mind and I am just confused
here. I admit, this above mentioned scenario is all crazy. I just get
such an impression for some reason.
  #26  
Old July 25th, 2004, 06:53 AM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:


allowed. If you have checked your baggage all the way through and then
decide to leave the airport you are obligated to inform the airline
and collect your baggage. If you want to leave it at a "left luggage"


I am convinced that this is not the case. Perhaps the airport authority
has questioned you for some reason and then you have reasoned this
misleading concept. I have flown to Changi only once (outbound 1 1/2
weeks before the bedouin attacks in the USA) and never afterwards and
during this one time the airport was the final post to me. So I cannot
tell for sure. However, I don't see ANY reason based on security
concerns, why this restriction had been introduced at Changi. Moreover,
you say that one is ***obliged*** to do this and yet there are some
other chaps around who have said as their most recent experience that
this is not the case. It is easy to believe them. And it is very
difficult to believe you.

I have left the transit area many, many times like this and I have NEVER
informed the check in and I have never been forced to collect the
luggage from the internal stores (in which only a well defined staff
ought to have access). I don't see any reason for this either. And it
should be pretty expensive also to get the luggage exclusively on
conveyors well after all the other luggage of the same flight have
ridden on it.

For instance when I visited Amsterdam City two times as a transit
passenger lately, I was not obliged to do these things and frankly, it
has never occured to me that it could possibly be as you insist. And it
isn't.

So, anyone having enough time and interest to visit Singapore while in
transit, there should be little reason not to do so. My piece of advice
is that those folks don't pay any attention whatsoever to this "set of
new rules" you insist being in force at Changi.

site you must do so outside of transit (because you can't get your
luggage while still inside transit).



This ought to be about trivial.
  #27  
Old July 25th, 2004, 06:53 AM
Markku Grönroos
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Tchiowa kirjoitti:


allowed. If you have checked your baggage all the way through and then
decide to leave the airport you are obligated to inform the airline
and collect your baggage. If you want to leave it at a "left luggage"


I am convinced that this is not the case. Perhaps the airport authority
has questioned you for some reason and then you have reasoned this
misleading concept. I have flown to Changi only once (outbound 1 1/2
weeks before the bedouin attacks in the USA) and never afterwards and
during this one time the airport was the final post to me. So I cannot
tell for sure. However, I don't see ANY reason based on security
concerns, why this restriction had been introduced at Changi. Moreover,
you say that one is ***obliged*** to do this and yet there are some
other chaps around who have said as their most recent experience that
this is not the case. It is easy to believe them. And it is very
difficult to believe you.

I have left the transit area many, many times like this and I have NEVER
informed the check in and I have never been forced to collect the
luggage from the internal stores (in which only a well defined staff
ought to have access). I don't see any reason for this either. And it
should be pretty expensive also to get the luggage exclusively on
conveyors well after all the other luggage of the same flight have
ridden on it.

For instance when I visited Amsterdam City two times as a transit
passenger lately, I was not obliged to do these things and frankly, it
has never occured to me that it could possibly be as you insist. And it
isn't.

So, anyone having enough time and interest to visit Singapore while in
transit, there should be little reason not to do so. My piece of advice
is that those folks don't pay any attention whatsoever to this "set of
new rules" you insist being in force at Changi.

site you must do so outside of transit (because you can't get your
luggage while still inside transit).



This ought to be about trivial.
  #28  
Old July 26th, 2004, 02:45 PM
Tchiowa
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...
Tchiowa kirjoitti:


allowed. If you have checked your baggage all the way through and then
decide to leave the airport you are obligated to inform the airline
and collect your baggage. If you want to leave it at a "left luggage"


I am convinced that this is not the case.


You can be "convinced" all you'd like. I know for a fact this is the
case.

Perhaps the airport authority
has questioned you for some reason and then you have reasoned this
misleading concept.


The airport authority in Singapore has never questioned me about this.
But I know people who have been stopped. And I checked with corporate
travel and they cited the rules.

I have flown to Changi only once (outbound 1 1/2
weeks before the bedouin attacks in the USA) and never afterwards and
during this one time the airport was the final post to me.


Rules changed after 9/11. There was a lot of sloppy enforcement of
security before then. Things have changed.

So I cannot
tell for sure. However, I don't see ANY reason based on security
concerns, why this restriction had been introduced at Changi.


Hmmm. You don't see any reason why they would not want you flying
somewhere, then leaving the airport, possibly not returning, and
leaving luggage in the secure area in transit?

Moreover,
you say that one is ***obliged*** to do this and yet there are some
other chaps around who have said as their most recent experience that
this is not the case. It is easy to believe them. And it is very
difficult to believe you.


You have a hard time believing me because you've made a number of
wrong statements over time and I've proven you wrong. You particularly
are offended by the fact that I pointed out some blatantly racist
statements you made (insulting remarks and name-calling of Jews,
remember?).

I don't recall a single person saying that he had bought a connecting
flight ticket, checked luggage through, left the airport at an
intermediate stop, and then was told "No Problem!". They may not have
been stopped, but they can be. And should be.

I have left the transit area many, many times like this


"many, many times"??? Interesting, since you just said that you
transited Singapore exactly ONCE!
  #29  
Old July 26th, 2004, 02:45 PM
Tchiowa
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

Markku Grönroos wrote in message ...
Tchiowa kirjoitti:


allowed. If you have checked your baggage all the way through and then
decide to leave the airport you are obligated to inform the airline
and collect your baggage. If you want to leave it at a "left luggage"


I am convinced that this is not the case.


You can be "convinced" all you'd like. I know for a fact this is the
case.

Perhaps the airport authority
has questioned you for some reason and then you have reasoned this
misleading concept.


The airport authority in Singapore has never questioned me about this.
But I know people who have been stopped. And I checked with corporate
travel and they cited the rules.

I have flown to Changi only once (outbound 1 1/2
weeks before the bedouin attacks in the USA) and never afterwards and
during this one time the airport was the final post to me.


Rules changed after 9/11. There was a lot of sloppy enforcement of
security before then. Things have changed.

So I cannot
tell for sure. However, I don't see ANY reason based on security
concerns, why this restriction had been introduced at Changi.


Hmmm. You don't see any reason why they would not want you flying
somewhere, then leaving the airport, possibly not returning, and
leaving luggage in the secure area in transit?

Moreover,
you say that one is ***obliged*** to do this and yet there are some
other chaps around who have said as their most recent experience that
this is not the case. It is easy to believe them. And it is very
difficult to believe you.


You have a hard time believing me because you've made a number of
wrong statements over time and I've proven you wrong. You particularly
are offended by the fact that I pointed out some blatantly racist
statements you made (insulting remarks and name-calling of Jews,
remember?).

I don't recall a single person saying that he had bought a connecting
flight ticket, checked luggage through, left the airport at an
intermediate stop, and then was told "No Problem!". They may not have
been stopped, but they can be. And should be.

I have left the transit area many, many times like this


"many, many times"??? Interesting, since you just said that you
transited Singapore exactly ONCE!
  #30  
Old July 26th, 2004, 03:42 PM
Mark Pannell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Singapore - 6 hrs to kill in airport- any bus trips?

It is not the case!.I have done it numerous times on the way to different
destinations.
"Tchiowa" wrote in message
om...
Markku Grönroos wrote in message
...
Tchiowa kirjoitti:


allowed. If you have checked your baggage all the way through and then
decide to leave the airport you are obligated to inform the airline
and collect your baggage. If you want to leave it at a "left luggage"


I am convinced that this is not the case.


You can be "convinced" all you'd like. I know for a fact this is the
case.

Perhaps the airport authority
has questioned you for some reason and then you have reasoned this
misleading concept.


The airport authority in Singapore has never questioned me about this.
But I know people who have been stopped. And I checked with corporate
travel and they cited the rules.

I have flown to Changi only once (outbound 1 1/2
weeks before the bedouin attacks in the USA) and never afterwards and
during this one time the airport was the final post to me.


Rules changed after 9/11. There was a lot of sloppy enforcement of
security before then. Things have changed.

So I cannot
tell for sure. However, I don't see ANY reason based on security
concerns, why this restriction had been introduced at Changi.


Hmmm. You don't see any reason why they would not want you flying
somewhere, then leaving the airport, possibly not returning, and
leaving luggage in the secure area in transit?

Moreover,
you say that one is ***obliged*** to do this and yet there are some
other chaps around who have said as their most recent experience that
this is not the case. It is easy to believe them. And it is very
difficult to believe you.


You have a hard time believing me because you've made a number of
wrong statements over time and I've proven you wrong. You particularly
are offended by the fact that I pointed out some blatantly racist
statements you made (insulting remarks and name-calling of Jews,
remember?).

I don't recall a single person saying that he had bought a connecting
flight ticket, checked luggage through, left the airport at an
intermediate stop, and then was told "No Problem!". They may not have
been stopped, but they can be. And should be.

I have left the transit area many, many times like this


"many, many times"??? Interesting, since you just said that you
transited Singapore exactly ONCE!



 




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