No (French) Survivors Reported in Egyptian Crash

We will see, but it has the earmarks.

Earl

**


No Survivors Reported in Egyptian Crash

12 minutes ago

By MOHAMED KHALIFA, Associated Press Writer

CAIRO, Egypt - A charter airliner carrying 148 people ‹ mostly French
tourists ‹ crashed into the Red Sea on Saturday shortly after taking off
from the resort of Sharm el-Sheikh, officials said. No survivors were
reported.


The military sent helicopters and small patrol boats into an area full of
floating suitcases and other debris to search for survivors. One body was
recovered and a marine official in a nearby port said at least 50 body parts
were retrieved.

The Boeing 737 jet, which disappeared from radar after it took off shortly
before 5 a.m., was headed to Cairo for a crew change before continuing to
Paris. No distress call was made, airport officials said on customary
condition of anonymity.

The crash occurred amid a week of heightened concerns about terrorist
threats from the air that have led to increased security and canceled
flights around the world. But Egypt's Civil Aviation Ministry called the
crash an "accident" that may have been caused by a mechanical problem.

Family members waiting to pick up their loved ones at Charles de Gaulle
early Saturday were pulled aside by airport authorities and taken by shuttle
bus to a hotel near the airport. There, they learned the fate of flight.

"Up until now, the cause is a technical one," Minister of Civil Aviation
Ahmed Shafeeq later told state-run Egyptian television. "There was a
malfunction that made it difficult for the crew to ... save the plane."

France's deputy transportation minister, Dominique Bussereau, said Saturday
that the flight had a problem on takeoff and crashed when it tried to turn
back. He spoke during a press conference at Charles de Gaulle airport, where
the flight had been scheduled to arrive at 9 a.m.

A French Embassy official in Cairo, speaking on condition of anonymity, told
The Associated Press that he had a list of people aboard that showed 134
French tourists, one Moroccan tourist and 13 crew members.

Airport officials earlier said there were 135 passengers and six crew
members. The trip was organized by FRAM, one of France's biggest tour
operators.

Looking pale and shaken, a couple in their 50s arrived at the Charles de
Gaulle terminal early Saturday. The man asked an airport official: "My
children are at Sharm. How do I find out if they were on the plane?"

The couple was then taken to the crisis center.

French authorities will help Egypt "in order to shed light as quickly as
possible on this catastrophe that has plunged our country into mourning,"
Prime Minister Jean-Pierre Raffarin said in a statement.

French anti-terrorism authorities in Paris said they did not expect to open
an investigation because the crash appeared to have been an accident.

Air Flash, which operated the airliner, said in a statement that the
wreckage was found about nine miles from the airport, according to the
Egyptian news agency MENA. Engineers from the national carrier EgyptAir were
helping to determine what happened.

Air Flash said the 737 was one of just two it owned. The company said it has
been in business for six years, but provided few other details in its
statement carried by MENA.

At the airline's offices in Cairo, about 20 people had gathered, including
weeping relatives of crew members and some journalists.

The weather was clear in Sharm el-Sheikh, 300 miles southeast of Cairo on
the Sinai peninsula, and other flights were taking off without incident,
officials said.

The Boeing 737 had flown in early Saturday from Milan, Italy, dropping off
passengers in Sharm el-Sheikh, the airline said. New passengers then boarded
for the flight to Paris via Cairo.

The airplane received its maintenance checks in Norway and the most recent
one showed no problems, the airline said.

French President Jacques Chirac phoned Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak (
news -web sites ) to discuss the crash, MENA said.

Sharm el-Sheik is a popular Red Sea tourist resort that also frequently
hosts major political and economic summits. Egypt has held several meetings
on Middle East peace there, including one in which President Bush ( news
-web sites ) met with regional leaders in June over the "road map" plan
toward creating a Palestinian state.

British Prime Minister Tony Blair ( news -web sites ) was vacationing at the
resort, but a spokeswoman at his office in London said neither Blair nor any
members of his family were aboard the Air Flash plane.

Egypt's last major airline disaster occurred in 1999, when an EgyptAir
jetliner crashed shortly after leaving New York en route to Cairo, killing
all 217 people aboard.

Earl Evleth wrote:

By MOHAMED KHALIFA, Associated Press Writer

The crash occurred amid a week of heightened concerns about terrorist
threats from the air that have led to increased security and canceled
flights around the world. But Egypt's Civil Aviation Ministry called the
crash an "accident" that may have been caused by a mechanical problem.

Experts on the radio this morning have been saying that while that's
quite possible, they don't know how this conclusion can be arrived at
yet.

[]
Egypt's last major airline disaster occurred in 1999, when an EgyptAir
jetliner crashed shortly after leaving New York en route to Cairo, killing
all 217 people aboard.

And of course, the cause of this flight has never been determined, has
it? I thought there was strong suspicion one of the co-pilots crashed
the plane? Meanwhile, the Egyptian autorities are adamant this isn't
true- well they would be, wouldn't they?

David

(I took the same flight number between JFK-CAI about 8 months before
that flight- different plane though.)

--
David Horne- (website under reconstruction)
davidhorne (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk

On 3/01/04 13:38, in article
1g6zkbf.1lxje8u16k65kwN%this_address_is_for_spam@y ahoo.co.uk, "David Horne"
wrote:

And of course, the cause of this flight has never been determined, has
it? I thought there was strong suspicion one of the co-pilots crashed
the plane? Meanwhile, the Egyptian autorities are adamant this isn't
true- well they would be, wouldn't they?

David

(I took the same flight number between JFK-CAI about 8 months before
that flight- different plane though.)



Everything I have read indicates that JFK Egyptian flight was an
individual act on the part of the co-pilot, a sort of suicide.

Since the suicide rates in Egypt are -0-, Egyptians can`t
bring themselves to believe this version. It is against the Koran
so it doesn`t happen.

Earl

Earl Evleth wrote:

On 3/01/04 13:38, in article
1g6zkbf.1lxje8u16k65kwN%this_address_is_for_spam@y ahoo.co.uk, "David Horne"
wrote:

And of course, the cause of this flight has never been determined, has
it? I thought there was strong suspicion one of the co-pilots crashed
the plane? Meanwhile, the Egyptian autorities are adamant this isn't
true- well they would be, wouldn't they?

David

(I took the same flight number between JFK-CAI about 8 months before
that flight- different plane though.)



Everything I have read indicates that JFK Egyptian flight was an
individual act on the part of the co-pilot, a sort of suicide.

Yes, that's what I've read, but it's also been suggested that he could
have been pressured into it- that harm would have happened to his family
if he didn't do this. There were a lot of Egyptian military officials on
the plane IIRC- which could be a possible motive. There were also a lot
of travellers who had booked through the company my partner used to work
at in Boston (Grand Circle Travel)- it was a dreadful time for people at
the company then.

David

--
David Horne- (website under reconstruction)
davidhorne (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk

In article
1g6zkbf.1lxje8u16k65kwN%this_address_is_for_spam@ yahoo.co.uk,
(David Horne) wrote:

Earl Evleth wrote:

By MOHAMED KHALIFA, Associated Press Writer

The crash occurred amid a week of heightened concerns about terrorist
threats from the air that have led to increased security and canceled
flights around the world. But Egypt's Civil Aviation Ministry called the
crash an "accident" that may have been caused by a mechanical problem.

Experts on the radio this morning have been saying that while that's
quite possible, they don't know how this conclusion can be arrived at
yet.

[]
Egypt's last major airline disaster occurred in 1999, when an EgyptAir
jetliner crashed shortly after leaving New York en route to Cairo, killing
all 217 people aboard.

And of course, the cause of this flight has never been determined, has
it? I thought there was strong suspicion one of the co-pilots crashed
the plane? Meanwhile, the Egyptian autorities are adamant this isn't
true- well they would be, wouldn't they?

the cause of that crash was quite reliably determined to be the co-pilot
-- no one except 'officially' the Egyptian government doubts it -- and
privately they don't even doubt it

Jenn wrote:

In article
1g6zkbf.1lxje8u16k65kwN%this_address_is_for_spam@ yahoo.co.uk,
(David Horne) wrote:

And of course, the cause of this flight has never been determined, has
it? I thought there was strong suspicion one of the co-pilots crashed
the plane? Meanwhile, the Egyptian autorities are adamant this isn't
true- well they would be, wouldn't they?

the cause of that crash was quite reliably determined to be the co-pilot
-- no one except 'officially' the Egyptian government doubts it -- and
privately they don't even doubt it

It doesn't get round the fact it's never officially been determined. I
think it's important it is.

David

--
David Horne- (website under reconstruction)
davidhorne (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk

The FLASH airline company still advertises on it's website www.flashtour.com
that it has two Boeing 737-300 and they have "the objective to satisfy fully
the client needs. Safety and reliability are the motto of the company."
I also read that SWISS aviation authorities had some doubts about the air
safety of one of these planes some time ago and prohibited the company from
flying into Switzerland. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3366605.stm
If this really is a case of a poorly maintained aircraft, then what a wicked
wicked way to run a transport company. And I wonder what the Paris
authorities may say about granting approval for Flash to use it's airspace
and airports ?

On 4/01/04 12:00, in article , "Nige"
wrote:

And I wonder what the Paris
authorities may say about granting approval for Flash to use it's airspace
and airports ?


French TV news last night had an interview of somebody working for the
French charter service who said she had never heard of Flash.

However, the flight was scheduled to be coming from Egypt to France
so must have had French official approval.

More of this will develop in the next few days. Dodging responsibility
is a usual bureaucratic activity, however.

earl