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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
The airlines, particularly the recently self-declared bankrupt American
Airlines, don't need the negative publicity generated by their over zealous employees as they hyper-enforce these ill-defined rules over the use of electronic devices during particularly boring phases of departure preparation. This just further reinforces in the mind of the customer that this product (air travel) is equivalent to sitting in a school bus under the control of a 1950's era gym teacher. ========= Adults do not like being treated like children. ========= The crock in this story is that while Baldwin was being crucified and evicted by the crew, others passengers in the vicinity were using their own phones to text and tweet the enfolding story to the outside world. There is just too much grief caused by the arbitrary nature of the history of these rules and their enforcement. The insanity is that the crew wouldn't bat an eye if Baldwin was engrossed with pen and paper cross-word puzzle, but the electronic version of same somehow crosses a line. The exact nature of the "harm" or "risk" that these devices can cause during different phases of boarding, taxi, takeoff and landing (most of which can entail VERY LONG periods of stationary immobility, including de-icing, etc) need to be either confirmed or debunked. If these devices are even remotely the risk that some imagine, then their outright presence in the cabin should be banned entirely - something that would kill air travel as we know it. If the argument is that these devices are a distraction for passengers in the event of the need for emergency de-planement, then I would argue so are infants/children, the elderly, newspapers books and magazines, etc. The fundamental disconnect here is the following - and pay attention to this. The average rational, knowledgable adult has an idea of what sort of personal behavior is inherently risky or unsafe, or illegal (etc) and knows the consequences thereof. Many such examples surrounding the operation of a motor vehicle for example (being intoxicated or texting while driving, exceeding the speed limit, etc). We assess the "danger" or risks of using hand-held electronics while seated on a plane as having no discernable risk to any eventuality. The activity of using these devices is far below the threshold of what we perceive to be the danger to our body or to those around us. Yet we are confronted with authoritative figures (flight attendents) who impose unreasonable restrictions on what we believe to be reasonable behavior (playing an electronic game on a small hand-held device while seated on a plane). I submit that human beings, while seeking self gratification or recreation that meets their own internalized rules for risk-tolerance and social acceptance, are wired to be hostile to the imposition of the denial of these activities. In terms of conflicting or high-stress interpersonal human interactions, we should be engineering such interactions out of our relationships and interactions instead of re-enforcing them. In other words, it was more "harmful" to those involved to engage in this behavior (to deny gratification or recreation) than the benefit that could ever be gained from the denial (and I leave the specification of this benefit as an excercise to the reader). From past psycological experiments, we know that those that are put in a position of authority over others will follow rules and directives by their superiors that defy rational understanding (the application of increasingly larger electric shocks to test subjects on the command of the test leader, the torture and execution of prisoners by germans during WW2, etc). This sort of "obeyance to authority for authority's sake" should be engineered out of all manner of human interaction, and most notable the air travel experience. There is simply not enough engineering and psycology being applied to the design of better systems of human interaction in the air travel experience. ======================================== http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/s...nes/51720054/1 Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes Actor Alec Baldwin's removal from an American Airlines plane Tuesday for playing a game on his cellphone has sparked discussion among experts and frequent fliers at odds over being required to shut off electronic devices during takeoff and landing. Federal Aviation Administration rules state that no airline or pilot may allow passengers to operate "any portable electronic device" on an operating aircraft. Nonetheless, airlines often allow passengers to use laptops and other devices that don't emit radio signals when an aircraft is above 10,000 feet, says Alison Duquette, FAA spokeswoman. The FAA's website says "there are still unknowns" about radio signals emitted by portable electronic devices and cellphones. The signals — particularly in large quantities and emitted for a long time — "may unintentionally affect aircraft communications, navigation, flight control and electronic equipment." Frequent flier James Morrow, an information technology consultant in Overland Park, Kan., says FAA rules prohibiting the operation of electronic devices in flight are "a gross oversimplification" with very little research to back them up. "It's my impression that, because there is a remote possibility that some handheld devices might malfunction and interfere with the plane, we're going to insist that everything be turned off," Morrow says. John Knott, a consultant in Orlando, says passengers should always be allowed to use electronic devices that don't receive or transmit radio signals. "The rule is like using a sledgehammer to swat a fly," Knott says. "It is an overly broad rule based on an unproven issue." Frequent flier and SHEEPLE Barry Maher, a professional speaker from Corona, Calif., supports the restrictions. "If the FAA is worried about it, I'm worried about it," he says. "When I'm traveling 600 miles an hour in a metal tube, I'd rather err on the side of safety." More studies will be needed to determine whether there is real danger in electronic devices operating during flight. Meanwhile, airlines may let passengers use newer-model cellphones in "airplane mode," which "essentially disables the transmission function so they can't make calls," the FAA says. Users can play games, check an address or look at the calendar. FAA guidelines permit airlines to allow cellphone calls after a plane has landed and is taxiing to the gate. |
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
In Fly Guy wrote:
The airlines, particularly the recently self-declared bankrupt American Airlines, don't need the negative publicity generated by their over zealous employees as they hyper-enforce these ill-defined rules over the use of electronic devices during particularly boring phases of departure preparation. The rules aren't "ill-defined," and asking passengers to follow them isn't "hyper-enforcing" them. So, what's your point? -- St. Paul, MN |
#3
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
Bert wrote:
So, what's your point? Don't be a wise ass. You read my entire post. You know what the point was. |
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
On 12/8/2011 10:51 AM, Fly Guy wrote:
We are confronted with authoritative figures (flight attendents) who impose unreasonable restrictions on what we believe to be reasonable behavior (playing an electronic game on a small hand-held device while seated on a plane). The flight attendants do not "impose" the restrictions. The attendants enforce them. Bozos like Alec Baldwin should take up their plaints with real authorities like the F.A.A. |
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
Sancho Panza wrote:
We are confronted with authoritative figures (flight attendents) who impose unreasonable restrictions on what we believe to be reasonable behavior The flight attendants do not "impose" the restrictions. Yes, they do. Because to the best of my recollection, I don't recall anyone from the FAA think-tank that made the rules being the same ones walking down the ailes tell me to turn off my GPS or mp3 player. Impose, enforce. No real difference in the context of the interaction being considered. |
#6
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
Baldwin is a self serving angry idiot.
I am a retired USAirway Captain and I would have kept the brakes set (locked) until the airport Police escorted his sick soul off of the airplane. Rules are rules. There're everwhere in our lives, like it or not, Baldwin. |
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
DV 8 wrote:
Baldwin is a self serving angry idiot. But his ticket purchases pays for your sorry-ass salary. Keep that in mind. I am a retired USAirway Captain Rules are rules. There're everwhere in our lives, Rules should be based on logic, reason, and evidence. You're just a glorified bus driver with an ego. Stick to flying the ****ing plane and leave the paying customers alone to their harmless recreation. The stupid rules about the use of hand-held electronic devices does nothing except increase tension and conflict inside the cabin between passengers and crew WHICH DOES NOT SERVE THE INTERESTS OF THE AIRLINE INDUSTRY. |
#8
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
The Captain signs a "release" taking full resposibility for that
airplane and everone in it and releasing the company from that flight. When your sick ass is mid way between Philly and London and you see lightining and the bumps are slight, but service is suspended for an hour or so for safety reasons; do you give a **** how much the Captain earns ? I have heard these dumb as bus driver ect shots for 40 years. I worried about it all the way to the bank. It would please everone if you would vanish from the Web discuss group you envious prick. I could sit your dumb ass in a B-767 and you would not get one engine running in your lifetime. OH, I am a Prof of Aeronautics and teach at the worlds largest Aro University to stay in my beloved interests during retirement. |
#9
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
DV 8 wrote:
The Captain signs a "release" taking full resposibility for that airplane and everone in it and releasing the company from that flight. So leave the passengers alone if they want to play with their electronic toys while seated. ****ing talk about that - not about your ego that you know how to press the right buttons to start the engines. And big ****ing deal about signing a release. If anything happens, you know damn well that everyone sues everyone else anyways - signed releases mean squat. You'd be better off if you DID'T sign a release. Why are you signing away your rights to NOT be responsible for the conduct of the passengers? I wouldn't want to be responsible if I were the pilot. I have no control over who buys the tickets to get on the plane. I wouldn't want that control. As for being responsible for their safety - last time I checked the pilots are usually on the same plane as the passengers, and if the plane crashes then the pilots are usually also roughed up (or killed). So your own sense of self preservation is all "safety" the passengers need. OH, I am a Prof of Aeronautics and teach at the worlds largest Aro University to stay in my beloved interests during retirement. I'd rather not hear about the hard-on you get when you talk about yourself. What did you learn, Professor, about some boob in business class playing a game on his ipad? Tell us what you know or what you teach about how badly an iPad ****s up an airplane that's sitting at the gate, or a plane that's pushed back from the gate but just sitting there for 10 or 15 minutes? Tell us about what you learned about human psycology, about the merits of picking your fights, and if the reward of agrivating passengers into turning off their harmless devices is worth the increase in conflict and tension in the cabin? |
#10
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Baldwin dust-up sparks debate about electronics on planes
On 12/11/2011 10:23 AM, Fly Guy wrote:
So leave the passengers alone if they want to play with their electronic toys while seated. Despite your shortsightedness, the F.A.A. requires the airline and crew to enforce its rules or face penalties and other sanctions. You are misdirecting your complaint. |
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