UK: Collapse of NHS leads to suicide

"Earl Evleth" wrote in message
...

The problem in the US is the variation of infant mortality
rates with social class.

That the US health care system kills the babies of poor people isn't news...

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

"Deeply Filled Mortician" wrote
in message ...
Make credence recognised that on Thu, 05 Apr 2007 23:57:55 +0100, Mike
O'Sullivan has scripted:

A friend recently was in Australia and needed emergency dental
treatment, which involved, amongst other thing, a wisdom tooth
extraction. Cost him (or his insurance policy), around £1000.

That's why going to eastern Europe to have dental work done is
popular, not that it's an option if your in pain.

In the UK emergency dental treatment is available free from hospitals.

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

Make credence recognised that on Thu, 05 Apr 2007 23:57:55 +0100, Mike
O'Sullivan has scripted:

dechucka wrote:
"Roger Dewhurst" wrote in message
...
"PJ O'Donovan" wrote in message
ps.com...
hhttp://news.independent.co.uk/uk/health_medical/article2422646.ece


'Collapse of NHS system pushed dentist to take her own life'
By Ian Herbert
Published: 05 April 2007

Why should there be any NHS dental service? There is nothing like it in
New
Zealand or Australia.


We used to have a great one in Aus till Howard stopped the funding now
dental health in Australia has decreased


A friend recently was in Australia and needed emergency dental
treatment, which involved, amongst other thing, a wisdom tooth
extraction. Cost him (or his insurance policy), around £1000.

That's why going to eastern Europe to have dental work done is
popular, not that it's an option if your in pain.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

"William Black" wrote in message
...

"Earl Evleth" wrote in message
...

The problem in the US is the variation of infant mortality
rates with social class.

As it does in every country. However it was once was supposed that high
infant mortality rates often meant that those that survived were that much
fitter or healthier. I don't that rule applies today in the USA.




That the US health care system kills the babies of poor people isn't
news...

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

Collapse of NHS system pushed dentist to take her own life'

PJ

Life expectancy in the UK is over 80 years
Life expectancy in the US is only 76 years.


In reality the measure of the effectiveness of any health system is
the
infant mortality rate

According to the CIA fact book the UK infant mortality rate is about
25%
lower then the rate in the USA...

William Black

Really?

The overall UK/ US infant mortality rate 25 % differential is
statistically insignificant when compared with race/ethnic/geographic
differentials within the US itself


www.cdc.com

Racial and Ethnic Disparities in Infant Mortality Rates --- 60 Largest
U.S. Cities, 1995--1998

During the 20th century, U.S. infant mortality rates (IMRs) declined
by
90% (1); however, many of the largest U.S. cities continue to have
high
IMRs compared with national rates. Studies of U.S. infant mortality by
region document persisting geographic disparities (2,3) and
differences
across racial/ethnic groups. This report highlights the wide
disparities in the most recent overall race- and ethnicity-specific
IMRs for the largest U.S. cities and describes key differences among
those cities. The findings demonstrate the need to decrease infant
mortality among blacks in U.S. cities.

If "poor medical care" creates much higher infant mortality rates in
our cities why do poor US hispanics in the same communities for
instance consistently have infant mortality rates comparable in most
cases to whites and a fraction of the black infant mortality rates.

Here are a few examples for you to chew on from
www.cdc.gov

Infant Mortality Rates

White Black Hispanic

Atlanta 6.7 14.6 6.1

Denver 6.8 15.5 7.3

Chicago 7.0 17.6 7.1

"PJ O'Donovan" wrote in message
oups.com...

The overall UK/ US infant mortality rate 25 % differential is
statistically insignificant when compared with race/ethnic/geographic
differentials within the US itself

That the US healthcare system kills the babies of certain groups within the
USA isn't news...


If "poor medical care" creates much higher infant mortality rates in
our cities why do poor US hispanics in the same communities for
instance consistently have infant mortality rates comparable in most
cases to whites and a fraction of the black infant mortality rates.

Because the US system kills the babies of the poor and the US economic
system seems, to an external viewer, to be racist.

Your health system doesn't work, costs you a fortune, and the babies of the
poor die because of this.

In the UK very few babies die because of their parents poverty and care is
very good, to the extent that the number of private maternity units in the
UK is infinitesimally small.

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

"William Black" wrote in message
...

"PJ O'Donovan" wrote in message
oups.com...

The overall UK/ US infant mortality rate 25 % differential is
statistically insignificant when compared with race/ethnic/geographic
differentials within the US itself

That the US healthcare system kills the babies of certain groups within
the USA isn't news...


If "poor medical care" creates much higher infant mortality rates in
our cities why do poor US hispanics in the same communities for
instance consistently have infant mortality rates comparable in most
cases to whites and a fraction of the black infant mortality rates.

Because the US system kills the babies of the poor and the US economic
system seems, to an external viewer, to be racist.

Your health system doesn't work, costs you a fortune, and the babies of
the poor die because of this.

In the UK very few babies die because of their parents poverty and care is
very good, to the extent that the number of private maternity units in the
UK is infinitesimally small.

--
William Black

We also have just as great a 'race/ethnic' differential as the USA. Over
300 different languages spoken in London compared with a miserable 200 or so
in New York.

Your health system doesn't work, costs you a fortune, and the babies
of the
poor die because of this.

William Black

The emprical data does not support your cynicism.

The figures show poor urban US Hispanic babies have a survival rate
over twice that of US poor urban blacks in the same communities.

How do you explain that difference?????

Are you arguing that different lifestyles and different individual
responsibilities do not impact infant mortality rates at all????

"PJ O'Donovan" wrote in message
ups.com...
Your health system doesn't work, costs you a fortune, and the babies
of the
poor die because of this.

William Black

The emprical data does not support your cynicism.

The figures show poor urban US Hispanic babies have a survival rate
over twice that of US poor urban blacks in the same communities.

How do you explain that difference?????

Racism.

--
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

On 6/04/07 11:52, in article ,
"John Rennie" wrote:

The problem in the US is the variation of infant mortality
rates with social class.

As it does in every country. However it was once was supposed that high
infant mortality rates often meant that those that survived were that much
fitter or healthier. I don't that rule applies today in the USA.


The problem is often in the quality of prenatal care. The French SS health
system provides cash payments for pregnant women who go to the doctor
and get a check up, three during the time of their pregnancy is I remember
correctly. Even an illiterate lower class immigrant knows where the
money is.

These examinations, in turn, cut down on the number of underweight babies
which often results from premature births. In turn, studies show that
the entire program, which is preventative, actually "makes money", since
the cost of treating premies is so high. So it is one area which saves
money.

It the US private insurance system, these costs savings are not evident
since the poor are not insured and the insurance companies would not
want to insured them anyway since they are most costly to the system.
The savings can only be computed at the global level.

This example shows that for some things it might be profitable to
use the "profit" motive to be sure people get proper preventative
care. For instance, although flu shots are totally covered in France,
do everybody that should have them get them. Going to the doctor
is a pain in the neck, one has to call for an appointment. So why
not pay people to go to the doctor in this areas where a global
analysis shows that money it to be made for the system.

The American system has been angling towards tax deductble medical insurance
saving programs, which would favor the rich or otherwise and discouraging
people from seeking medical care. All children should have their proper
series of vaccine shots, and in France they insist on it or the kid
can not get into school. But adults? What effort is made to get
adults get their shots?