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Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 29th, 2009, 01:00 AM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
Fly Guy
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Posts: 193
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

I said this on Sept 12/2001. I said this after the shoe bomber. I said
this after the "liquid" bomb threat.

Now I'm saying it after the crotch bomber.

The single most effective deterrent to keeping the "bad guys" (tm) off
the plane is to alter the pre-flight passenger announcement along these
lines:

"Passengers are requested to inform the crew of any suspicious behavior
they see or may be called upon by crew to subdue or incapacitate persons
that are threatening the safety and security of the aircraft."

When you hear that day after day, reconnaissance flight after
reconnaissance flight, it beings to sink in that you won't be able to
plan an effective in-flight catastrophe when that becomes the mindset of
the travelling public.

It's not tbe point that most passengers *ALREADY* are thinking along
those lines. The announcement is not really for their benefit. The
announcement is meant to spook those that are thinking about doing
something nasty in the future, and are themselves or sending out other
operatives to test various security proceedures, etc.

Just like the security theater that is performed not for the benefit of
the average passenger - it's performed as show of strength to spook the
would-be bad-guy, get him to sweat, act nervous, etc.

If security screeners really thought that they'd be discovering bombs,
explosives, etc, then they'd be dressed in bomb suits as they rummage
through gramma's purse at the security arch.

What surprises me is that we haven't really seen something that in
theory is more effective - which is to plant a bomb in a checked bag,
which could be set off via a timer or by a radio signal from the
bad-guy. Even during the much-publicised period during 2003 when it was
announced that much more invasive screening of checked bags was going to
start in Jan 2004, no bad-guys took advantage of that window of
opportunity to check a bomb for their suicide flight.

A bigger question is - why blow up a plane? Unless you own stock in
companies that make security scanning equipment (or are running a gov't
black-ops project to get congress to force these body-screeners into
airports), it's not clear what exactly the allure is in blowing up a
plane.

I wonder why the crotch bomber wasn't tasked with simply flying to
Detroit with the bomb safely in his pants, walk off the plane and head
the nearest shopping mall and blow himself up along with a few dozen
shoppers. Maybe while holding an iPhone in an Apple store screaming
"God is Great!" while those around him can capture his performance on a
camera phone. Maybe don't even fly him to the US - put him on a cruise
ship instead.

The moozlem idiots need to start leaving planes alone. They need to get
a clue that it's not working. And do it before air travel becomes an
absolute pain in the ass for everyone (pun intended).
  #2  
Old December 29th, 2009, 01:28 AM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
erilar
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Posts: 1,142
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

In article , Fly Guy wrote:

The moozlem idiots need to start leaving planes alone. They need to get
a clue that it's not working. And do it before air travel becomes an
absolute pain in the ass for everyone (pun intended).


The latter has been the case for almost a decade. Now it's going to get
worse.

--
Erilar, biblioholic medievalist


http://www.chibardun.net/~erilarlo
  #3  
Old December 29th, 2009, 01:55 AM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
Fly Guy
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Posts: 193
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

Epsilon wrote:

The moozlem idiots need to start leaving planes alone. They
need to get a clue that it's not working. And do it before
air travel becomes an absolute pain in the ass for everyone
(pun intended).


The latter has been the case for almost a decade. Now it's
going to get worse.


So it would seem that the terrorist strategy is working very well,
for minimal costs to the terrorists.


I don't think their strategy is to increase the bottom-line of defence
and security contractors who make full-body scanners and sniffers.

Followup-To: alt.****wits


And your strategy didn't work either.
  #4  
Old December 29th, 2009, 03:03 PM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
Fly Guy
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Posts: 193
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

Shawn Hirn wrote:

"Passengers are requested to inform the crew of any suspicious
behavior they see or may be called upon by crew to subdue or
incapacitate persons that are threatening the safety and security
of the aircraft."


Would that have prevented this latest incident?


Has anything done since 9/11 prevented the shoe bomber or now this
crotch bomber from getting on a plane?

It doesn't cost any money, it doesn't waste anyone's time or cause any
inconveinence to include that additional sentence in the pre-flight
announcement. It's effectiveness at causing stress and anxiety for
those conducting planning of a terror act and those attempting to carry
it out can't be under-estimated. It might be enough to cause them to
slip up or botch the attempt.

If the guy was just sitting at the gate waiting to board like
all the other passengers, I doubt he exhibited any unusual
behavior.


The announcement I'm talking about would not be played at the gate. It
would be included as part of the pre-flight crap you hear once you're
already seated on the plane.
  #5  
Old December 29th, 2009, 03:19 PM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
Ian F.
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Posts: 491
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

"Fly Guy" wrote in message ...

The announcement I'm talking about would not be played at the gate. It
would be included as part of the pre-flight crap you hear once you're
already seated on the plane.


Which no one listens to!

Ian
  #6  
Old December 29th, 2009, 03:47 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
Jochen Kriegerowski[_2_]
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Posts: 122
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

"Epsilon" schrieb

So it would seem that the terrorist strategy is working very well, for
minimal costs to the terrorists.


It works perfectly well. Terrorism is not about killing people, but
causing people to panic. And they do, despite the fact that the risk
of being killed by a brick falling off a building is probably much
higher than the risk of getting blown up by some maniac.
I would put warning signs on sidewalks. Every 10 metres: "Watch
out for falling bricks!"

I avoid flying whenever I can. Not because of terrorists, but because
of the "security" measures against them. It has become ridiculous!

Jochen
  #7  
Old December 29th, 2009, 05:49 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
AZ Nomad[_3_]
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Posts: 321
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

On Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:47:06 +0100, Jochen Kriegerowski wrote:
"Epsilon" schrieb


So it would seem that the terrorist strategy is working very well, for
minimal costs to the terrorists.


It works perfectly well. Terrorism is not about killing people, but
causing people to panic. And they do, despite the fact that the risk
of being killed by a brick falling off a building is probably much
higher than the risk of getting blown up by some maniac.
I would put warning signs on sidewalks. Every 10 metres: "Watch
out for falling bricks!"


I avoid flying whenever I can. Not because of terrorists, but because
of the "security" measures against them. It has become ridiculous!


Are you refering to the rules before 12/25/09?
It's horrible, having to take your shoes off. Taking metal objects off
is also really tricky.


  #8  
Old December 29th, 2009, 06:13 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
Jochen Kriegerowski[_2_]
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Posts: 122
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

"AZ Nomad" schrieb

It's horrible, having to take your shoes off. Taking metal objects off
is also really tricky.


It's neither horrible nor tricky. Just ridiculous. And I don't like to be
ridiculed whenever some paranoids think they have to "do something".

Is flying really so much safer if you can only carry 100 ml toothpaste
instead of 125? Will the ziplock transparent bag where the toothpaste
tube has to be in really save the plane from exploding? No more than
a wolly hat will save me from falling bricks, one would think.

Jochen
  #9  
Old December 29th, 2009, 07:03 PM posted to rec.travel.air,rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.europe
William Black
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Posts: 3,125
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

Fly Guy wrote:

The announcement I'm talking about would not be played at the gate. It
would be included as part of the pre-flight crap you hear once you're
already seated on the plane.


What do you read while they're giving the 'in an emergency proceed to
the exits' talk these days?

--
William Black

"Any number under six"

The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
  #10  
Old December 29th, 2009, 07:24 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
AZ Nomad[_3_]
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Posts: 321
Default Pre-flight announcement needs to include passenger intervention

On Tue, 29 Dec 2009 18:13:00 +0100, Jochen Kriegerowski wrote:
"AZ Nomad" schrieb


It's horrible, having to take your shoes off. Taking metal objects off
is also really tricky.


It's neither horrible nor tricky. Just ridiculous. And I don't like to be


no **** sherlock. go out and get yourself a sarcasm detector.
 




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