what do you thimk

Educational groups can be licensed very easily, as can journalists.
There's many ways to get to Cuba if one really wants to go.

Cathy Heidemann wrote:

It depends on the traveller. If you are on a "licensed" trip to Cuba you can
certainly spend money there. Several faculty from our university were there
this past year for a licensed conference. They spent money there.

Read this for further info:

http://travel.state.gov/cuba.html



On 9/16/03 10:48 AM, in article ,
"CupCaked" wrote:


Just as a point of clarification, Americans are not prohibited (by the
State Department) from going to Cuba, they are just not allowed to
spend money in Cuba, a Treasury Dept. restriction.



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http://www.cupcaked.com/reviews
(...and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)

Yes and yes. Unfortunately there is a very large and politically powerful
group of Cubans that do not want American citizens to be able to do this so
until the politicians finally tell these clowns to take a hike don;t look
for it to happen. It certainly will not happen during an election year.
Maybe summer of 2005 right after the big elections and as far away from the
secondary elections as possible.
Jim


"skip lynch" wrote in message
...
should cruise ships be able to dock in cuba??? would you go????

On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 07:46:04 -0500 (CDT), (skip lynch)
wrote:

should cruise ships be able to dock in cuba??? would you go????

Unlike most of the political threads on the internet -- usually
ranting diatribes by nut cases -- I think some soul searching really
is in order here.

Personally, I'd go. I just don't see poverty doing Castro any harm or
the Cuban people any good. Just look at North Korea, or Rumania
during the communist era. Or Iraq. These boycotts seem pretty
ineffective at removing entrenched dictators -- the people just suffer
that much more IMO.

If they still had a massive military presence in Angola, I might feel
differently, But the Cuban government does put money into the
peoples' pockets, especially a fairly decent medical care program for
such a poor country.


Mason Barge

"If this is coffee, please bring me some tea. If this is tea, please bring me some coffee."
-- Abraham Lincoln

Absolutely and Absolutely!

(CupCaked) wrote in message ...
(skip lynch) wrote:

should cruise ships be able to dock in cuba???

They will be, sooner or later.

would you go????

Sure!

Karen


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http://www.cupcaked.com/reviews
(...and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)

There are plenty of oppressed nations, run by dictators or oligarchies,
to which Americans are permitted free travel; China, for one. As far as
I can tell, and I do not pretend to be an expert, the whole 40 year
Cuban embargo is based on a small, but influencial, political lobby in
this country. This long-standing embargo has had virtually no positive
impact on democratizing Cuba. So it's about time, I think, that it was
seriously reconsidered.

Historically, Americans have been permitted to travel to most countries,
unless we are at war with them. For example, many Americans travelled
to Germany before Pearl Harbor, despite the fact that it was well known
by our State Department that millions of people were being persecuted,
disposessed, tortured, and killed. Millions still travel to Austria,
despite the fact that its citizens freely elected a Nazi war criminal
not that long ago.

Would I to there? I've never really thought about it, one way or another.

Howard

Howard



skip lynch wrote:

should cruise ships be able to dock in cuba??? would you go????

NO-Would not go

"Major" wrote in message
...
"fishman" wrote:

You mean giving up, giving in, and letting the dictator win? Now
there's a clever solution!

Letting the dictator win???? That kind of foolish, king-of-the-playground
thinking is why this freak of nature has been in power for over 40 years, is
working on his political skills with his 9th U.S. president!!! He has won!
What more does he need? He has his cigars, his women, his power, his fame -
and he gets to do it publicly, unlike Baby Doc who has to live in relative
seclusion in France, or Idi Amin, who has blessedly shuffled off this mortal
coil. God forbid we should give up or give in and look bad internationally.
I mean, the U.S. has never been embarrassed on the world stage for a
political or military failure before!

What matters now is the Cuban people - how will they be best served? By
getting rid of Castro. How do we get rid of Castro? Waiting for him to die
hasn't worked, starving his people hasn't worked, clandestine assassination
attempts haven't worked, a bungled invasion hasn't worked, limiting contact
to the U.S. hasn't worked, listening to the rantings of a group of bitter
old men in Miami hasn't worked. Hmmm, what else could we try? How about a
totally different solution? What do you have to offer?

Chris

"Major" wrote in message
...
(CupCaked) wrote:

Educational groups can be licensed very easily, as can journalists.

Birds of a (leftist/communist) feather, politically speaking?

No, Fellow Travelers. Have you forgotten???

Chris

"Major" wrote in message
...
"fishman" wrote:

As if the money to the 'oppressed' isn't propping up the economy?
Compared
to Haiti or Dom Rep, there are very few 'oppressed people in Cuba.

Except for an elite minority, ALL Cubans are oppressed by their
dictator.

Excellent. They are also fed - food may not be plentiful but it is
available. Go ask a Haitian refugee turned away from Florida shores if he
would rather be 'dead then red'?? I work with schoolkids who immigrate
form islands all over the Caribbean. The Haitians, unless lucky or rich
enough to go to a private or church-run school, are illiterate. Cuban
kids - you just have to teach them English; they know how to function in
their native language, they know math and science and syntax. And you
think the people in Haiti are free to express their opinions in the street
without fear of retribution? Just because their government's oppression is
not of a communist nature doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Chris

Major wrote:
(skip lynch) wrote:


should cruise ships be able to dock in cuba???


Current boycotts by free nations should apply to cruises that stop in
any such nation.


would you go????


And provide economic support to a communist dictator who is oppressing
a nation? Certainly not!


Give me a break. The biggest trading partner to the United States of
America, a place where many of are goods are produced, is China.
Communist China.

Politics is mostly amoral, there's plenty of support from countries that
are considered "free" countries that goes to oppressive regimes. Think
Saudi Arabia is a free country?

Would I go? If I go to any other Caribbean country I'd go to Cuba but I
abhor countries that limit expression and access to information. Cuba is
but one of such countries.

Ben S.