Alerts to New Cruisers & New Visitors (Skip Clicking if No Interests)

Hi New Cruisers & New Vistors to this group, I issued this alert and
thought it would be of financial interest. If you missed any of my
alerts, they are available only here. This is a group about passions
and concerns of cruising, and not about directing primarily business to
agent. Best regards, Garry NOT A TRAVEL AGENT 800-911-411 or
Consult-Group-Before-Purchase

Alert: Know How You Get to an Agent & Share Specific Agent Practices
with Group Please
Any Place, any time

When I started for the first times to look into cruising as travel
idea, at least for the first 2 times I booked a cruise, I later found
out I paid $200-$300 above the lowest prices publicly available then
from websites - not necessarily from household name brands such as
Orbitz or Travelocity. By the way, these were for transaction amounts
of around $1000 and around $1500 in total for 2 persons for the
cheapest available cabins for 7 days.

The consolidator cruise websites, while many a time cheaper than the
household brand names, do not necessarily offer the lowest prices,
particularly in light of the more restrictive terms (e.g. in not very
"fine" print on separate web pages) you are bound. Once you book with
websites, they may hit you with cancellation or rebooking fees should
you need to make any minor changes which should have been free before
the comitment deadlines from cruiselines anyway.

As for booking with human travel agents, prices also vary. For a
transaction amount of a 2-person 7-day cheap cabin, agent-A may charge
anywhere from $200 - $500 more than agent-B, depending on different
service levels and their cost of doing business (thus required return
from your transaction differs).

After my first 2 website experiences, I used travel agents myself too.
Some may be willing to beat the website prices, some just quoted much
more than what were publicly available, even more than what's offered
by the cruiselines directly. Some simply gave me a hard and rude time.

Over these experiences, I learnt and have developed somewhat of my own
best pratices when it comes to researching for advices and who to book
with.

I guess the above is no new news. But I just develop a strong feeling
out of my actual experiences that there are agents who prey on the
VULNERABILITIES of SOMEONE NEW. They present the picture in such ways
so that you are paying easily several hundred dollars more simply
perhaps because someone new to the business are not prepared to ask the
right questions. Some sadly are under the false pretense that if an
agent is introduced by someone you know or by a newsgroup, then that
agent is trustworthy.

AGENT TRUSTWORTHINESS should be looked into not slightly.

To be fair, Travelocity's cost base is higher than a smaller cruise
website so it should carry more values. But if you take the quote, say
$1400, to an agent who has not website costs to absorb, you should be
able to find one who should be willing to offer less than $1400, for
instance (as website costs for one kind can be avoided). However, I
personally also ran into serveral times where human agents came back
with quotes way higher than $1400 to begin with.

Therefore along these cost lines, if you work with an agent who
"advertises" in this news group, you should ask for an even lower price
- to deduct the advertising expenses avoided on the part of the agent
to reach you.

I imagine if I were an agent, and if I could tap into a minimal-cost
channel of obtaining prospects, I could afford to wait for the best
paying prices to come along.

AGENT TRUSTWORTHINESS should include how one does business in
consideration of others NOT just according to the laws or how
inconsequential (i.e. what people can do about it anyway?) it seems BUT
ALSO how one can be a good community or corporate citizen.
Please, if you are new, report and share practices you observe with the
group to advance the passions and concerns of cruising. I remember
seeing postings of people asking quotes from a travel agent who posts
here got treated less than squarely - I think the term was: NOT
ENTERTAINING PRICE ENQUIRIES.

Especially for the new, please insist on comparing prices, no courteous
agents should give people hard times simply because the enquirer is not
prepared to give all the trust to the agent in question. So the agent
simply waits...

When in doubt, just ask, and listen to the facts. And even if you have
time, you may not want to keep sending postings all the time.

Enjoy the postings and have fun comparing!

Alert to New Cruisers:

This is a troll who doesn't have a clue about cruise pricing. Please ignore.
I've been on 14 cruises. There are folks here who have been on many, many
more cruises. Take care when reading this newsgroup to gauge the credibility
of the poster. We are absolutely, positively troll-infested at the moment.

Diana Ball
near Houston, TX

"D Ball" wrote in message
...
Alert to New Cruisers:

This is a troll who doesn't have a clue about cruise pricing. Please
ignore. I've been on 14 cruises. There are folks here who have been on
many, many more cruises. Take care when reading this newsgroup to gauge
the credibility of the poster. We are absolutely, positively
troll-infested at the moment.

Well said, Diana.. There are many seasoned cruisers in this group who have
many cruises under their belts (we just got off our 32nd one on the
Celebrity Mercury) and who can spot a troll very quickly.
I come back to see that the animals have been and are very restless,
lately....Although I have the leader kill filed, all the new anonymous troll
names keep appearing and my kill file is filling up.. I sincerely believe it
is the very same sick troll using different* handles* to make it appear as
if there are many jumping on his bandwagon. Too bad I see his posts included
in those who reply to him...If it keeps ups, I have no choice but to sadly
have to kill file them, too. Best if everyone just kill filled him.
Result: Instead of losing customers, Ray will be making lots of new ones.

--Jean

"Jean O'Boyle" wrote in message
t...

Well said, Diana.. There are many seasoned cruisers in this group who have
many cruises under their belts (we just got off our 32nd one on the
Celebrity Mercury) and who can spot a troll very quickly.
I come back to see that the animals have been and are very restless,
lately....Although I have the leader kill filed, all the new anonymous
troll names keep appearing and my kill file is filling up.. I sincerely
believe it is the very same sick troll using different* handles* to make
it appear as if there are many jumping on his bandwagon. Too bad I see his
posts included in those who reply to him...If it keeps ups, I have no
choice but to sadly have to kill file them, too. Best if everyone just
kill filled him.
Result: Instead of losing customers, Ray will be making lots of new ones.

--Jean

Let me fill you in.

While you were gone one poster here wrote 166 messages on RTC because HE
decided that Ray broke the rules of the RTC charter. When one of the people
who actually wrote the RTC charter tried to tell him he was wrong, he went
off on Roland. The amoeba seems to think that Roland's last name is
"Piperut", and eventually "you know who", unable to make his point, called
Roland a "faggot" because he wears a "skirt".

Want even better? This unnamed coward who has frequently claimed to have
NEVER posted under a fake name, used six different ID's in posting the 166
messages.

I have finally done what I should have done a long time ago. I put him in
my killfile.

See what you are missing?
--
DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

Dick G wrote:
"Jean O'Boyle" wrote in message
t...

Result: Instead of losing customers, Ray will be making lots of new ones.

--Jean

Let me fill you in.

While you were gone one poster here wrote 166 messages on RTC because HE
decided that Ray broke the rules of the RTC charter.

I said NOTHING about rules of the RTC charter -- you LYING SHILL for
Ray!

I said he violated USENET Guidelines which apply to ALL newsgroups --
NO ADS.


When one of the people
who actually wrote the RTC charter tried to tell him he was wrong, he went
off on Roland. The amoeba seems to think that Roland's last name is
"Piperut",

When did I think roland's name was piperut? Roland chose to POST by
his posting name piperut.

At least I didn't whine like some of the other brown-nosers of Ray
about
a posting name as a "fake" and a "sockpuppet".

Roland kept pointing out Ray's 4-line sig was within RTC charter, when
EVERYONE can see that the number of lines in the sig is the LEAST of
Ray's AD. When he made it 3 lines, it was STILL a blatent AD.


and eventually "you know who", unable to make his point, called
Roland a "faggot" because he wears a "skirt".

That's still ANOTHER LIE -- Dick Goldhaber. A DAMNED LIE.

Fred chided roland about wearing a shirt.

Roland went into a treatise on his Scottish honor of
blowing his "Warrior Pipes", or "War Pipes".

This was my verbatim quote:

RF I recommend that you change your blowing of your "War Pipes"
RF to blowing a Faggot. It sounds better and is legit in an
orchestra.

RF Roland the Faggot blower -- I like the ring of it!

How would someone as ignorant and uneducated as Dick Goldhaber
know that a Faggot is a "bassoon" a woodwind instrument in an
orchestra. I even mentioned "orchester" to make it clear that was
the Faggot I meant -- bassoon.

THREE LIES in THREE narratives -- by Dick Goldhaber!


Want even better? This unnamed coward who has frequently claimed to have
NEVER posted under a fake name, used six different ID's in posting the 166
messages.

Use ONLY six? Those are POSTING names, not IDs. The ID is the same
ISP from which I posted. How else could you have counted 166?

This month's top posters
171

The SAME posting ID as I always used in rec.travel.cruises

All time top posters
18018

The same ADs, 18,018 by the same Ray Goldenberg from the same ID.

--
DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

Missing Dick Goldhaber's LIES exposed.

Missing Ray Goldenberg's ADs and sleazy tactics exposed!

Ray has used various tactics in the past to form his present SPAM
haven, with brown-nosers kissing his derriere.


1996 rec.travel.caribbean Ray tried PRIVATE spamming

To which Ray Goldenberg of Spamhouse Travel responded via private
email:
Hi Craig,(private)
Give me a call, if I can be of assistance. I would appreciate
your business.

Craig For crying out loud! Is this what you do all day? Scan the
Craig Caribbean newsgroups for suckers to sell stuff to?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


In 1997, Ray intimidated other Travel Agents who competed against
his ad:
Ray Goldenberg ,
says that this group will boycott my business
The reason being that I posted only the URL of my site

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


Really IRONIC and INTERESTING that Ray threatened to BOYCOTT
someone who post his business URL.


In 1998, Ray refined his intimidation tactic on other TAs to
harrassements:
Mr. Ray Goldenberg )
continues to "stalk" me via the internet. In the last three weeks I
have received no less than 15 onsolicated, harassing e:mails from
this individual.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------


You see, over the years, Ray has built his present SPAMMING Empire
in rec.travel.cruises through every DISHONORABLE tactic known to
mankind, to have molded the present crop of do-nothing yes-man
and Ray-worshippers like piperut and the rest of the rotten gang
who recognized Ray's ADS as ADs, but have been threathened,
harrassed, and imtimidated into their present submission.


I do not yield to AD spamming newsgroup fascists like Ray Goldenberg.

I'll spam HIS ADS as long as he spams using his ADs.

There are already HUNDREDS of posts in the archives (over the years)
complaining about Ray's ADs. None used the BOYCOTT slogans.

Ray will get plenty more of those, in time. From me and from others.
Then he'll see the effect of BOYCOTT.

I hope others will join the BOYCOTT

BOYCOTT RAY GOLDENBERG WHO RUDELY ADVERTISES IN RTC
BOYCOTT CRETINS WHO RUDELY SPAMS NEWSGROUPS
BOYCOTT BUSINESSES THAT ADVERTISE IN RTC AS RAY GOLDENBERT

GoldenAd Spammer NOT.

"CRETIN ADVERTISER GOLDENBERG" wrote


I said he violated USENET Guidelines which apply to ALL newsgroups --
NO ADS.


Not quite true. You said he violated "rules and guidelines". I asked you
twice to either cite these rules or provide a link.... and you didn't.

"Rules" would be pretty easy to understand. "Guidelines" would be open to
everyone's interpretation.

Perhaps Bob can provide us with the exact "rules" and "guidelines" so people
can see what he is talking about.


--
George Leppla http://www.countryside-travel.com

Cruise Specials BLOG http://www.countryside-travel.com/3834677_6105.htm
October 29, 2006 - SLEAZY 4! http://cruisemaster.com/sleazy4.htm
February 10, 2007 - Valentine's Group - http://cruisemaster.com/grandeur.htm

George Leppla wrote:
"CRETIN ADVERTISER GOLDENBERG" wrote


I said he violated USENET Guidelines which apply to ALL newsgroups --
NO ADS.


Not quite true. You said he violated "rules and guidelines". I asked you
twice to either cite these rules or provide a link.... and you didn't.

"Rules" would be pretty easy to understand. "Guidelines" would be open to
everyone's interpretation.

No problem with your correction, but you missed the POINT that it
wasn't
at all about USENET rules OR guidelines. Goldhaber's LIE was

DG HE decided that Ray broke the rules of the RTC charter.


The USENET Guidelines and rules of the RTC charter are not the same!

--
George Leppla http://www.countryside-travel.com

Perhaps you need to learn to read more carefully.

What about Dick Goldhaber's OTHER TWO LIES?

You probably argue what Ray Goldenberg did below (and throughout
his years of sleazy tactics for his ADs) was ethical and broke no rule
too?

Ray has used various tactics in the past to form his present SPAM
haven, with brown-nosers kissing his derriere.


1996 rec.travel.caribbean Ray tried PRIVATE spamming

To which Ray Goldenberg of Spamhouse Travel responded via private
email:
Hi Craig,(private)
Give me a call, if I can be of assistance. I would appreciate
your business.

Craig For crying out loud! Is this what you do all day? Scan the
Craig Caribbean newsgroups for suckers to sell stuff to?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


In 1997, Ray intimidated other Travel Agents who competed against
his ad:
Ray Goldenberg ,
says that this group will boycott my business
The reason being that I posted only the URL of my site

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


Really IRONIC and INTERESTING that Ray threatened to BOYCOTT
someone who post his business URL.


In 1998, Ray refined his intimidation tactic on other TAs to
harrassements:
Mr. Ray Goldenberg )
continues to "stalk" me via the internet. In the last three weeks I
have received no less than 15 onsolicated, harassing e:mails from
this individual.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------


You see, over the years, Ray has built his present SPAMMING Empire
in rec.travel.cruises through every DISHONORABLE tactic known to
mankind, to have molded the present crop of do-nothing yes-man
and Ray-worshippers like piperut and the rest of the rotten gang
who recognized Ray's ADS as ADs, but have been threathened,
harrassed, and imtimidated into their present submission.


I do not yield to AD spamming newsgroup fascists like Ray Goldenberg.

I'll spam HIS ADS as long as he spams using his ADs.

There are already HUNDREDS of posts in the archives (over the years)
complaining about Ray's ADs. None used the BOYCOTT slogans.

Ray will get plenty more of those, in time. From me and from others.
Then he'll see the effect of BOYCOTT.

I hope others will join the BOYCOTT

BOYCOTT RAY GOLDENBERG WHO RUDELY ADVERTISES IN RTC
BOYCOTT CRETINS WHO RUDELY SPAMS NEWSGROUPS
BOYCOTT BUSINESSES THAT ADVERTISE IN RTC AS RAY GOLDENBERT

GoldenAd Spammer NOT.




Through an anonymous posting ... chicken**** Reef Fish supporter ...
How's your brown nose ??? or is his **** green ... ???
Sock puppet is too kind ...

Reef Fish's protest of Ray Goldenberg's ADs and SPAM is just

BEGINNING to gather supporters, old and new -- but NONE of
them is a sockpuppet!

You think Chrissy Cruiser is my sockpuppet? LOL.

You think John Sisker is my sockpuppet? ROTFLMAO.

I don''t even KNOW the other dozen or so who had joined in
the protest!


Now I know "number6" must be one of Ray's SHILLS.

Why anyone wants to support the cretin is beyond me:

Ray has used various tactics in the past to form his present SPAM
haven, with brown-nosers kissing his derriere.


1996 rec.travel.caribbean Ray tried PRIVATE spamming

To which Ray Goldenberg of Spamhouse Travel responded via private
email:
Hi Craig,(private)
Give me a call, if I can be of assistance. I would appreciate
your business.

Craig For crying out loud! Is this what you do all day? Scan the
Craig Caribbean newsgroups for suckers to sell stuff to?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


In 1997, Ray intimidated other Travel Agents who competed against
his ad:
Ray Goldenberg ,
says that this group will boycott my business
The reason being that I posted only the URL of my site

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*------------


Really IRONIC and INTERESTING that Ray threatened to BOYCOTT
someone who post his business URL.


In 1998, Ray refined his intimidation tactic on other TAs to
harrassements:
Mr. Ray Goldenberg )
continues to "stalk" me via the internet. In the last three weeks I
have received no less than 15 onsolicated, harassing e:mails from
this individual.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------*---------------


You see, over the years, Ray has built his present SPAMMING Empire
in rec.travel.cruises through every DISHONORABLE tactic known to
mankind, to have molded the present crop of do-nothing yes-man
and Ray-worshippers like piperut and the rest of the rotten gang
who recognized Ray's ADS as ADs, but have been threathened,
harrassed, and imtimidated into their present submission.


I do not yield to AD spamming newsgroup fascists like Ray Goldenberg.

I'll spam HIS ADS as long as he spams using his ADs.

There are already HUNDREDS of posts in the archives (over the years)
complaining about Ray's ADs. None used the BOYCOTT slogans.

Ray will get plenty more of those, in time. From me and from others.
Then he'll see the effect of BOYCOTT.

I hope others will join the BOYCOTT

BOYCOTT RAY GOLDENBERG WHO RUDELY ADVERTISES IN RTC
BOYCOTT CRETINS WHO RUDELY SPAMS NEWSGROUPS
BOYCOTT BUSINESSES THAT ADVERTISE IN RTC AS RAY GOLDENBERT

GoldenAd Spammer NOT.

"CRETIN ADVERTISER GOLDENBERG" wrote


No problem with your correction, but you missed the POINT that it
wasn't
at all about USENET rules OR guidelines.

No, the point is that you keep talking about "Usenet rules and guidelines"
and I have now asked you THREE times to either post the rules and guidelines
or provide a link to them.

You have yet to do so.


--
George Leppla http://www.countryside-travel.com

Cruise Specials BLOG http://www.countryside-travel.com/3834677_6105.htm
October 29, 2006 - SLEAZY 4! http://cruisemaster.com/sleazy4.htm
February 10, 2007 - Valentine's Group - http://cruisemaster.com/grandeur.htm

George Leppla wrote:
"CRETIN ADVERTISER GOLDENBERG" wrote


No problem with your correction, but you missed the POINT that it
wasn't
at all about USENET rules OR guidelines.

No, the point is that you keep talking about "Usenet rules and guidelines"
and I have now asked you THREE times to either post the rules and guidelines
or provide a link to them.

You have yet to do so.

I had answered you at least twice. You were too busy spamming for
Ray.
Look for it YOURSELF!

SHILL!

"CRETIN ADVERTISER GOLDENBERG" wrote


I had answered you at least twice.


No, you responded to my posts, you never answered the question. This is a
question that requires a factual answer, not bombastic rhetoric or opinions.

What exactly are the "Usenet rules and guidelines" that you keep referring
to and please cite your source or provide a link.

You either know or you don't. You are either dealing from a factual
position or you aren't.


--
George Leppla http://www.countryside-travel.com

Cruise Specials BLOG http://www.countryside-travel.com/3834677_6105.htm
October 29, 2006 - SLEAZY 4! http://cruisemaster.com/sleazy4.htm
February 10, 2007 - Valentine's Group - http://cruisemaster.com/grandeur.htm