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Welcome to the USA?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3367893.stm Visitors face US security checks Most Europeans are excluded for now New US security regulations are coming into force that will see most foreign visitors having their photographs taken and fingerprints checked. The rules apply to visa holders and cover all but 28 countries. Those arriving under the visa waiver programme - which includes most Europeans - are not affected. The measures replace the old special registration programme, which was said to discriminate against Muslims and people of Middle Eastern origin. But claims of discrimination are still being made by some of those countries whose nationals are affected. Brazil has made formal complaints and started fingerprinting and photographing all US citizens arriving at its main international airports. Instant checks All 115 US airports that handle international flights and 14 major seaports are covered by the programme, under which customs officials can instantly check an immigrant or visitor's criminal background. A similar programme is to be launched at 50 land border crossings by the end of next year Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge will formally launch the programme at Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport in the southern state of Georgia. Called US-Visit, or US Visitor and Immigrant Status Indicator Technology, it will check an estimated 24 million foreign visitors who enter the US each year through airports or seaports on tourist, business and student visas. Inkless fingerprints will be taken and checked instantly against a national digital database for criminal backgrounds and any terrorist lists. Photographs will be used to help create a database for law enforcement. The process will be repeated when the foreigners leave the country as an extra security measure, and to ensure they complied with visa limitations. Fears of delays Officials in charge of the programme, which has been planned for some time and has nothing to do with the current high state of alert, say that in the long run the new checks will make travel formalities quicker to negotiate. But travel industry analysts warn that the steady tightening of security on international flights will lead to a corresponding increase in delays and cancellations. The US official in charge of the programme, Asa Hutchinson, says that will not be the case. "This takes a matter of seconds... we're taking every step to make sure that this facilitates the passengers that come through our airports and does not delay them," he said. There are concerns that the checks could foster ill-feeling. "You also have look at the costs of these policies... for example, the special registration programme resulted in 13,000 orders of deportation on people who tried to register with the government," Tim Edgar of the American Civil Liberties Union told the BBC's World Today radio programme. "That kind of response can cause problems with governments around the world that we are trying to have a better relationship with." The system was scheduled to begin on 1 January, but was delayed to avoid the busy holiday travel period. The visa waiver programme allows citizens from mostly European nations to visit the US for up to 90 days without visas. |
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![]() "Howard Long" wrote in message ... Welcome to the USA? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3367893.stm Visitors face US security checks Most Europeans are excluded for now New US security regulations are coming into force that will see most foreign visitors having their photographs taken and fingerprints checked. The rules apply to visa holders and cover all but 28 countries. So will this mean even longer queues (lines) at immigration ? Or will they have seperate lines (queues) for those on the visa waiver scheme ? |
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"Miss L. Toe" wrote in message
... So will this mean even longer queues (lines) at immigration ? I would think that you are correct, but they're saying it'll only take 15 seconds per pax. Or will they have seperate lines (queues) for those on the visa waiver scheme ? Somehow I doubt it. The same fast line for voters, slow line for non-voters. A bit like we do it in the UK ;-) Cheers, Howard |
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On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 10:30:55 +0000 (UTC), "Howard Long"
wrote: All 115 US airports that handle international flights and 14 major seaports are covered by the programme, under which customs officials can instantly check an immigrant or visitor's criminal background. This is the bit which got me - how are they supposed to instantly check databases around the world chronicalling everyone criminal history? Our states computer systems do not even talk to each other, so that when an offender goes to court in one state, his criminal history in another state is not presented to the judge. If they don't talk to other Australian states, how will they cope with talking to a foreign government? Also, they way the system works here is by way of what is called a CNI - Central Names Index. Any person having any contact with the cops is listed on the CNI - I have about 20 different entries on my CNI, all of them as a person reporting an offence, a victim or as a witness. Yet it takes our cops a couple of minutes after finding out I am "known" before they find out that there is nothing "adverse" in my history. How is this going to look to US authorities though? "Hey guys this guy is known to police in his home state...." Dave ===== NSW Rural Fire Service - become a volunteer today. http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/ |
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On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 10:30:55 +0000 (UTC), "Howard Long"
wrote: Visitors face US security checks Most Europeans are excluded for now New US security regulations are coming into force that will see most foreign visitors having their photographs taken and fingerprints checked. The rules apply to visa holders and cover all but 28 countries. The AP story on this says: " Foreigners also will be checked as they leave the country as an extra security measure and to ensure they complied with visa limitations." Does anyone know how this will work? Up to now, someone checking in in Omaha for a trip to an exit airport in, say, San Francisco, has his/her passport checked and visa pulled by the Omaha airline clerk if he or she remembers. At SFO, there is an airside bus that (I think) takes domestic arrivals into the international teminal inside of security. There has been no official scrutiny whatsoever. Where/how are they inserting it? I'm shocked to find myself in general agreement with the program provided they can meet their claims for speed and that they treat false failures as a learning tool rather than shrugging shoulders and saying, "Oh well, we're at war." |
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Dick Locke writes
The AP story on this says: " Foreigners also will be checked as they leave the country as an extra security measure and to ensure they complied with visa limitations." There could actually be an advantage here for law abiding visitors who want to return to the US. If the new system accurately records the departure time, it would provide confirmation that visitors had not overstayed their visa. I'm shocked to find myself in general agreement with the program provided they can meet their claims for speed and that they treat false failures as a learning tool rather than shrugging shoulders and saying, "Oh well, we're at war." IMHO the system needs to be 'sold' to visitors. In many countries, one's fingerprints are only taken when one has dealings with the police. There are assumptions of criminality. (I gather from posts here that this isn't always the case in the US.) Immigration procedures are often the first impression a visitor has of a country, and it makes no sense at all to **** people off for no good reason. As a system which "keeps honest people honest" it probably has its merits. But will it have any value beyond that? Some reservations which come to my mind: 1/ Fingerprints are quite easily changed. Retina scanning equipment is coming rapidly down in price and would be much harder to fool. 2/ Are fingerprints of all that many serious undesirables on record? 3/ Who will be able to access the data? If I were visiting the US to go backpacking in Yosemite, I wouldn't be all that bothered about this. But what about a highly sensitive business trip where I could be covered in embarrassment (or worse) if anyone found out? 4/ Will the land borders be covered? -- Simon Elliott http://www.ctsn.co.uk/ |
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somebody better tell THAT to the folks at the borders where they DRIVE (or
walk like in San Diego) across. There is NO NEED to do ANYTHING to LEAVE the US to go to Mexico - go thru a turnstile and keep going. The MOST that happens is that SD police set up "minors checkpoints" usually Fri or Sat PM to stop the "under 18" set from going south to drink. "Dick Locke" wrote in message ... On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 10:30:55 +0000 (UTC), "Howard Long" wrote: Visitors face US security checks Most Europeans are excluded for now New US security regulations are coming into force that will see most foreign visitors having their photographs taken and fingerprints checked. The rules apply to visa holders and cover all but 28 countries. The AP story on this says: " Foreigners also will be checked as they leave the country as an extra security measure and to ensure they complied with visa limitations." Does anyone know how this will work? Up to now, someone checking in in Omaha for a trip to an exit airport in, say, San Francisco, has his/her passport checked and visa pulled by the Omaha airline clerk if he or she remembers. At SFO, there is an airside bus that (I think) takes domestic arrivals into the international teminal inside of security. There has been no official scrutiny whatsoever. Where/how are they inserting it? I'm shocked to find myself in general agreement with the program provided they can meet their claims for speed and that they treat false failures as a learning tool rather than shrugging shoulders and saying, "Oh well, we're at war." |
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![]() "Simon Elliott" schreef in bericht ... 4/ Will the land borders be covered? From: http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/interap...lease_0332.xml "The Department of Homeland Security today also began a pilot test of exit procedures for departing passengers holding visas. A departure confirmation program using automated kiosks is being tested at Baltimore-Washington International Airport and at selected Miami Seaport cruise line terminals. Foreign visitors exiting the United States from those locations will be required to confirm their departure at the kiosk. US-VISIT officials will evaluate the tests and consider alternatives to the automated kiosks for departure confirmation throughout 2004. Congress has mandated that an automated entry-exit program be implemented at the 50 busiest land ports of entry by December 31, 2004, and at all land ports by December 31, 2005. A Request for Proposal (RFP) was issued in November to engage the private sector to help the US-VISIT program develop the optimum solutions for entry and exit processing. The contract will be awarded in May 2004." So a self-service system for registering exits. I wonder how a Chinese or Ukrainian grandmother is going to operate that system. Expect many problems with people trying to enter the US for a second time after not having properly exited. "The contract will be awarded in May 2004" To Haliburton? Sjoerd |
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![]() "DALing" daling43[delete]-at-hotmail.com schreef in bericht ... The MOST that happens is that SD police set up "minors checkpoints" usually Fri or Sat PM to stop the "under 18" set from going south to drink. Are you saying that American citizens can't go abroad when they like to? And how can the police prove that these people are planning to drink? Sjoerd |
#10
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![]() "Simon Elliott" wrote in message ... Dick Locke writes The AP story on this says: " Foreigners also will be checked as they leave the country as an extra security measure and to ensure they complied with visa limitations." There could actually be an advantage here for law abiding visitors who want to return to the US. If the new system accurately records the departure time, it would provide confirmation that visitors had not overstayed their visa. I'm shocked to find myself in general agreement with the program provided they can meet their claims for speed and that they treat false failures as a learning tool rather than shrugging shoulders and saying, "Oh well, we're at war." IMHO the system needs to be 'sold' to visitors. In many countries, one's fingerprints are only taken when one has dealings with the police. There are assumptions of criminality. (I gather from posts here that this isn't always the case in the US.) Immigration procedures are often the first impression a visitor has of a country, and it makes no sense at all to **** people off for no good reason. As a system which "keeps honest people honest" it probably has its merits. But will it have any value beyond that? Some reservations which come to my mind: 1/ Fingerprints are quite easily changed. Retina scanning equipment is coming rapidly down in price and would be much harder to fool. I'm not sure that fingerprints are so easily changed. However, a significant factor in the US is that fingerprint identification is accepted as proof of identity as a matter of law in US courts. Retinal scans, as far as I'm aware, are not. Though the latter may be more accurate, until it has been tested, judicially, enough times, it wouldn't automatically be considerable admissible evidence. 2/ Are fingerprints of all that many serious undesirables on record? In the US, yes. As you indicated, fingerprinting is fairly routine in the US and, to a great extent, fingerprint databases have been consolidated. Of course, any criminal activity will generate a fingerprint record, e.g. arrest (with or without subsequent conviction). However, many other activities will result in a fingerprint record being created: obtaining a drivers license or state ID in many states, obtaining a professional license, becoming a naturalized citizen, etc. 3/ Who will be able to access the data? If I were visiting the US to go backpacking in Yosemite, I wouldn't be all that bothered about this. But what about a highly sensitive business trip where I could be covered in embarrassment (or worse) if anyone found out? This is an issue that concerns Americans as well as foreign visitors. I don't care if the FBI has access to my fingerprint information, but I'd be more concerned if, for example, insurance companies, credit reporting agencies, etc., had access to personal government-collected data. In the US, the right to travel between states is protected by the Constitution. This protection does not extend to foreign travel by US citizens (at least as the Constitution is currently interpretted -- this is why the US government can prevent US citizens from travelling to Cuba), nor does it apply to foreign visitors coming to the US. Admission to the US (or, for that matter, any sovereign nation) is at the sufferance of the government -- permission can be granted or denied. Accordingly, there is no "right" to enter the US anonymously nor, for that matter, can I think of any other nation which affords this as a right. I do agree, though, that safeguarding entry information from, as in your example, business competitors is in the interest of the US government. What company would want to do business here if their competitors could find out what they're up to? 4/ Will the land borders be covered? I would assume yes, though our land borders are notoriously porous. -- Simon Elliott http://www.ctsn.co.uk/ |
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