Qantas Cabin Crew or Pampered Celebrities?

zxc wrote in message
. ..

They have also refused to sleep above traffic lights and recently demanded
more
English television channels.

Would the traffic light problem have something to do with the extra noise
that results from cars and trucks revving up and changing gear after the
lights turn green?

Same thing happens in those suburban streets where speed bumps are laid to
calm down the speeding traffic. Only result is the cars slow down for the
traffic calming devices than speed up which involves extra noise when
changing gear and revving the motor. Of course the car drivers sometimes
make extra noise on purpose to annoy the folk who talked the local council
into those traffic calming devices.

Cheers
Peter Cokley

Terry Russell wrote:

They get to travel and sleep in luxury digs while big
strong he-men get flea pits and are too tired to care.


Who calls them flea-pits??? Don't tell me you're Paris
Hilton's latest toyboy? These idiots are workers, not
****ing management, they're already getting it good, yet
they still whinge/whine and demand more. That's the sort of
pathetic unionism that is destroying this country.


Thats lazy fairy capitalism for you.


No it's lazy, fairy socialism at its' worst actually. It's
the unions, not the companies. They might as well crawl up
the arses of the wharfies with that sort of pathetic
attitude, and as for your "he-men" comment, the wharfies
aren't exactly pussys even if they are lazy leeches like
your Quantas friends.


Maybe you should get someone else to negotiate your contract?


Maybe I've got a bit too much pride than to whine like a
bitch because there's a hole in my curtain (in a room being
paid for by my employer).

Always heard the jokes about the fags at Quantas, this just
seems to prove that it aint just jokes.

On Wed, 04 Feb 2004 02:55:34 GMT, "LDL"
wrote:

Here are some of the URLs that shows true airline quality.

No, those are web sites that show some people bitching about things.
There's no serious attempt at objectivity.

Have you heard that the tourists paid for their flights and Qantas staff
goes for free?

Sarcasm
It's worse than that: Qantas staff get *PAID*!!!!
/Sarcasm

They are entitles to have a sleep in and I don't hear about
quick turn-around of Qantas staff as many of them have been there for many
years.

Suppose, for whatever reason, you want to work for an airline.
Suppose you are Australian. Suppose you like working long-haul. How
many options do you have?

Qantas staff already gets very good hotels in Singapore Hong Kong, London
Auckland, Christ Church, Las Angeles, New York and many other countries
(4-star and above) and in reality they don't deserve 5-star hotels when they
produce 3-star service during their flights.

Even your own (stupid) URL shows that they, apparently, produce
"4-star service" during their flights!

Further, why *don't* they deserve "5-star hotels"??? This is a
condition of employment issue, just like whether *you* get a reserved
parking space at *your* workplace, whether your tea or coffee is
subsidized by *your* employer, how many weeks holiday time you get,
even whether you can bring your spouse to the annual party!

From personal experience as well as many others comments (when you view the
airline quality web page),

.... which notes "4 star" not "3 star" as you allege, and I'd just
remark that there are only two "5 star" airlines, so in other words by
your preferred "ranking" URL, Qantas is as good or better than every
American or European airline...

you will notice that their treatment to
passengers during their flights are very quite cumbersome. How many night
flights (when I cannot sleep during flights) I call for service when to be
ignored to a point that I leave my seat to approach them and see them
sitting together chatting away at the gallery. Many times they forget the
order or simply provide it at the end of the flight.

So what? This is a "pay and benefits" issue for Qantas staff, and
nothing to do with you...

Many passengers complain to Qantas but falls on some deaf ears. It would
take someone that has plenty of shares in Qantas, a Qantas Club membership
with Qantas Frequent Flyers gold to get anywhere as they treat their
business class and first class passengers with royalty.

Many people complain to many companies, and some of the complaints are
even justified. None of which have anything to do with pay and
benefit issues between Qantas staff and management...

They are pure whimps and I am sure that there would be plenty of
air-stewards (both male and female) that would take up the position
especially after the collapse of Ansett so before they whinge more, they
should give appropriate service before they are considered a better hotel
etc. I can understand that they should have a gym in the hotel.

So you'd be happy if a hotel you were staying at for business (i.e.
not paid out of your pocket) used poor linens, was noisy, slow, etc?

"They work hard" ****, that is the biggest wank I have heard.

You are an obvious cretin...


Malc.

"Malcolm Weir" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 04 Feb 2004 02:55:34 GMT, "LDL"
wrote:

Here are some of the URLs that shows true airline quality.

No, those are web sites that show some people bitching about things.
There's no serious attempt at objectivity.

Take a good look at other airlines such as Singapore Airlines, Cathay
Pacifyc and Emarites. They clearly show the good service they get all the
time. The forum is not just a bitching session but a forum. Qantas
certainly needs to upgrade their standards in both domestic and
international flights.

Also the URL I showed is rocognised around the world for airline quality.

http://www.cathaypacific.com/intl/ab...101116,00.html

http://www.emiratesairline.com/About...rds/Awards.asp
http://www.emiratesairline.com/About...ePageID=1916#1
http://www.emiratesairline.com/About...ePageID=1916#1

Have you heard that the tourists paid for their flights and Qantas staff
goes for free?

Sarcasm
It's worse than that: Qantas staff get *PAID*!!!!
/Sarcasm

They are entitles to have a sleep in and I don't hear about
quick turn-around of Qantas staff as many of them have been there for
many
years.

Suppose, for whatever reason, you want to work for an airline.
Suppose you are Australian. Suppose you like working long-haul. How
many options do you have?

Qantas staff already gets very good hotels in Singapore Hong Kong, London
Auckland, Christ Church, Las Angeles, New York and many other countries
(4-star and above) and in reality they don't deserve 5-star hotels when
they
produce 3-star service during their flights.

Even your own (stupid) URL shows that they, apparently, produce
"4-star service" during their flights!

I have to sat that Qantas is not the worst but certainly not the best. When
you make a comparasion to the former Ansett Australia (before it crashed, it
was a 5-Star Airline), Qantas is certainly is certainly below that

Further, why *don't* they deserve "5-star hotels"??? This is a
condition of employment issue, just like whether *you* get a reserved
parking space at *your* workplace, whether your tea or coffee is
subsidized by *your* employer, how many weeks holiday time you get,
even whether you can bring your spouse to the annual party!

Are their own houses, apartment etc are to that standard? We cannot judge
but all they need is a place to crash comfortably and that does't mean.
They are general staff and not top executives. When I have been overseas,
the places I find quite comfortable were 3 1/2 stars and I was quite happy
with that.

When in Hong Kong, my 3 1/2 star Majestic Hotel was certainly all I need
after a business meeting. In Beijing, The 3 1/2 star Tian-Tian Hotel again
had no problems although their lights certainly needed some work. When in
Singapore the British Airlines owned 3 1/2 star New Park Hotel is so much
quieter than my cousin's apartment (15 stories up with a wonderful view of
the bay and you could easily see Indonesia). Kuala Lumpur, the 3 1/2 star
Capitol Hotel is quieter than my parents in law home as I don't hear the
mosque callings early in the morning (although no Qantas airlines land in KL
or Beijing). The list goes on

They are there for work and not for a holiday is my entire statement. If
they want better accomodation, they can pay extra for that and not the

From personal experience as well as many others comments (when you view
the
airline quality web page),

... which notes "4 star" not "3 star" as you allege, and I'd just
remark that there are only two "5 star" airlines, so in other words by
your preferred "ranking" URL, Qantas is as good or better than every
American or European airline...

Not against British Airlines and the other two I have mentioned earlier.
Also still not to the standard to the former Ansett Australia Airlines.

you will notice that their treatment to
passengers during their flights are very quite cumbersome. How many
night
flights (when I cannot sleep during flights) I call for service when to
be
ignored to a point that I leave my seat to approach them and see them
sitting together chatting away at the gallery. Many times they forget
the
order or simply provide it at the end of the flight.

So what? This is a "pay and benefits" issue for Qantas staff, and
nothing to do with you...

They have to show something before they can deserve a pay rise. Has their
service risen. As a matter of fact they have been quite sloppy (with the
exception of business and first class passengers).

Many passengers complain to Qantas but falls on some deaf ears. It would
take someone that has plenty of shares in Qantas, a Qantas Club
membership
with Qantas Frequent Flyers gold to get anywhere as they treat their
business class and first class passengers with royalty.

Many people complain to many companies, and some of the complaints are
even justified. None of which have anything to do with pay and
benefit issues between Qantas staff and management...

Have something to show before you demand benefits. They do not own the
company, the share holders does. Mind you that all Qantas staff who have
worked over a year has an equivalent of AUD $1,000 worth of shared as a
bonus to them.

They are pure whimps and I am sure that there would be plenty of
air-stewards (both male and female) that would take up the position
especially after the collapse of Ansett so before they whinge more, they
should give appropriate service before they are considered a better hotel
etc. I can understand that they should have a gym in the hotel.

So you'd be happy if a hotel you were staying at for business (i.e.
not paid out of your pocket) used poor linens, was noisy, slow, etc?

I am not talking about a three bit motel but at least a 3 1/2 Star hotel.
currently Qantas staff are using 4 Star Hotel such as the Raffles in
Singapore. I can only agree with the staff and they have not got it is that
a gym is becoming more of a necessity for use when in a foreign country.

"They work hard" ****, that is the biggest wank I have heard.

You are an obvious cretin...

I am only going by my experience in many different airlines. Some of them
(not Qantas) I really doubt that I should call them an airline.

Malc.

"Hunter1" wrote in message
...

Always heard the jokes about the fags at Quantas, this just
seems to prove that it aint just jokes.

You've been reading Francks post too much.... :-p

cheers

On Wed, 04 Feb 2004 21:41:31 GMT, "LDL"
wrote:

Also the URL I showed is rocognised around the world for airline quality.

Not universally...

{ Snip ]

Further, why *don't* they deserve "5-star hotels"??? This is a
condition of employment issue, just like whether *you* get a reserved
parking space at *your* workplace, whether your tea or coffee is
subsidized by *your* employer, how many weeks holiday time you get,
even whether you can bring your spouse to the annual party!

Are their own houses, apartment etc are to that standard?

Not relevant! This is a contract issue between the staff and the
airline and the airline and the hotels.

If I have a contract that says I will be paid $X plus various
benefits, then if the benefits are not up to scratch, I have a
legitimate complaint. And if I manage a contract with a hotel, and
the hotel fails to deliver, then I have a legitimate complaint.

We cannot judge
but all they need is a place to crash comfortably and that does't mean.

The minimum standard that they "need" is no more relevant than the
minimum wage that they could live on.

They are general staff and not top executives.

Why should there be two standards, then? In both cases, there is an
agreement between the individual and the company as to the sort of
accommodation that is appropriate when travel ling on business.

When I have been overseas,
the places I find quite comfortable were 3 1/2 stars and I was quite happy
with that.

Gosh. And how often do you go overseas? Is it more or less than
every single working week?

When in Hong Kong, my 3 1/2 star Majestic Hotel was certainly all I need
after a business meeting. In Beijing, The 3 1/2 star Tian-Tian Hotel again
had no problems although their lights certainly needed some work. When in
Singapore the British Airlines owned 3 1/2 star New Park Hotel is so much
quieter than my cousin's apartment (15 stories up with a wonderful view of
the bay and you could easily see Indonesia). Kuala Lumpur, the 3 1/2 star
Capitol Hotel is quieter than my parents in law home as I don't hear the
mosque callings early in the morning (although no Qantas airlines land in KL
or Beijing). The list goes on

And who is rating these hotels? Has it occurred to you that the
alleged "5 star Mainz Hilton" may be less good than the 3/5 star
Majestic in HKG?

And further, notice that the complaints include the noise, so quite
possibly the staff would be happy with a good, quiet hotel with a
lower bogus star rating (as if that means anything) than a noisy
allegedly luxury hotel with poor quality linen and inadequate sound
proofing...

They are there for work and not for a holiday is my entire statement. If
they want better accomodation, they can pay extra for that and not the

Quite. Which is why they deserve what they agreed when they
negotiated the contract: BECAUSE they are there for work. They cannot
decide midway through that they're bored and want to go home...
BECAUSE they are there for work!

You appear to have a very strange idea of the realities of travel ling
for business as opposed to pleasure!

From personal experience as well as many others comments (when you view
the
airline quality web page),

... which notes "4 star" not "3 star" as you allege, and I'd just
remark that there are only two "5 star" airlines, so in other words by
your preferred "ranking" URL, Qantas is as good or better than every
American or European airline...

Not against British Airlines and the other two I have mentioned earlier.

According to your URL, they are equally ranked with BA. CX is one of
the two "5 star" carriers, and Emirates is a 4 star just like BA and
QF.

Are you beginning to see the problem with your fixation on this "star
rating" thing?

Also still not to the standard to the former Ansett Australia Airlines.

Yet the former Ansett flew very very few international sectors.

And when Ansett flew, global standards *were* higher (I'm sad to say).

And lastly Ansett's management was so good that they... failed.

you will notice that their treatment to
passengers during their flights are very quite cumbersome. How many
night
flights (when I cannot sleep during flights) I call for service when to
be
ignored to a point that I leave my seat to approach them and see them
sitting together chatting away at the gallery. Many times they forget
the
order or simply provide it at the end of the flight.

So what? This is a "pay and benefits" issue for Qantas staff, and
nothing to do with you...

They have to show something before they can deserve a pay rise.

If the contract says they get a certain standard of accommodation (and
it does, believe me), then *you* are inventing any notion of a raise.
They are just insisting on getting what they agreed. Would you accept
a cut in your pay resulting from your bank deciding they'll charge you
a fee for handling your paycheck?

Has their service risen.

Irrelevant. What they agreed to is not being provided, and it's not
even the airline that they are complaining about!

Has it dawned on you that the airline *pays* those hotels to provide
accommodation? If you paid for hotels for a bunch of people, would
you want to know if they didn't get what you expected for your money?

As a matter of fact they have been quite sloppy (with the
exception of business and first class passengers).

Again, so?

Many passengers complain to Qantas but falls on some deaf ears. It would
take someone that has plenty of shares in Qantas, a Qantas Club
membership
with Qantas Frequent Flyers gold to get anywhere as they treat their
business class and first class passengers with royalty.

Many people complain to many companies, and some of the complaints are
even justified. None of which have anything to do with pay and
benefit issues between Qantas staff and management...

Have something to show before you demand benefits.

Nope. You can, and should, demand what you agreed to with the
management when you took the job.

They do not own the company, the share holders does.

Yep. And it's the shareholders who are paying for the substandard
accommodation...

Mind you that all Qantas staff who have
worked over a year has an equivalent of AUD $1,000 worth of shared as a
bonus to them.

Part of their contract, I believe. Just like the rest of the pay and
benefit issues, like vacation time, travel privileges, work rules,
etc.

[ Snip ]

So you'd be happy if a hotel you were staying at for business (i.e.
not paid out of your pocket) used poor linens, was noisy, slow, etc?

I am not talking about a three bit motel but at least a 3 1/2 Star hotel.
currently Qantas staff are using 4 Star Hotel such as the Raffles in
Singapore.

Which was not mentioned. Has it not dawned on you that *if* you are
booked into the Raffles, and the bed linen is terrible, *then* you
have a legitimate complaint with the Raffles?

I can only agree with the staff and they have not got it is that
a gym is becoming more of a necessity for use when in a foreign country.

"They work hard" ****, that is the biggest wank I have heard.

You are an obvious cretin...

I am only going by my experience in many different airlines. Some of them
(not Qantas) I really doubt that I should call them an airline.

None of which has anything to do with the management of an airline's
responsibility to provide a specific, contracted standard of
accommodation to their crews when overnighting, and the hotel's
responsibility to deliver the standard of accommodation that they
contracted with the airline to deliver.

Malc.

"Hunter1" wrote in message
...
Terry Russell wrote:

They get to travel and sleep in luxury digs while big
strong he-men get flea pits and are too tired to care.


Who calls them flea-pits??? Don't tell me you're Paris
Hilton's latest toyboy? These idiots are workers, not

Okay, I shan't. Make up your mind, toyboy or tinkerbell?

****ing management, they're already getting it good, yet
they still whinge/whine and demand more. That's the sort of
pathetic unionism that is destroying this country.

I seems that you desire individuals cease striving
for their own benefit and sacrifice for the greater good.
Sounds like socialism.

Thats lazy fairy capitalism for you.


No it's lazy, fairy socialism at its' worst actually. It's
the unions, not the companies. They might as well crawl up
the arses of the wharfies with that sort of pathetic
attitude, and as for your "he-men" comment, the wharfies
aren't exactly pussys even if they are lazy leeches like
your Quantas friends.

They are just pushing as far as they can, so should you.

http://reference.allrefer.com/encycl.../laissezf.html
http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...aissez%20faire

"I'm all right jack" "what the market will bear"
"everyone for themselves" "dog-eat-dog"
"maximum efficiency = minimum effort"
all good free market principles

Maybe you should get someone else to negotiate your contract?


Maybe I've got a bit too much pride than to whine like a
bitch because there's a hole in my curtain (in a room being
paid for by my employer).

What do you do when the Quaintass staff don't give
perfect service when you are on a business trip?

O

LONG waits for hotel rooms with fridges in Los Angeles; and

Because hotel rooms with fridges are very rare in the USA (even in 5
star accomodation)...

in article , matt weber at
wrote on 2/4/04 10:19 PM:

O

LONG waits for hotel rooms with fridges in Los Angeles; and

Because hotel rooms with fridges are very rare in the USA (even in 5
star accomodation)...


No. They are extremely common - they just are usually full of overpriced
mini-bar booze with no room for your own stuff.

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
wrote in message
news:BC472A21.1FE81%walkabout@TAKEOUTTHETRASHTOREP LY.ns.sympatico.ca...
in article , matt weber at
wrote on 2/4/04 10:19 PM:

O

LONG waits for hotel rooms with fridges in Los Angeles; and

Because hotel rooms with fridges are very rare in the USA (even in 5
star accomodation)...


No. They are extremely common - they just are usually full of overpriced
mini-bar booze with no room for your own stuff.

They're very common in my travels. I'm at a Hampton Inn right now with Ref.
& Microwave. Holiday Inn Express also has them in most rooms. It seems to
be more of a "Middle Class" thing. 5 Stars & Cheapies usually don't have
them.