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Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 27th, 2004, 03:35 AM
zzyyxx
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Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

Why do they insist on putting their flags onto their backpacks and whatnot?
I'm an American who's done quite a bit of traveling in Europe in the last
couple years and haven't experienced any problems with people disliking or
being rude to me. So why do they feel the need to proclaim that they're not
American? Like you wouldn't be able to tell from their accents! It's kind of
insulting to me too, because they don't want to be mistaken for an American,
like there's something wrong with being American.
  #2  
Old June 27th, 2004, 04:16 AM
Cyril & Sandy Alberga
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Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

zzyyxx wrote:

Why do they insist on putting their flags onto their backpacks and whatnot?
I'm an American who's done quite a bit of traveling in Europe in the last
couple years and haven't experienced any problems with people disliking or
being rude to me. So why do they feel the need to proclaim that they're not
American? Like you wouldn't be able to tell from their accents! It's kind of
insulting to me too, because they don't want to be mistaken for an American,
like there's something wrong with being American.


Have you ever considered that they might be proud to be Australian, New
Zealanders, etc.? In the past my wife and I traveled in Europe with
American flags on our backpacks, and nobody accused us of trying to
prove we weren't Canadian.

  #3  
Old June 27th, 2004, 05:35 AM
Aramis
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Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

No, it's the distinction from the American thing.

If your personal experience doesn't bear it out, consider yourself
fortunate. You do read the news, right?




"Cyril & Sandy Alberga" wrote in message
...
zzyyxx wrote:

Why do they insist on putting their flags onto their backpacks and

whatnot?
I'm an American who's done quite a bit of traveling in Europe in the

last
couple years and haven't experienced any problems with people disliking

or
being rude to me. So why do they feel the need to proclaim that they're

not
American? Like you wouldn't be able to tell from their accents! It's

kind of
insulting to me too, because they don't want to be mistaken for an

American,
like there's something wrong with being American.


Have you ever considered that they might be proud to be Australian, New
Zealanders, etc.? In the past my wife and I traveled in Europe with
American flags on our backpacks, and nobody accused us of trying to
prove we weren't Canadian.



  #4  
Old June 27th, 2004, 05:45 AM
Pete
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

No, it's the distinction from the American thing.

Really? Have you interviewed a significant number of them to verify
your claim? Australians do not need a flag to separate themselves
from Americans as their accent is quite different.


Pete


  #5  
Old June 27th, 2004, 03:27 PM
Bjorn Olsson
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Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

"Pete" wrote in message hlink.net...
No, it's the distinction from the American thing.


Really? Have you interviewed a significant number of them to verify
your claim? Australians do not need a flag to separate themselves
from Americans as their accent is quite different.


Also many Swedes, Norwegians, Swiss, Dutch, Danes, etc, put flags on
their backpacks, which presumably has nothing to do with trying to
avoid being mistaken for americans.

I think it is a "small country phenomenon", since the French, British,
and Americans seem to do this much more rarely.

Bjorn
  #6  
Old June 27th, 2004, 05:43 PM
Aramis
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Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

I guess you could say I've interviewed a few Canadians on the topic - since
I am one, and I have travelled to Europe 11 times, 5 as a backpacker in my
"youth" - ahem.

Of course Europeans can tell and Aussie or Kiwi from a North American, but
unless you have a pronounced Southern drawl, a Canadian will almost always
be presumed to be an American at first glance. I'm quite good at sourcing
accents but many of my friends and family can't source an Aussie from a
Kiwi, forma South African, nor can they differentiate different UK accents,
so I assume there are a number of Europeans who can't tell any North
American accent from another.

If population tends translate into travels Europeans will see 10 times as
many Americans as Canadians. It is only natural to generalize based on those
kinds of real life encounters.

You can count a far greater number of truly generous encounters in Europe,
as a Canadian, if the people you are interacting with know you are a
Canadian. It's not absolute, nothing is, but I have had dozens of encounters
where initial aloofness dissipated once the individual I was interacting
with asked, or figured out that I was a Canadian.

If you would like some examples;

- A trucker in the Netherlands turned around to pick me up after he saw the
flag on my backpack.

- I have never had to answer a single question crossing a border when
displaying my passport - American backpackers I have been travelling with
had to empty their backpacks and were questioned privately on several
occasions.

It even extends beyond Europeans -once when I hooked up with some Kiwis in
Ireland and was invited back to their London flat for a few days, one of
their flat mates was particularly cold towards me. He wouldn't even look at,
or speak to me as we piled in the VW to head to a pub the first night I was
there. 10 minutes after we arrived at the pub one of the other folks asks me
something about Canada and this distant guy gets a quizzical look on his
face, comes over, has me confirm I am Canadian and then apologizes for his
behaviour because he thought I was a Yank. After that we drank and snag for
days - ah Europe and youth!.

The fallout from American foreign policy and cultural myopia is a fact. It
affects some people more than others, and may not at all dictate the way
some people react to tourists. It is enough of a factor, overall to be
noticed by those who are most likely to get mistaken for an American, eh?




"Pete" wrote in message
link.net...
No, it's the distinction from the American thing.


Really? Have you interviewed a significant number of them to verify
your claim? Australians do not need a flag to separate themselves
from Americans as their accent is quite different.


Pete




  #7  
Old June 27th, 2004, 06:19 PM
Cyril & Sandy Alberga
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

Aramis wrote:
I guess you could say I've interviewed a few Canadians on the topic - since
I am one, and I have travelled to Europe 11 times, 5 as a backpacker in my
"youth" - ahem.

Of course Europeans can tell and Aussie or Kiwi from a North American, but
unless you have a pronounced Southern drawl, a Canadian will almost always
be presumed to be an American at first glance. I'm quite good at sourcing
accents but many of my friends and family can't source an Aussie from a
Kiwi, forma South African, nor can they differentiate different UK accents,
so I assume there are a number of Europeans who can't tell any North
American accent from another.

If population tends translate into travels Europeans will see 10 times as
many Americans as Canadians. It is only natural to generalize based on those
kinds of real life encounters.

You can count a far greater number of truly generous encounters in Europe,
as a Canadian, if the people you are interacting with know you are a
Canadian. It's not absolute, nothing is, but I have had dozens of encounters
where initial aloofness dissipated once the individual I was interacting
with asked, or figured out that I was a Canadian.

If you would like some examples;

- A trucker in the Netherlands turned around to pick me up after he saw the
flag on my backpack.

- I have never had to answer a single question crossing a border when
displaying my passport - American backpackers I have been travelling with
had to empty their backpacks and were questioned privately on several
occasions.

It even extends beyond Europeans -once when I hooked up with some Kiwis in
Ireland and was invited back to their London flat for a few days, one of
their flat mates was particularly cold towards me. He wouldn't even look at,
or speak to me as we piled in the VW to head to a pub the first night I was
there. 10 minutes after we arrived at the pub one of the other folks asks me
something about Canada and this distant guy gets a quizzical look on his
face, comes over, has me confirm I am Canadian and then apologizes for his
behaviour because he thought I was a Yank. After that we drank and snag for
days - ah Europe and youth!.

The fallout from American foreign policy and cultural myopia is a fact. It
affects some people more than others, and may not at all dictate the way
some people react to tourists. It is enough of a factor, overall to be
noticed by those who are most likely to get mistaken for an American, eh?



Well, my wife and I have traveled fairly extensively since 1959
(actually, she started as a bicycle leader for American Youth Hostels in
Europe in 1954 (or was it '53?)). We have been in Europe a fair number
of times, including during the past few years, as well as in Japan,
Argentina, Jamaica, Russia, Mongolia, Viet Nam, Australia and New
Zealand, just to name a few of our recent trips. We have never hidden
our country of origin (although we tend to be mistaken for Canadians
until we disabuse people of that idea -- nothing against Canadian, we
love traveling in Canada too). And we have had many, many special
things happen, and few if any negative ones.

For example, we were in Japan last month, and took a day trip to a town
(Mikawa, near Kanazawa) for a Shinto festival. I was invited to pull
one of the floats for a couple of blocks, and then we were invited into
someones house, where he was entertaining dozens of relatives, friends
and associates. They even put on an impromptu tea ceremony for us, and
tried to talk us into staying the night.

We have been dragged to a governor's tea in Simla, invited into a home
in Istafahan (pre revolution, admittedly), given brandy "on the house"
in a small restaurant in France, and gotten all sorts of help in Oz and
Kiwi-land, etc.

I could go on, but I'm not sure that being from the States keeps you
from having nice things happen.

Cyril Alberga
  #8  
Old June 28th, 2004, 07:13 AM
Miguel Cruz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

Aramis wrote:
- A trucker in the Netherlands turned around to pick me up after he saw the
flag on my backpack.


You think that driving by at 120 km/h he had marked you as an American?

- I have never had to answer a single question crossing a border when
displaying my passport - American backpackers I have been travelling with
had to empty their backpacks and were questioned privately on several
occasions.


I have never had to empty my backpack crossing a border (except into the UK,
but they're special) when displaying my American passport - Canadians I have
been traveling with had to empty their backpacks and were questioned
privately on several occasions.

It even extends beyond Europeans -once when I hooked up with some Kiwis in
Ireland and was invited back to their London flat for a few days, one of
their flat mates was particularly cold towards me. He wouldn't even look at,
or speak to me as we piled in the VW to head to a pub the first night I was
there. 10 minutes after we arrived at the pub one of the other folks asks me
something about Canada and this distant guy gets a quizzical look on his
face, comes over, has me confirm I am Canadian and then apologizes for his
behaviour because he thought I was a Yank. After that we drank and snag for
days - ah Europe and youth!.


Sounds to me like the guy was an idiot. If someone was treating Canadians
that way I wouldn't drink with him.

miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
  #9  
Old June 28th, 2004, 09:09 PM
Peter L
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags


"Cyril & Sandy Alberga" wrote in message
...
zzyyxx wrote:

Why do they insist on putting their flags onto their backpacks and

whatnot?
I'm an American who's done quite a bit of traveling in Europe in the

last
couple years and haven't experienced any problems with people disliking

or
being rude to me. So why do they feel the need to proclaim that they're

not
American? Like you wouldn't be able to tell from their accents! It's

kind of
insulting to me too, because they don't want to be mistaken for an

American,
like there's something wrong with being American.


Have you ever considered that they might be proud to be Australian, New
Zealanders, etc.? In the past my wife and I traveled in Europe with
American flags on our backpacks, and nobody accused us of trying to
prove we weren't Canadian.


That's funny.



  #10  
Old June 27th, 2004, 05:42 AM
Pete
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Canadians, Kiwis, Aussies and their flags

Why do they insist on putting their flags onto their backpacks and
whatnot?

Are you implying that only Americans can be patriotic?

Like you wouldn't be able to tell from their accents!


I assure you that almost no European will be able to distinguish between
the accents of Canadians & Americans. Lots of Canadians sound just
like Midwestern Americans except for the occasional difference in "out"
("oot") as in "about."


Pete


 




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