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#21
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message ... writes: Except for that holy day of obligation & all that. I've never heard of that. What is it? We are not frightened by this age-old, and still lame, threat. "We"? It's not a threat, it's an observation. If you want people to like you, you should avoid doing things that alienate them. Is that referring to Christians, Jews, Muslims or just who? |
#22
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
"James A. Donald" wrote in message ... Mike Hunt The issue isn't that the Rabbi wanted the Christmas ornaments removed, but he wanted representation of his religion a this public facility. Christmas is a universal celebration, heavily celebrated by pagans such as Chinese and Japanese. It is intended to be universal. A noble sentiment, but far far far from anywhere near reality. Lots of luck trying to promote it. - the slogan being "peace on earth and goodwill to all men", not "Peace between Christians while we make war on everyone else" Whenever someone wishes you "happy holidays" he is implicitly claiming that Christmas is "Peace between Christians while we make war on everyone else", which if the recipient happens to be a Christian, is an insult. |
#23
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
On Wed, 13 Dec 2006 02:30:05 +0100, Mxsmanic wrote:
Al Klein writes: That's a nice lie, but it doesn't fly in the face of Christian campaigns like "Jesus is the reason for the season" and "put the Christ back into Christmas". Some people may say such things; I do not. Christmas is just an excuse for a day or two off work and for some nice meals, decorations, and presents. You can't have it both ways. I agree. But I think Christmas is fine as a secular holiday, even though I consider the religious connotations stupid and inappropriate. I think calling it Festivus (for the rest of us) would be finer. Ben |
#24
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
Sancho Panza writes:
Is that referring to Christians, Jews, Muslims or just who? It refers to human beings in general. Very few people are capable of being kind and fair to people they dislike. -- Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail. |
#25
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
Ben Kaufman writes:
I think calling it Festivus (for the rest of us) would be finer. Festivus sounds like a disease of some sort, but I have no problem with the idea of a different name. But not "seasons greetings" or anything totally bland like that. -- Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail. |
#26
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
Mike Hunt wrote: The issue isn't that the Rabbi wanted the Christmas ornaments removed, but he wanted representation of his religion a this public facility. That request was denied, even though the last Supreme Court case on the subject agreed with the Rabbi. The fact that the airport management took down the Christmas ornaments leads me to believe that they knew they were in violation of that ruling . Why didn't they simply allow the Menorah to be displayed? Could it be they are anti-semitic Could it be because the official national holiday is Christmas, not Hannukah? Putting up a menorrah for Christmas makes no more sense than putting up an Easter Bunny for Halloween. Wrong holiday. Should there be a Jewish holiday? Should the US have a holiday for the Eid that ends Ramadan? Maybe. But that's another issue. We have a holiday that celebrates Christmas and like it our not this is a Christian holiday. If someone doesn't like it he doesn't have to participate. But unless you want to try to ban Christmas then people should grow up and leave it alone. |
#27
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message ... Sancho Panza writes: Is that referring to Christians, Jews, Muslims or just who? It refers to human beings in general. Very few people are capable of being kind and fair to people they dislike. Do Jews or Buddhists or Taoists "dislike" the other groups in the sense that they are "disliked" by others? |
#28
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
"James A. Donald"
Christmas is a universal celebration, heavily celebrated by pagans such as Chinese and Japanese. It is intended to be universal. "Sancho Panza" A noble sentiment, but far far far from anywhere near reality. Observe Singapore at Christmas time. Christmas is universal, except among those nursing grievances against Christianity and Christians. If you wish a Singaporean ancestor worshipper "happy holidays" he will wonder if you have checked your calendar lately. -- ---------------------- We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state. http://www.jim.com/ James A. Donald |
#29
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
Sound of Trumpet wrote: http://www.towardtradition.org/index.cfm?PAGE_ID=235 12.11.2006 Jews Strive to Restore Christmas Trees Jews Strive to Restore Sea-Tac Airport's Christmas Trees By Rabbi Daniel Lapin Well here we go again. It is so utterly predictable. Like clockwork. It's December and time for another skirmish in the annual battle against Christmas. What compels me to comment is that this time it's not the usual secular fanatic who's responsible for doing things that evict Christianity from the culture. No, on this sad and alarming occasion it's a deeply religious, well-intentioned rabbi who has unwittingly stumbled into a situation that will place his denomination (and mine)-Orthodox Judaism-in a terrible, negative light. For at least ten years, Sea-Tac Airport near Seattle has displayed several large, beautifully decorated Christmas trees each December. With lawyer in tow, a local rabbi recently threatened to sue the Port of Seattle if the airport didn't add a Chanukah menorah to the holiday display. Yielding to the ultimatum was not an option for airport management, skittish at the best of times since 9-11. Understandably, they interpreted the rabbi's threat as only the first. It would not be hard to imagine Seattle's Islamic community stepping forward with their own lawyer to demand a Moslem symbol be included as well. With deft turn of phrase, Sea-Tac public affairs manager Terri-Ann Betancourt explained that at the busiest travel time of the year, while Sea-Tac was focused on getting passengers through the airport, she and her staff didn't have time "to play cultural anthropologists." Threatening a lawsuit, I feel, violates the Jewish principle known in Hebrew as Kiddush HaShem, interpreted in the Talmud, part of ancient Jewish wisdom, as an action that encourages people to admire Jews. One need only read the comments on the Internet following the news accounts of the tree removal, to know that most people are feeling indignant and hurt. They certainly are not feeling more warmly toward Jews as a result of this mess. After this, most people are beginning to understand why Hitler wanted the jews removed from his country. Here I disclose that I know the rabbi involved, am friendly with him, and am sure that he didn't intend this outcome. I like him, which makes it painful for me to point out that when one throws a punch (which is what bringing a lawyer and threatening to sue is equivalent to) and one gets decked in return, one cannot plead that one didn't intend that outcome. The outcome, whether intended or not, is that now vast numbers of passengers, most of whom are probably Christian, will be deprived of the cheerful holiday sight of pretty Christmas trees. What is more, they will know that their deprivation was caused by a Jewish rabbi. The rabbi's lawyer told a television reporter, "There is a concern here that the Jewish community will be portrayed as the Grinch." Try assholes. No, Mr. Lawyer, it is not that Jews will be "portrayed" as the grinch. Sadly, now we are the grinch. You made us the grinch. Now what is to be done? I have three requests: Too late. You people have proven yourselves to be petty pieces of ****. I am asking every reader of this column to sign a petition on the Toward Tradition website beseeching Sea-Tac management to restore the Christmas trees. I am asking every reader of this column to forward it to others who might be willing to sign this petition. I am asking Jews in the Puget Sound region to join national radio host, Michael Medved, and me in offering our volunteer labor to Sea-Tac. We hope they will allow us to provide the labor necessary for replacing the trees so that airport staff need not be deflected from their important duties. Why am I, an Orthodox Jewish rabbi, so concerned about a few Christmas trees? Not for a moment do I believe that American Christians will react to this insult with a flurry of anti-Semitic activity. But I do feel certain that perhaps in some small way, expelling Christmas symbolism from the airport makes it just a little harder to protect America's Christian nature. For centuries, we Jews suffered in a Europe governed by ecclesiastical authority. We suffered no less under the secular tyrannies of communism. Now, in post-Christian Europe, where both government and population are increasingly secular, anti-Semitism is dramatically on the rise. In short, we have never thrived under religious government or within secular cultures. During the past two thousand years of Jewish history Jews have never enjoyed a more hospitable home than we enjoy here in the United States of America. And this is how you repay us. What pieces of **** you are. This is because we have a religiously neutral government and a largely religious Christian population. Most American Christians love Jews and support Israel unconditionally because of their commitment to the Bible and the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Evidence from across the Atlantic persuades me that our lot will deteriorate if America's population gradually becomes secularized and removing the Christmas trees makes that disturbing likelihood, over time, more probable. Yes, public symbols are very important. Years ago we Jews advocated for full equality. Today, with thirteen Jewish United States senators, over thirty Jewish congressmen, two Jews on the Supreme Court, and disproportionate Jewish representation in media and entertainment, one could reasonably say we have achieved it. But back then, the only culture in America was Christian. Today, however, America is home to many faiths, not all of them friendly towards Judaism. Today, agitating for Jewish religious representation in the culture inevitably results not in equating Judaism with Christianity but the removal of both Judaism and Christianity. In other words, pushing for the menorah means removal of the Christmas tree and the triumph of secularism. Europe, both past and present, teaches us that if America becomes secularized, Jews suffer. For fifteen years I have insisted that for Jews to oppose Christianity in America is a mistake. The world today is populated by millions who harbor festering hatred for Jews. There remains one group of people Could it be because you're ****ing petty assholes. who love and support us and they are America's Evangelical Christians. What possible sense does it make to fight your friends by stripping their symbols from sight? When the Moslems invaded Spain, one of their first actions was the removal of all Christian symbols from public view. Secularism's invasion of America is attempting exactly the same strategy. I implore American Jews not to ally themselves with this ill-fated campaign. We are less than a week from the Jewish holiday of Chanukah during which our most important religious observance revolves around the blessings we say over the Menorah. In doing so, we oppose the still prevalent and ever more dangerous force of secularism. When times change, unlike dinosaurs, wise organisms adapt. We should recognize that we all have a stake in protecting Christian symbolism in the village square (or the airport). The only alternative will be no religious symbolism at all and make no mistake, secularism's rise is Judaism's decline. I spoke to the rabbi involved today and he is genuinely unhappy with the decision of Sea-Tac airport. I invited him to join the Toward Why, because it makes him look like an idiot. Tell him to take his ass back to israel and stick his manure a up his ass. Tradition petition and I hope he will do so. I urge you also to do whatever you can to help bring back Sea-Tac Airport's Christmas trees. Let us all show that we care. Exactly thirteen years ago, a brick was thrown through a Jewish home's window in Billings, Montana because inside that window was displayed a menorah. Within days, over six thousand Christian homes in Billings protested that anti-religious bigotry by displaying menorahs in their windows. I am not suggesting that Jews express their support by displaying Christmas trees in their windows but I am suggesting that Jews fulfill the spirit of Chanukah by supporting public expressions of the other Biblical faith. I don't think that the airport was guilty of anti-religious bigotry but a weakening of Christianity in America could become a huge threat. For a start, let us try to restore Sea-Tac Airport's Christmas trees. Toward Tradition president, Rabbi Daniel Lapin, is a noted rabbinic scholar and national public speaker. His radio show broadcasts live over the Internet on KSFO San Francisco each Sunday 1-4pm PST and is the author of three best-selling books, Thou Shall Prosper, America's Real War and Buried Treasure. I as well as others are beginning to understand why Hitler hated the jews. |
#30
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Jews Strive To Restore Christmas Trees At Seattle Airport
Mxsmanic wrote in message ... Ben Kaufman writes: I think calling it Festivus (for the rest of us) would be finer. Festivus sounds like a disease of some sort, but I have no problem with the idea of a different name. But not "seasons greetings" or anything totally bland like that. Why not use the original name for it then..... Winter Solstice.... -- Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail. |
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