Cancellation

"Olivers" wrote in message
...
PTRAVEL muttered....



I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a letter
today from Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the
overweight charge for my bags). And a travel credit (amount
unspecified) to come by separate cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?


My compliments to your demand letter which must have been a doozy.

Thank you. I give good letter.

Seriously, though, the Conditions of Carriage are everything, since they
constitute an enforceable contract. I don't know about other airlines, but
Alaska's CofC specifically identified "refund" as the remedy in event of
cancellation.


"En brochette" will be fine. I've managed one or the other, refund or
vouchers, but never both in a similar sort of situation, American Eagle's
occasional policy of cancelling lightly loaded flights on Mechanical
grounds when the real reasons are projected a/c positioning issues.

It's worth checking AA's CofC. The airlines do a lot of things which,
strictly speak, violate their contractual obligations to pax. They do it
because (1) they no one will ever read the CofC in sufficient detail to find
out exactly what obligations are owed, and (2) they assume, correctly, that
most people will just put up with it.


TMO

Olivers wrote:
PTRAVEL muttered....



I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a letter
today from Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the
overweight charge for my bags). And a travel credit (amount
unspecified) to come by separate cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?



My compliments to your demand letter which must have been a doozy.

"En brochette" will be fine. I've managed one or the other, refund or
vouchers, but never both in a similar sort of situation, American Eagle's
occasional policy of cancelling lightly loaded flights on Mechanical
grounds when the real reasons are projected a/c positioning issues.

I actually got both a couple of weeks ago for a canceled flight from
SNA-SJC on AA. They processed the credit card refund at the gate
counter. I then bought a ticket on WN for a flight 40 minutes later full
of a noisy, screaming girl volleyballers and cheerleaders. I sent an
email to customer service and AA credited me with 15000 miles quickly
after. I never even got an email reply, but the 15000 seemed adequate
compensation for leaving 40 minutes later on another carrier, albeit WN.

"PTRAVEL" wrote in message . com...
"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
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"Olivers" wrote in message
...
PTRAVEL muttered....



Please tell us when you get your full refund plus interest, an
unlikely
event even for a member of California's Bar, for whom consumer issues
are
set at a lower threshold than in many states. I suspect the airline
will
respond with some sort of documentation implying that mechanical
requirements necessitated the substitution of the equipment on another
flight with their earnest intention being to find another bird to plug
into
the schedule.

I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a letter today
from
Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the overweight charge
for
my bags). And a travel credit (amount unspecified) to come by separate
cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?


Interest?

No interest, but the amount is de minimus -- $20 or so.

The point, though, was that Olivers claimed there'd be no refund, only
vouchers.


I'm still confused how you got a refund AND rebooked on Horizon
getting you to your final destination. Or did I miss something?

Two weeks ago CO cancelled a flight but rebooked me on Delta. The
result was instead of a FC short hop I got a long connect through ATL
in coach - instead of arriving at 7 pm, I arrived at midnight. Did I
miss an opportunity to get a refund?

js

"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
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"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
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"Olivers" wrote in message
...
PTRAVEL muttered....



Please tell us when you get your full refund plus interest, an
unlikely
event even for a member of California's Bar, for whom consumer
issues
are
set at a lower threshold than in many states. I suspect the
airline
will
respond with some sort of documentation implying that mechanical
requirements necessitated the substitution of the equipment on
another
flight with their earnest intention being to find another bird to
plug
into
the schedule.

I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a letter
today
from
Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the overweight
charge
for
my bags). And a travel credit (amount unspecified) to come by
separate
cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?


Interest?

No interest, but the amount is de minimus -- $20 or so.

The point, though, was that Olivers claimed there'd be no refund, only
vouchers.


I'm still confused how you got a refund AND rebooked on Horizon
getting you to your final destination. Or did I miss something?

You must have, since I didn't say anything about Horizon. I was flying
Alaska from SFO to SNA, where I was picking up a United flight to Chicago
which, in turn, went on to Barcelona. To anticipate your question, I had
bought my UA tickets when we were living in Orange County. We'd since moved
(rather unexpectedly) and, since my wife was on an award ticket, couldn't
easily change our booking to depart from SFO. Instead, we bought tickets on
Alaska, allowing 5 hours between arrival in SNA and the scheduled UA
departure. However, Alaska cancelled our flight 10 minutes before departure
(supposedly because of mechanical problems but, in reality, because they had
switched our equipment over to another flight), had no further flights that
day, and offered only to provide a check payable to Southwest. Southwest
had only one flight to SNA before the evening and that was fully booked. I
went over to the United desk and explained the situation. The United rep
rebooked us to fly direct from SFO to ORD, did so without any change fee or
additional charge, and despite the fact that my wife was travelling on an
award ticket, and even put us in Premium Coach seats (perhaps not
surprisingly, I have since had United match my CO Platinum status, and I use
United for my Pacific coast and Canada travel -- total loss to Alaska YTD is
about $15,000 and climbing).

I returned the Alaska check to an Alaska supervisor and explained that
United provided a customer accomodation that Alaska couldn't or wouldn't. I
was told I would receive a refund for the cancelled flight. That was
November. It's now April. Only after writing a demand letter (which, among
other things, threatened a small claims action followed by an application to
put the airline into receivership to collect the judgment) did I receive the
refund (actually a promise that the refund would be credited back to my
charge card). By way of customer relations, the Alaska person who wrote me
promised I would receive a travel certificate, denomination unspecified, by
separate cover.


Two weeks ago CO cancelled a flight but rebooked me on Delta. The
result was instead of a FC short hop I got a long connect through ATL
in coach - instead of arriving at 7 pm, I arrived at midnight. Did I
miss an opportunity to get a refund?

I don't know CO's Conditions of Carriage with respect to cancellation. I
suspect, though, that if they hadn't rebooked you, you would have been due a
refund. Since the did rebook you, they fulfilled their contractual
obligation to transport you. Did you have a true F ticket, or was it an
upgrade? If you paid for F (not YUP) and they bought you Y, then I suspect
you're due a partial refund.

Interestingly enough, Delta once cancelled a flight on me, one on which I
had a fully-paid F. They rebooked me on a later flight, but only had coach
seats. They promised to refund the difference, didn't, but I never got
around to following up.


js

"PTRAVEL" wrote in message ...
"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
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"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
. com...
"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
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"Olivers" wrote in message
...
PTRAVEL muttered....



Please tell us when you get your full refund plus interest, an
unlikely
event even for a member of California's Bar, for whom consumer
issues
are
set at a lower threshold than in many states. I suspect the
airline
will
respond with some sort of documentation implying that mechanical
requirements necessitated the substitution of the equipment on
another
flight with their earnest intention being to find another bird to
plug
into
the schedule.

I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a letter
today
from
Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the overweight
charge
for
my bags). And a travel credit (amount unspecified) to come by
separate
cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?


Interest?

No interest, but the amount is de minimus -- $20 or so.

The point, though, was that Olivers claimed there'd be no refund, only
vouchers.


I'm still confused how you got a refund AND rebooked on Horizon
getting you to your final destination. Or did I miss something?

You must have, since I didn't say anything about Horizon.

I got your post and the OPs first post confused.

I was flying
Alaska from SFO to SNA, where I was picking up a United flight to Chicago
which, in turn, went on to Barcelona. To anticipate your question, I had
bought my UA tickets when we were living in Orange County. We'd since moved
(rather unexpectedly) and, since my wife was on an award ticket, couldn't
easily change our booking to depart from SFO. Instead, we bought tickets on
Alaska, allowing 5 hours between arrival in SNA and the scheduled UA
departure. However, Alaska cancelled our flight 10 minutes before departure
(supposedly because of mechanical problems but, in reality, because they had
switched our equipment over to another flight), had no further flights that
day, and offered only to provide a check payable to Southwest. Southwest
had only one flight to SNA before the evening and that was fully booked. I
went over to the United desk and explained the situation. The United rep
rebooked us to fly direct from SFO to ORD, did so without any change fee or
additional charge, and despite the fact that my wife was travelling on an
award ticket, and even put us in Premium Coach seats (perhaps not
surprisingly, I have since had United match my CO Platinum status, and I use
United for my Pacific coast and Canada travel -- total loss to Alaska YTD is
about $15,000 and climbing).

I returned the Alaska check

I'm assuming that this is the "voucher" for the flight the next day.

to an Alaska supervisor and explained that
United provided a customer accomodation that Alaska couldn't or wouldn't. I
was told I would receive a refund for the cancelled flight. That was
November. It's now April. Only after writing a demand letter (which, among
other things, threatened a small claims action followed by an application to
put the airline into receivership to collect the judgment) did I receive the
refund (actually a promise that the refund would be credited back to my
charge card). By way of customer relations, the Alaska person who wrote me
promised I would receive a travel certificate, denomination unspecified, by
separate cover.

I've gotten refunds for cancelled flights before - either as vouchers
or credits to charge cards. My impression is that this is fairly
routine. What is not routine is getting a refund for a cancelled
flight when an alternative flight is provided, albeit with significant
inconvenience.

I don't think being a laywer is a necessary precondition to get
satisfaction. Not too long ago Continental cancelled a connection on
me resulting in me having to stay over an extra day. They gave me a
voucher for hotel accomodations at a place I wasn't haqppy about. I
went to my usual Radisson, got a nice dinner, took a taxi both ways,
and sent them a bill for the cost ($200). After a little proding, I
got a check. Plus, I got the same amount in travel vouchers for the
inconvenience.


Two weeks ago CO cancelled a flight but rebooked me on Delta. The
result was instead of a FC short hop I got a long connect through ATL
in coach - instead of arriving at 7 pm, I arrived at midnight. Did I
miss an opportunity to get a refund?

I don't know CO's Conditions of Carriage with respect to cancellation. I
suspect, though, that if they hadn't rebooked you, you would have been due a
refund. Since the did rebook you, they fulfilled their contractual
obligation to transport you. Did you have a true F ticket, or was it an
upgrade? If you paid for F (not YUP) and they bought you Y, then I suspect
you're due a partial refund.

As good as life is, I rarely buy FC - given my status, though, I
rarely fly coach.

Interestingly enough, Delta once cancelled a flight on me, one on which I
had a fully-paid F. They rebooked me on a later flight, but only had coach
seats. They promised to refund the difference, didn't, but I never got
around to following up.

Sometimes they count on the hassle factor.

js

"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
...
"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
. com...
"Jonathan Smith" wrote in message
m...
"PTRAVEL" wrote in message
.com...
"Olivers" wrote in message
...
PTRAVEL muttered....



Please tell us when you get your full refund plus interest, an
unlikely
event even for a member of California's Bar, for whom consumer
issues
are
set at a lower threshold than in many states. I suspect the
airline
will
respond with some sort of documentation implying that
mechanical
requirements necessitated the substitution of the equipment on
another
flight with their earnest intention being to find another bird
to
plug
into
the schedule.

I'm sure you'll be sorry to hear this, but I've received a
letter
today
from
Alaska. No vouchers -- a full refund (including the overweight
charge
for
my bags). And a travel credit (amount unspecified) to come by
separate
cover.

How would you like your crow prepared?


Interest?

No interest, but the amount is de minimus -- $20 or so.

The point, though, was that Olivers claimed there'd be no refund,
only
vouchers.


I'm still confused how you got a refund AND rebooked on Horizon
getting you to your final destination. Or did I miss something?

You must have, since I didn't say anything about Horizon.

I got your post and the OPs first post confused.

I was flying
Alaska from SFO to SNA, where I was picking up a United flight to
Chicago
which, in turn, went on to Barcelona. To anticipate your question, I
had
bought my UA tickets when we were living in Orange County. We'd since
moved
(rather unexpectedly) and, since my wife was on an award ticket,
couldn't
easily change our booking to depart from SFO. Instead, we bought
tickets on
Alaska, allowing 5 hours between arrival in SNA and the scheduled UA
departure. However, Alaska cancelled our flight 10 minutes before
departure
(supposedly because of mechanical problems but, in reality, because they
had
switched our equipment over to another flight), had no further flights
that
day, and offered only to provide a check payable to Southwest.
Southwest
had only one flight to SNA before the evening and that was fully booked.
I
went over to the United desk and explained the situation. The United
rep
rebooked us to fly direct from SFO to ORD, did so without any change fee
or
additional charge, and despite the fact that my wife was travelling on
an
award ticket, and even put us in Premium Coach seats (perhaps not
surprisingly, I have since had United match my CO Platinum status, and I
use
United for my Pacific coast and Canada travel -- total loss to Alaska
YTD is
about $15,000 and climbing).

I returned the Alaska check

I'm assuming that this is the "voucher" for the flight the next day.


No. It was a check drawn on Alaska airlines and payable to Southwest. It
was not a voucher, nor was it for any specific flight.


to an Alaska supervisor and explained that
United provided a customer accomodation that Alaska couldn't or
wouldn't. I
was told I would receive a refund for the cancelled flight. That was
November. It's now April. Only after writing a demand letter (which,
among
other things, threatened a small claims action followed by an
application to
put the airline into receivership to collect the judgment) did I receive
the
refund (actually a promise that the refund would be credited back to my
charge card). By way of customer relations, the Alaska person who wrote
me
promised I would receive a travel certificate, denomination unspecified,
by
separate cover.

I've gotten refunds for cancelled flights before - either as vouchers
or credits to charge cards.

Right. They're crediting my charge card the refund amount.

My impression is that this is fairly
routine. What is not routine is getting a refund for a cancelled
flight when an alternative flight is provided, albeit with significant
inconvenience.

The only alternative they offered, after I told them that the Southwest
flight to SNA was full, was a Southwest flight to LAX with a voucher for the
Super Shuttle. I declined on a nuimber of grounds.


I don't think being a laywer is a necessary precondition to get
satisfaction.

I didn't suggest that it was.

Not too long ago Continental cancelled a connection on
me resulting in me having to stay over an extra day. They gave me a
voucher for hotel accomodations at a place I wasn't haqppy about. I
went to my usual Radisson, got a nice dinner, took a taxi both ways,
and sent them a bill for the cost ($200). After a little proding, I
got a check. Plus, I got the same amount in travel vouchers for the
inconvenience.


Two weeks ago CO cancelled a flight but rebooked me on Delta. The
result was instead of a FC short hop I got a long connect through ATL
in coach - instead of arriving at 7 pm, I arrived at midnight. Did I
miss an opportunity to get a refund?

I don't know CO's Conditions of Carriage with respect to cancellation.
I
suspect, though, that if they hadn't rebooked you, you would have been
due a
refund. Since the did rebook you, they fulfilled their contractual
obligation to transport you. Did you have a true F ticket, or was it an
upgrade? If you paid for F (not YUP) and they bought you Y, then I
suspect
you're due a partial refund.

As good as life is, I rarely buy FC - given my status, though, I
rarely fly coach.

Interestingly enough, Delta once cancelled a flight on me, one on which
I
had a fully-paid F. They rebooked me on a later flight, but only had
coach
seats. They promised to refund the difference, didn't, but I never got
around to following up.

Sometimes they count on the hassle factor.

js