American Airlines removes checked baggage without telling passengers

I recently flew on an American Eagle (AA) flight from Dallas (DFW) to
Pittsburgh (PIT) and had the misfortune of being completely taken
advantage of by American Airlines...along with about 15 other
passengers on my flight. Before, during, and after that flight,
American Airlines and its employees conducted unethical business
practices that should be abhorent to anyone that knows about them.
Our departure gate was switched 3 times within the course of 15
minutes...but only one of those gate switches were announced over the
loud speaker at the airport. Myself and the other passengers had to
continually look at the monitors to see what gate to go to.
Next, the plane was about and hour and a half late in taking off. I
can live with that, because delays happen. However, the AA reps at
the gate(s) kept telling the anxious passengers that the plane would
board momentarilly, for about the first 45 minutes of that wait. If
you know that it is going to be 45 minutes before the plane boards,
tell the people that, don't lie to them. If you truly have no idea
how long it will be, then say that...don't just keep saying
"momentarilly".

Once on the plane, prior to taxying away from the gate, we sat there
for about 15 minutes before pulling away. At one point during that
wait, some of the passengers on the left hand side of the plane
noticed that some AA baggage handlers had opened up the cargo doors
and were taking luggage off of the plane...luggage that looked quite
similar to the luggage that belonged to people on the plane. One
passenger asked the flight attendant if she know why they would be
taking luggage OFF of the plane. Her reply was an utter lie, "I am
only a flight attendant and I don't know why they do what they do on
the ground..."
Most people just hoped that an Airline with AA's experience and
reputation would know what they are doing, and the people convinced
themselves that the luggage that was being taken off was from the
previous flight for that plane. We all assumed at that point that OUR
luggage was still on the plane and would reunite with us in
Pittsburgh.

After getting to Pittsburgh (2 hours behind schedule) everyone on the
flight went to the baggage carousel to retrieve their checked
baggage. Surprisingly, and pleasantly, the baggage was already coming
down the conveyer belt when we got to the baggage claim area. After
about 10 minutes, with about half of the passengers having retrieved
all of their luggage and the other half still waiting for theirs, the
conveyer belt stopped moving.
At that point, one of the passengers waiting for a piece of luggage
went to the American Airlines baggage claim customer support window
and asked the AA employee if there was more baggage coming from our
flight from Dallas, and if the conveyer belt was just temporarily
stopped. She replied that no, that was all of the luggage that there
was.
There were about 20 people from our flight who did not have some or
all of their checked luggage. Needless to say, we were mad. How
could the airline make this mistake. It had become obvious what
happened. The baggage-cart full of baggage that had been taken off of
the plane in Dallas was OUR baggage, and should have been left on the
plane.
The American Airlines representative at Pittsburgh's airport continued
to be unhelpful. All she did was take everyone's info and tell
everyone that an AA rep would deliver the delayed luggage to our homes
the next day. She did not, or could not, explain how this mistake
happened and admit the reasons for the intentional removal of the
baggage.

What we know to be the truth but American Airlines won't tell us: the
baggage was removed intentionally either to get the plane below the
required weight limit or to lessen the weight so that the plane could
travel faster and make up lost time. Neither the pilot nor the flight
attendents ever did the courtious thing and tell the passengers of
flight 3629 why our baggage was being taken off of the plane.
Instead, they proceed to cover up their actions with a cloak of
secrecy and lies. Just another example of how the airlines proceed to
do anything they can to erode customer loyalty and respect. I will
never fly with AA again, and I know that the Travel agency that
purchased half of the seats on that plane that day for myself and the
group I was with will never buy tickets from AA again. They just lost
ten's of thousands of dollars in business because they wouldn't be
honest. All I ask for is honesty. Be upfront and honest, and I will
respect you...hide behind silence and lies, and I will never trust you.

On Mar 1, 3:17 am, wrote:
All I ask for is honesty. Be upfront and honest, and I will
respect you...hide behind silence and lies, and I will never trust you.

I don't think you are typical. The airline is truly damned if they do
and damed if they don't. I think they would get more flack from most
people for being honest. ("Ladies and Gentlemen, I have no idea when
flight 123 will be ready to board, but it will probably be within a
few hours.")

Do you think honesty won't generate ill-will just because it's
honest?

Same thing with the weight issue. You might have appreciated an
announcement like "From the flight deck, well it looks like this ol
plane is just too heavy to fly legally, so we are just gonna remove
some of your luggage and put it on another plane. I dunno when it
will arrive -- just being honest". That kind of honesty might cause
a riot!

On 1 Mar, 13:54, "Patrick Danville" wrote:
On Mar 1, 3:17 am, wrote:

All I ask for is honesty. Be upfront and honest, and I will
respect you...hide behind silence and lies, and I will never trust you.

I don't think you are typical. The airline is truly damned if they do
and damed if they don't. I think they would get more flack from most
people for being honest. ("Ladies and Gentlemen, I have no idea when
flight 123 will be ready to board, but it will probably be within a
few hours.")

Do you think honesty won't generate ill-will just because it's
honest?

But why do they have to behave as if there is somebody with a gun
behind them
instructing them to lie..?

Most people don't mind things going wrong, it is partly expected. The
problem
is with how it is dealt with when it happens. E.g. bad weather and
delays
are not 'extraordinary', but the incompetence in dealing with them
often is.

Same thing with the weight issue. You might have appreciated an
announcement like "From the flight deck, well it looks like this ol
plane is just too heavy to fly legally, so we are just gonna remove
some of your luggage and put it on another plane. I dunno when it
will arrive -- just being honest". That kind of honesty might cause
a riot!

Too often airlines simply want to pass on the problem to somebody else
down
the chain so they don't have to deal with it but somebody else does
(usually
when its already too late).

People are forgiving of mistakes, less so for preventable ones down to
incompetence.

I would have like the captain to announce "Due to weight issues, and
the safety of the flight, some baggage needs to be removed from the
cargo hold. We will make every attempt to get your luggage to you as
soon as possible. Please see the American Airlines baggage claim
representative at your final destination if you would like to arrange
for delayed baggage to be delivered to your home. We apologize for
this inconvenience but safety is the first priorty. Thank you." I
guarantee that any sane person would completely understand this and
realize that the right decision was made. Will some people gripe and
complain, sure. But after they get it out of their system, they will
respect the pilot and the airline for being up-front and honest. And
if the captain explains it as a safety precaution, people will be
understanding.

And in regards to checked baggage. With all of the restrictions on
what can go in your carry-on baggage, and never really being able to
decipher what is and what is not allowed, many people pack important,
crucial things in their checked baggage, such as medication. Having
your baggage delayed by day may not seem like a big deal, but if your
daily medication is in your checked baggage, it surely is a big deal.
Also, respectful flighers try to put as much in their checked baggage
so that they can limit their carry-ons...with limited carry on space
on the plane. As a result, more of that person's important items end
up in the belly of the plane. I have a solution to this problem that
would require very little modification to the current baggage handling
system:
Every passenger can declare ONE of their checked baggages as
"Critical" or "Important" or any other term you want to use. Any
other items that are checked by that passenger would be regarded as
"Secondary" or "Non-vital". The baggage could be differentiated with
different color tags...like white for "Non-vital" and Green for
"Critical".
In the situation that baggage needs to be taken off of a plane, the
baggage handlers could only remove items with a White tag. All of the
Green luggage would remain on the plane, ensuring that it arrives with
its owner at the destination. Generally, planes are overweight when
many of the passengers have checked numerous baggage,...which becomes
more likely when people are returning from vacations or other trips.
If someone buys a large item while on vacation, and they don't want to
FedEx or UPS it back to themself, they will often check it and put it
on the plane, especially if it is too large for carry-on. These items
are obviously not critical and do not need to arrive at the
destination with the passenger. However, that person's primary piece
of baggage probably should. And I know that currently, it doesn't
work like this. Most of the people on my flight from Dallas to
Pittsburgh coming back from a trip to Puerto Vallarta in Mexico, with
the large group that I was with. I saw, at the Pittsburgh airport,
some people who received their checked "hammocks" yet did not receive
their primary suitcase. Why? Shouldn't the airline have taken the
"hammock" or other non-essential item off of the plane first? These
things need to be thought out more by the airline.

wrote in message
ups.com...
I recently flew on an American Eagle (AA) flight from Dallas (DFW) to
Pittsburgh (PIT) and had the misfortune of being completely taken
advantage of by American Airlines...along with about 15 other
passengers on my flight. Before, during, and after that flight,
American Airlines and its employees conducted unethical business
practices that should be abhorent to anyone that knows about them.
Our departure gate was switched 3 times within the course of 15
minutes...but only one of those gate switches were announced over the
loud speaker at the airport. Myself and the other passengers had to
continually look at the monitors to see what gate to go to.
Next, the plane was about and hour and a half late in taking off. I
can live with that, because delays happen. However, the AA reps at
the gate(s) kept telling the anxious passengers that the plane would
board momentarilly, for about the first 45 minutes of that wait. If
you know that it is going to be 45 minutes before the plane boards,
tell the people that, don't lie to them. If you truly have no idea
how long it will be, then say that...don't just keep saying
"momentarilly".

Once on the plane, prior to taxying away from the gate, we sat there
for about 15 minutes before pulling away. At one point during that
wait, some of the passengers on the left hand side of the plane
noticed that some AA baggage handlers had opened up the cargo doors
and were taking luggage off of the plane...luggage that looked quite
similar to the luggage that belonged to people on the plane. One
passenger asked the flight attendant if she know why they would be
taking luggage OFF of the plane. Her reply was an utter lie, "I am
only a flight attendant and I don't know why they do what they do on
the ground..."
Most people just hoped that an Airline with AA's experience and
reputation would know what they are doing, and the people convinced
themselves that the luggage that was being taken off was from the
previous flight for that plane. We all assumed at that point that OUR
luggage was still on the plane and would reunite with us in
Pittsburgh.

After getting to Pittsburgh (2 hours behind schedule) everyone on the
flight went to the baggage carousel to retrieve their checked
baggage. Surprisingly, and pleasantly, the baggage was already coming
down the conveyer belt when we got to the baggage claim area. After
about 10 minutes, with about half of the passengers having retrieved
all of their luggage and the other half still waiting for theirs, the
conveyer belt stopped moving.
At that point, one of the passengers waiting for a piece of luggage
went to the American Airlines baggage claim customer support window
and asked the AA employee if there was more baggage coming from our
flight from Dallas, and if the conveyer belt was just temporarily
stopped. She replied that no, that was all of the luggage that there
was.
There were about 20 people from our flight who did not have some or
all of their checked luggage. Needless to say, we were mad. How
could the airline make this mistake. It had become obvious what
happened. The baggage-cart full of baggage that had been taken off of
the plane in Dallas was OUR baggage, and should have been left on the
plane.
The American Airlines representative at Pittsburgh's airport continued
to be unhelpful. All she did was take everyone's info and tell
everyone that an AA rep would deliver the delayed luggage to our homes
the next day. She did not, or could not, explain how this mistake
happened and admit the reasons for the intentional removal of the
baggage.

What we know to be the truth but American Airlines won't tell us: the
baggage was removed intentionally either to get the plane below the
required weight limit or to lessen the weight so that the plane could
travel faster and make up lost time. Neither the pilot nor the flight
attendents ever did the courtious thing and tell the passengers of
flight 3629 why our baggage was being taken off of the plane.
Instead, they proceed to cover up their actions with a cloak of
secrecy and lies. Just another example of how the airlines proceed to
do anything they can to erode customer loyalty and respect. I will
never fly with AA again, and I know that the Travel agency that
purchased half of the seats on that plane that day for myself and the
group I was with will never buy tickets from AA again. They just lost
ten's of thousands of dollars in business because they wouldn't be
honest. All I ask for is honesty. Be upfront and honest, and I will
respect you...hide behind silence and lies, and I will never trust you.


This sounds like a classic weight and balance issue - they had a small plane
on a route that is at the end of its range, and, due to winds, weather,
and/or load they couldn't carry the bags. That simple.

In message "Jeff
Hacker" wrote:

This sounds like a classic weight and balance issue - they had a small plane
on a route that is at the end of its range, and, due to winds, weather,
and/or load they couldn't carry the bags. That simple.

Better communication would be nice. Even better would be an offer to
let a couple passengers deplane (voluntary bump) to let everyone else's
bag through.
--
Insert something clever here.

On Mar 1, 8:03 pm, "Jeff Hacker" wrote:



This sounds like a classic weight and balance issue - they had a small plane
on a route that is at the end of its range, and, due to winds, weather,
and/or load they couldn't carry the bags. That simple.- Hide quoted text -


I understand WHY they did it. And I don't have problem with it. It
is just something that I think could be handled differently, like
DevilsPGD said. Why did they not offer people on my plane take
another flight, to lighten the load. Or, tell the passengers prior to
pulling away from the gate,"some of the baggage is going to be removed
for safety reasons, we apologize for any inconvenience this may
cause..."
Also, what do you think of the system I proposed where some baggage is
regarded as critical and some is regarded as non-essential? When they
decide to take baggage off, they can only take off the non-essential
baggage. And if your response is that they would waist time looking
through all of the luggage to find the non-essential ones, to take
off...how about if they loaded the non-essential ones last, so that
they would be the easiest to take off, if needed?

wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 1, 8:03 pm, "Jeff Hacker" wrote:



This sounds like a classic weight and balance issue - they had a small
plane
on a route that is at the end of its range, and, due to winds, weather,
and/or load they couldn't carry the bags. That simple.- Hide quoted
text -


I understand WHY they did it. And I don't have problem with it. It
is just something that I think could be handled differently, like
DevilsPGD said. Why did they not offer people on my plane take
another flight, to lighten the load. Or, tell the passengers prior to
pulling away from the gate,"some of the baggage is going to be removed
for safety reasons, we apologize for any inconvenience this may
cause..."

It would have been nice if they'd made that announcement. But I'm guessing,
from experience, that announcement would have caused some people to get
extremely angry, and then you would have the added delay of going back to
the gate to pull the angry people and their luggage off.

I think pretty much any other solution would have caused more delays. Once
you start asking for volunteers to deplane you have to find their luggage,
which takes awhile. Once you give up your spot for takeoff it may be awhile
before you get another one.

Also, what do you think of the system I proposed where some baggage is
regarded as critical and some is regarded as non-essential? When they
decide to take baggage off, they can only take off the non-essential
baggage. And if your response is that they would waist time looking
through all of the luggage to find the non-essential ones, to take
off...how about if they loaded the non-essential ones last, so that
they would be the easiest to take off, if needed?

I think the number of people that check two bags is much, much lower than
the number of people that check one. And the number of people who check two
bags and are willing to count one of them as non-essential (translated to
you can bring it to me whenever...) would be hovering close enough to 0 to
make this a moot exercise. You might have better luck if the airlines could
tell which bags were returning to their original departure point, and which
ones were on their first legs, and then consider the bags going home as
non-essential, as those are the ones you can get back to people easier. In
your example I'm not sure they didn't do that.

On Mar 2, 11:06 am, "Cathy Kearns" wrote:



It would have been nice if they'd made that announcement. But I'm guessing,
from experience, that announcement would have caused some people to get
extremely angry, and then you would have the added delay of going back to
the gate to pull the angry people and their luggage off.

I think pretty much any other solution would have caused more delays. Once
you start asking for volunteers to deplane you have to find their luggage,
which takes awhile. Once you give up your spot for takeoff it may be awhile
before you get another one.


I think the number of people that check two bags is much, much lower than
the number of people that check one. And the number of people who check two
bags and are willing to count one of them as non-essential (translated to
you can bring it to me whenever...) would be hovering close enough to 0 to
make this a moot exercise. You might have better luck if the airlines could
tell which bags were returning to their original departure point, and which
ones were on their first legs, and then consider the bags going home as
non-essential, as those are the ones you can get back to people easier. In
your example I'm not sure they didn't do that.

So you are saying that it was right of them to not inform me ahead of
time, that when I got to my home airport...aka Pittsburgh
International...some of my baggage may not be there?
That makes sense...NOT.
They are a business...in a free-market industry. They are not a
government run agency or authority, like the USPS or some local
transit authority. I would expect this type of behavior from a
government organization, because the government organization has a
monolopy and isn't really concerned with pleasing the
customer...because they don't need to be. However, a company that
operates in a free-market industry, you would think would like to
treat customers nice, so that they maintain or grow their market share
and profits. Maybe American, and some other airlines, don't feel a
need to treat customers good. Well, I know for one thing, I have
already emailed them twice since I go home on Monday night, and all I
have received back from them were two standard automatic replies. I
still have not had someone from American answer my questions.
The main thing I want is for them to be open and honest. One word you
sometimes hear in government or in industry is "transparency". That
means that things are not being covered-up for, or hidden...and that
business is being conducted ethicly and openly. That is all I want.
I don't want rebates for future flights, I don't want to be paid off.
I just want honesty.

Cathy, about your baggage remark...there are instances where people do
check more than one piece of baggage, and in those instances that
person should have to choose one that is more important than the
other. Why do I say this? Because it is not a matter of convenience,
and liking to have both of your pieces of luggage at your destination
when you get there. Rather, it is a question of life and death. Some
people seriously do have a piece of checked luggage that is
"critical," meaning that they have prescription medication in there,
or something else that is vital to keeping them healthy, and maybe
alive.

And you are also wrong when saying that if the pilot told the
passengers that some baggage would be taken off that there would be an
uproar. You don't give people enough credit. Sure, some would
complain. But the 90% of the level-headed people on the plane would
(on their own) get the complainers to quiet down. They would explain
that it more important for the plane to be safe than for their luggage
to arrive on time. People would police themselves, like they always
do.
Now, if the Pilot said, "Ladies and gentlemen, we are removing luggage
to save on fuel costs and to speed up our flight..." that would not be
taken well...and it shouldn't. That would be an unethical business
practice. It is quite clear: Decisions that are made for safety are
appropriate and correct...decisions made for other reasons (i.e.
money, time) are not. PERIOD. NO ARGUMENT. They should do what is
right.

In message "Cathy
Kearns" wrote:

I think the number of people that check two bags is much, much lower than
the number of people that check one. And the number of people who check two
bags and are willing to count one of them as non-essential (translated to
you can bring it to me whenever...) would be hovering close enough to 0 to
make this a moot exercise.

I'd be happy to tell the airline up front that I'll accept a gift
certificate/equivalent-to-cash-toward-my-next-flight for $50 if they
don't get my bags there, and put me to the top of the list.

Most of my flights don't require me to have anything in my luggage (Or
at least I'll survive for 24 hours without it)
--
Insert something clever here.