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Obesity on Planes



 
 
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  #1  
Old March 19th, 2006, 06:47 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
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Default Obesity on Planes

OK, I've expressed myself repeatedly on the subject of obese people on
planes, and the inconvenience they cause the rest of us. Now comes this
letter in the Travel section of the NY Times on Sunday, March 19. It
goes in the opposite direction, and is written by a psychologist who
works with obese people.

I'm throwing this out for general discussion. What does anyone think of
her viewpoint? Any answers, pro or con? (as though I didn't know I'll
get plenty!)


To the Editor: In a recent Q&A (Feb. 19), I read with dismay the query
submitted by a reader who complained that the "extremely large man"
seated next to her on a recent flight infringed on her personal space
because of his size.

She wondered whether airlines should request that people who are very
large buy multiple airplane seats when traveling. As a clinical
psychologist working in a specialist obesity medicine practice at
Massachusetts General Hospital, I had a very strong reaction to this.

I have met hundreds of people who have struggled — painfully,
assiduously and in vain — with obesity. My experience in this field has
yielded a great deal of insight into the painful challenges that people
with obesity face constantly, challenges that most people with healthy
weights have a hard time even imagining.

I found this reader's remarks particularly poignant because she spoke
of a situation that my patients describe to me over and over again: the
humiliation of not being able to fit into airline seats. Although I
hear these accounts repeatedly, they never fail to move me; the pain
and shame that my patients feel in countless daily situations is
heartbreaking, and the lengths to which they must go to cope with these
situations are impressive.

The bigoted treatment that people with obesity face every day stems
directly from a widespread public misperception that one can choose not
to be obese merely by exercising self-control, a misperception
completely at odds with the overwhelming body of current scientific
evidence.

The degree of control that people actually have over their obesity is
drastically more limited than is commonly believed. Imagine how this
woman's reaction would have been different had her fellow traveler
taken up "a quarter" of her space because he had had his leg or arm in
a bulky cast.

I imagine she might have felt some annoyance, but nothing like the
righteous indignation implied by her suggestion that the airlines
charge heavy people for an extra seat.

Stephanie Sogg, Ph.D.

  #2  
Old March 19th, 2006, 07:51 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

On 2006-03-19 13:42:20 -0500, Asterix said:

Make the fat slobs pay, if they need more space.
several US airlines have sensibly started to charge the porkers, if
they need more space than is suitable for normal people.

Why should neighboring passengers be inconvenienced just because some
fat slob, male, female or whatever can't stop being a pig, and is so
gross that they need to occupy space belonging to the next passenger?
Make them pay for their blubber, and to hell with the nutbar quacks!!

If the fat slobs do not want to pay double fares, they can always take
the train, or drive.


Do you have any views on the "sensitivity" issue raised by Ms. Sogg?
(Ha! I bet I know the answer to THAT.)

  #3  
Old March 19th, 2006, 08:11 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
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Default Obesity on Planes


"sechumlib" wrote in message
news:2006031912471616807-sechumlib@liberalnet...
OK, I've expressed myself repeatedly on the subject of obese people on
planes, and the inconvenience they cause the rest of us. Now comes this
letter in the Travel section of the NY Times on Sunday, March 19. It goes
in the opposite direction, and is written by a psychologist who works with
obese people.


This letter, just like some of the more offensive ones previously posted,
simply misses the point, which has nothing to do with whether obesity is
voluntary or involuntary, whether overweight people are offensive or not,
whether other passengers are insufficiently sensitive the the feelings of
the overweight, etc.

No passenger has the right to impose on another passenger by taking their
space. Period.

That means that if you, for any reason -- obesity, carrying a lap child,
having a broken leg, transporting a double bass, whatever -- need more than
one seat, then buy more than one seat. No one has the right to demand that
a stranger cede part of their seat to to them.

No one shares my seat with me except, perhaps, my wife. End of discussion.
If you're not intruding into my seat, either because you fit a standard
airline seat or because you've purchased two seats, then I have no problem
with you at all.

Why is this so difficult?


  #4  
Old March 19th, 2006, 10:36 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada
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Default Obesity on Planes


"sechumlib" wrote in message
news:2006031912471616807-sechumlib@liberalnet...
OK, I've expressed myself repeatedly on the subject of obese people on
planes, and the inconvenience they cause the rest of us. Now comes this
letter in the Travel section of the NY Times on Sunday, March 19. It goes
in the opposite direction, and is written by a psychologist who works with
obese people.

I'm throwing this out for general discussion. What does anyone think of
her viewpoint? Any answers, pro or con? (as though I didn't know I'll get
plenty!)

The degree of control that people actually have over their obesity is
drastically more limited than is commonly believed. Imagine how this
woman's reaction would have been different had her fellow traveler taken
up "a quarter" of her space because he had had his leg or arm in a bulky
cast.

I imagine she might have felt some annoyance, but nothing like the
righteous indignation implied by her suggestion that the airlines charge
heavy people for an extra seat.

Stephanie Sogg, Ph.D.


I don't give a rats ass about someone's feeling when it comes to this
subject!
If you're taking up my space then you're stealing from me.
Seriously, people have to buy extra seats for their tubas, their pets,
whatever they're bringing on board that won't fit overhead or under seat, so
why shouldn't fat people have to pay for the extra space.
Yeah, I'm sorry that they must suffer the trials of their differences, but I
do not need to suffer their flesh in my space.
They should pay for the extra seat.


  #5  
Old March 19th, 2006, 11:21 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay


Asterix wrote:
On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 18:51:59 GMT, sechumlib
wrote:

On 2006-03-19 13:42:20 -0500, Asterix said:

Make the fat slobs pay, if they need more space.
several US airlines have sensibly started to charge the porkers, if
they need more space than is suitable for normal people.

Why should neighboring passengers be inconvenienced just because some
fat slob, male, female or whatever can't stop being a pig, and is so
gross that they need to occupy space belonging to the next passenger?
Make them pay for their blubber, and to hell with the nutbar quacks!!

If the fat slobs do not want to pay double fares, they can always take
the train, or drive.


Do you have any views on the "sensitivity" issue raised by Ms. Sogg?
(Ha! I bet I know the answer to THAT.)


Sensitivity issues my butt!
To hell with the fat slobs, and make them pay for their space
occupied!

As for the qucks claiming this that and the other, they can join their
fat slobs in hell!

How about some sensitivity for the vast majority of normal people
instead?


Although I agree, the "obese flier" threads have been beaten to death,
and are now just plain annoying. Take it up with the airlines.

  #6  
Old March 21st, 2006, 12:03 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

Maxx. wrote:

Asterix wrote:

On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 18:51:59 GMT, sechumlib
wrote:


On 2006-03-19 13:42:20 -0500, Asterix said:


Make the fat slobs pay, if they need more space.
several US airlines have sensibly started to charge the porkers, if
they need more space than is suitable for normal people.

Why should neighboring passengers be inconvenienced just because some
fat slob, male, female or whatever can't stop being a pig, and is so
gross that they need to occupy space belonging to the next passenger?
Make them pay for their blubber, and to hell with the nutbar quacks!!

If the fat slobs do not want to pay double fares, they can always take
the train, or drive.

Do you have any views on the "sensitivity" issue raised by Ms. Sogg?
(Ha! I bet I know the answer to THAT.)


Sensitivity issues my butt!
To hell with the fat slobs, and make them pay for their space
occupied!

As for the qucks claiming this that and the other, they can join their
fat slobs in hell!

How about some sensitivity for the vast majority of normal people
instead?



Although I agree, the "obese flier" threads have been beaten to death,
and are now just plain annoying. Take it up with the airlines.


Kids that scream and cry incessantly, plus selfish pax that thrust
their seats back when your trying to eat and drink from your fold down
table. Makes it even harder trying to get out to go to the WC.
I think these are worse than obese pax.

  #7  
Old March 21st, 2006, 02:54 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

Hello Everyone,

I am kinda new to this newsgroup and would like to use this thread to
introduce myself.
I am a mother of two beautiful daughters and four wonderful grandchildren.
I have used every type of transportation there is here in the good ole US of
A.
I have been exposed to many types of personalities and body types known to
man (or woman).

One trip I took, I was constantly exposed to an overwhelming perfume. I
dealt with it. Should the person have been made to wash the perfume off, or
sit in the restrooms the entire trip?

One trip I took, I was seated next to a man that was mentally challenged and
talked about some pretty weird stuff. I dealt with it. Should the person
have been made to sit alone, or be put off of the flight?

One trip I took, I was sitting near a heavy snorer and could not rest. I
dealt with it. Should the person have been asked to stay awake?

One trip I took, I was seated next to someone who had been drinking heavily
and the odor was as bad as the perfumed person. I dealt with it. Should this
person have been put off the ride?

One trip I took, I was seated next to a down syndrome child that was
constantly moving and kicking me. I dealt with it. Should the parents of
this child been asked to take the child off of the train?

One trip I took, I was seated near a woman who had 2 small children. They
were both normal behaved children. The youngest was 2 years old and had a
cold. In the middle of the night the 2 year old became uncomfortable with
her illness and started crying. The mother couldn't quiet her. A very
selfish lady sitting behind the family reported this to the attendant. The
attendant told the mother that if she couldn't keep the child from crying,
she and her children would have to get off at the next station. I went and
spoke with the mother, and found this out, after hearing the child's cry
being muffled. (It reminded me too much of a M.A.S.H. episode.) When I heard
what the attendant had said to this lady, it upset me. I spoke to the mother
some more and found out that she and her babies were traveling to her
mother's and that her husband was over in Iraq fighting for our nation. It
really upset me to see a family of one of our soldiers being treated so
rudely. I spoke to the conductor (who seemed to not care about dealing with
the situation). So...I called the corporate headquarters and tore them
another...well...you know.
I dealt with it.
We have many types of people in this world, each with their own little
offensive things, be it physical or mental.
Life is too short to worry about the other person having more than us, or
offending us with their body size.
Deal with it.


Kids that scream and cry incessantly, plus selfish pax that thrust
their seats back when your trying to eat and drink from your fold down
table. Makes it even harder trying to get out to go to the WC.
I think these are worse than obese pax.



  #8  
Old March 21st, 2006, 04:44 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

All your examples are behavioral issues, not problems are physical
size. They're entirely different problems, and are dealt with
differently.


Here's an idea: Next time you're eating a nice dinner out at the table
next to me, I'm going to hang my coat on your extra chair, and use part
of your table for my cell phone, car keys, and dessert menus, because I
don't have room for all of it on my table. You don't mind, do you?
  #9  
Old March 21st, 2006, 05:51 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

Well...if you introduce yourself first then it would be no problem because I
would see that you needed a little extra space.
I might use your cell phone though so you might want to make sure it has a
lock on it...


"beavis" wrote in message
...
All your examples are behavioral issues, not problems are physical
size. They're entirely different problems, and are dealt with
differently.


Here's an idea: Next time you're eating a nice dinner out at the table
next to me, I'm going to hang my coat on your extra chair, and use part
of your table for my cell phone, car keys, and dessert menus, because I
don't have room for all of it on my table. You don't mind, do you?



  #10  
Old March 21st, 2006, 07:40 PM posted to rec.travel.usa-canada,rec.travel.air
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Default Obesity on Planes - Make fat Slobs Pay

beavis wrote:

All your examples are behavioral issues, not problems are physical
size. They're entirely different problems, and are dealt with
differently.


It is not just a matter of the physical size of the passengers. It is the
physical size of the seats on some planes. I have been on some flights
where I have been extremely uncomfortable because seats were very narrow
and there was not enough leg room, but on other flights I was quite
comfortable. There was a recent article about a new model of jetliner that
was built with a certain capacity, apparently designed for passenger
comfort, and airline companies are squeezing more seats into them.

Here's an idea: Next time you're eating a nice dinner out at the table
next to me, I'm going to hang my coat on your extra chair, and use part
of your table for my cell phone, car keys, and dessert menus, because I
don't have room for all of it on my table. You don't mind, do you?


So it would seem that it is not really a matter of a person's size that is
the issue, just that you are an asshole.



 




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