French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

By Tom Heneghan, Religion EditorMon Mar 26, 10:20 AM ET

With creationism now coming in Christian and Muslim versions, scientists,
teachers and theologians in France are debating ways to counteract what they
see as growing religious attacks on science.

Bible-based criticism of evolution, once limited to Protestant
fundamentalists in the United States, has become an issue in France now that
Pope Benedict and some leading Catholic theologians have criticized the
neo-Darwinist view of creation.

An Islamist publisher in Turkey mass-mailed a lavishly illustrated Muslim
creationist book to schools across France recently, prompting the Education
Ministry to proscribe the volume and question the way the story of life is
taught here.

The Bible and the Koran say God directly created the world and everything in
it. In Christianity, fundamentalists believe this literally but the largest
denomination, Catholicism, and most mainline Protestant churches read it
more symbolically.

This literalism led Christian fundamentalists to reject the theory of
evolution elaborated in the 19th century by Charles Darwin, the foundation
stone of modern biology. Muslim scholars also dispute evolution but have not
made this a major issue.

"There is a growing distrust of science in public opinion, especially among
the young, and that worries us," said Philippe Deterre, a research biologist
and Catholic priest who organized a colloquium on creationism for scientists
at the weekend.

"There are many issues that go beyond strictly scientific or strictly
theological explanations," he said at the colloquium in this university town
southwest of Paris. Deterre's Blaise Pascal Network promotes understanding
between science and religion.

Barred from teaching creationism in U.S. public schools, some conservative
Christians now advocate the "intelligent design" argument that some forms of
life are too complex to have simply evolved. Scientists call this
creationism in disguise.

These American concerns caught notice in Europe after Vienna Cardinal
Christoph Schoenborn, a confidant of Pope Benedict, attacked neo-Darwinist
theories in 2005 in what seemed to be a move to ally the Catholic Church
with "intelligent design."

GROWING ISSUES IN FRANCE

These theoretical debates became a pressing issue in France last month when
schools unexpectedly received free copies of an "Atlas of Creation" by
Turkish Islamist Harun Yahya that blames Darwinism for everything from
terrorism to Nazism.

Herve Le Guyader, a University of Paris biology professor who advised the
Education Ministry on the Atlas, said high school biology teachers needed
more training now to respond to the increasingly open challenges to the
theory of evolution.

"It's often taught in a simplistic way," he said. "We have to give them the
philosophical arguments they need to respond."

Paleontologist Marc Godinot said creationists and their critics drew
overblown conclusions from a theory that explains how life developed but not
how it was created. The ultimate origin of life is not a question science
can answer, he said.

Creationists reject evolution because some scientists say the role of chance
in it proves that life has no final meaning.

"We have to decode this, but that's a job for philosophers and theologians,"
Godinot said . "Creation is actually a big mystery."

Jacques Arnould, a Catholic priest who works at France's National Center for
Space Research, said Christians in Europe should not look down with
bemusement at creationists abroad.

"They are believers, as we are," the Dominican theologian told the meeting
of about 100, mostly Catholic scientists with a few Muslims as well. "There
are Christian, Muslim and Jewish approaches that we have to respect."

Arnould said the question of life's purpose arose naturally in biology class
but science could not answer it. Instead of offering simple creationism, he
said, theologians should develop views that respect modern science and faith
in a divine purpose.

He said Catholic thinkers should update "natural theology," the teachings of
Saint Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274) that married philosophy and science in a
view that dominated European thought until the 18th-century Enlightenment
divorced the two fields.

"Natural theology was based on the knowledge of the time," said Arnould.
"That knowledge keeps changing, so natural theology has to change too."

Earl Evleth wrote:
French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

By Tom Heneghan, Religion EditorMon Mar 26, 10:20 AM ET

With creationism now coming in Christian and Muslim versions,
scientists, teachers and theologians in France are debating ways to
counteract what they see as growing religious attacks on science.

Bible-based criticism of evolution, once limited to Protestant
fundamentalists in the United States, has become an issue in France
now that Pope Benedict and some leading Catholic theologians have
criticized the neo-Darwinist view of creation.

An Islamist publisher in Turkey mass-mailed a lavishly illustrated
Muslim creationist book to schools across France recently, prompting
the Education Ministry to proscribe the volume and question the way
the story of life is taught here.

The Bible and the Koran say God directly created the world and
everything in it. In Christianity, fundamentalists believe this
literally but the largest denomination, Catholicism, and most
mainline Protestant churches read it more symbolically.

This literalism led Christian fundamentalists to reject the theory of
evolution elaborated in the 19th century by Charles Darwin, the
foundation stone of modern biology. Muslim scholars also dispute
evolution but have not made this a major issue.

"There is a growing distrust of science in public opinion, especially
among the young, and that worries us," said Philippe Deterre, a
research biologist and Catholic priest who organized a colloquium on
creationism for scientists at the weekend.

"There are many issues that go beyond strictly scientific or strictly
theological explanations," he said at the colloquium in this
university town southwest of Paris. Deterre's Blaise Pascal Network
promotes understanding between science and religion.

Barred from teaching creationism in U.S. public schools, some
conservative Christians now advocate the "intelligent design"
argument that some forms of life are too complex to have simply
evolved. Scientists call this creationism in disguise.

These American concerns caught notice in Europe after Vienna Cardinal
Christoph Schoenborn, a confidant of Pope Benedict, attacked
neo-Darwinist theories in 2005 in what seemed to be a move to ally
the Catholic Church with "intelligent design."

GROWING ISSUES IN FRANCE

These theoretical debates became a pressing issue in France last
month when schools unexpectedly received free copies of an "Atlas of
Creation" by Turkish Islamist Harun Yahya that blames Darwinism for
everything from terrorism to Nazism.

Herve Le Guyader, a University of Paris biology professor who advised
the Education Ministry on the Atlas, said high school biology
teachers needed more training now to respond to the increasingly open
challenges to the theory of evolution.

"It's often taught in a simplistic way," he said. "We have to give
them the philosophical arguments they need to respond."

Paleontologist Marc Godinot said creationists and their critics drew
overblown conclusions from a theory that explains how life developed
but not how it was created. The ultimate origin of life is not a
question science can answer, he said.

Creationists reject evolution because some scientists say the role of
chance in it proves that life has no final meaning.

"We have to decode this, but that's a job for philosophers and
theologians," Godinot said . "Creation is actually a big mystery."

Jacques Arnould, a Catholic priest who works at France's National
Center for Space Research, said Christians in Europe should not look
down with bemusement at creationists abroad.

"They are believers, as we are," the Dominican theologian told the
meeting of about 100, mostly Catholic scientists with a few Muslims
as well. "There are Christian, Muslim and Jewish approaches that we
have to respect."

Arnould said the question of life's purpose arose naturally in
biology class but science could not answer it. Instead of offering
simple creationism, he said, theologians should develop views that
respect modern science and faith in a divine purpose.

He said Catholic thinkers should update "natural theology," the
teachings of Saint Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274) that married philosophy
and science in a view that dominated European thought until the
18th-century Enlightenment divorced the two fields.

"Natural theology was based on the knowledge of the time," said
Arnould. "That knowledge keeps changing, so natural theology has to
change too."

ESPECIALLY WHEN TRAVELING IN EUROPE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hemingway schrieb:
Earl Evleth wrote:
French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

The ultimate origin of life is not a
question science can answer, he said.
Why not?
It falls outside evolution but not outside science.

Creationists reject evolution because some scientists say the role of
chance in it proves that life has no final meaning.
So what?
It's like rejecting a cancer diagnosis because I don't like
to have cancer.

"We have to decode this,
Yes.

but that's a job for philosophers and
theologians,"
Why? In particular, why theologians? Because they can't
work impartially? And why not scientists? Because they
are the only ones able to actually arrive at an answer?

Godinot said . "Creation is actually a big mystery."
No it's not.


Arnould said the question of life's purpose arose naturally in
biology class but science could not answer it.
Wrong. Science can answer it. It's just that believers don't
like the answer.

ESPECIALLY WHEN TRAVELING IN EUROPE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No, especially when one discovers that brains are for using.
But I agree, in europe it's still possible to get laughed at
for promoting creationism. Thank god.

Lots of Greetings!
Volker
--
For email replies, please substitute the obvious.

On 29/03/07 19:20, in article , "Volker
Hetzer" wrote:

Hemingway schrieb:
Earl Evleth wrote:
French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

The ultimate origin of life is not a
question science can answer, he said.

Why not?
It falls outside evolution but not outside science.

It depends on the word "ultimate". But even within the
context of all science approach, we have problems of imagination,
imagining how it might have happened and apparently not having
te possibility of testing various hypothesis.

We do know mildly complicated molecules are synthesized in
space.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...rstellar_space

Complex UV photochemistry is though to occur on the surfaces of
of colder astronomical structures.

But to jump from these simpler structures to the mare complex
structures found in life is a big jump. Even so there is an element
of "faith" among scientists that self-reproducing molecular
structures came into existence accidentally.

Creationists reject evolution because some scientists say the role of
chance in it proves that life has no final meaning.

So what?

People give it the meaning they want to, religious or non-religious.

It's like rejecting a cancer diagnosis because I don't like
to have cancer.

Alas, denial is always at work, in various degrees. The hard part
is accepting personal death. After all, one has been alive as long
as one can remember. We have no memory of before birth and our
imagination of what death will be like is lacking.

but that's a job for philosophers and
theologians,"
Why? In particular, why theologians?

Their self-appointed fates.

Earl Evleth wrote:

On 29/03/07 19:20, in article , "Volker
Hetzer" wrote:


Hemingway schrieb:

Earl Evleth wrote:

French scientists rebut U.S., Muslim creationism

The ultimate origin of life is not a
question science can answer, he said.


Why not?
It falls outside evolution but not outside science.


It depends on the word "ultimate". But even within the
context of all science approach, we have problems of imagination,
imagining how it might have happened and apparently not having
te possibility of testing various hypothesis.

I have never quite understood why the more narrow-minded
religious faiths think it must be an "either/or"
proposition! Their faith tells them "God created...." and
science is gradually discovering the "how". I see no
conflict - it's just a matter of widening one's perceptions.
(From what I understand, the more esoteric branches of
physics and mathematics can easily be confused with
philosophy - like the famous "Schroedinger's cat".)