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Spain & Portugal Travel
What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We
have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? Also what would be the best method of travel, bus, car, train? Joetino |
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Am 28 Oct 2004 19:03:16 -0700 schrieb Joetino:
What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? If you want to see Morocco, there's a ferry going over to Tangier. Or (much better) you book an organised tour (in Spian) by plane and go see Marrakech. Regards, Frank |
#3
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"Joetino" wrote in message om... What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? Also what would be the best method of travel, bus, car, train? I would forget Morocco. You would only get to see Tangier, which is not at all typical of Morocco, a fascinating country worth a trip in itself. Portugal is a very interesting country and has much to see, in spite of its small size. I consider Lisbon to be one of the most interesting cities in Europe. You can take a night train from Madrid. You may also want to visit Porto which is not too far from Lisbon. From Lisbon you can do a day trip to Evora by bus if you leave early in the morning. There is an abundance of Roman ruins and an aqueduct where people have built their homes into the arches. There is also a bones chapel, made entirely of human bones and skulls with the inscription "Our bones wait for your bones." In Portugal the buses are cheap and very fast. The advantage over trains is that not all train stations are in the city centre. There is a night train from Lisbon to Madrid or you can fly. Madrid to Sevilla--either fly or take the AVE, the high-speed train. It's best to travel from Seville to Granada by bus as the rail connections are not the best. Toledo is a day trip from Madrid, as is Segovia. You might also consider visiting Salamanca if time allows. As for Barcelona, you might consider flying from Portugal or from Madrid, depending on how you plan your trip. There is a train from Madrid, but no high speed train yet as far as I know. Many people prefer Barcelona to Madrid. It has a very different flavour and the revival of Catalan has been very strong since the death of Franco. In Spain be especially on the alert for pickpockets and bag snatchers. Lana |
#4
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What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We
have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? Also what would be the best method of travel, bus, car, train? Bus is by far cheapest, but train is much faster and more pleasant. Don't underestimate the time involved in travelling by bus - especially in the south of spain the road between two cities is rarely a straight line. Don't rent a car unless you really plan on going off the beaten track. You don't want to have a car in the major cities - Seville has more smashed windshields than any city I've ever seen, and parking in Madrid or Barcelona must be an absolute nightmare. In three weeks, I'd recommend: Madrid (4 including a day trip to Toledo), Seville (2), Cordoba (2), Grenada (2), Valencia (2), Barcelona (5), San Sebastian (2), Bilbao (1), Madrid. You could see Portugal or Morocco, but if so you should cut out Barcelona, San Sebastian, Bilbao, and maybe Valencia from the itinerary above. If you want to see Morocco, you should plan to spend at least a week there, and you should consider flying into Casablanca or Marrakech. Travelling overland from Seville or Grenada to Rabat or Fez will cost almost as much as a flight, will take loads of time, and may force you to waste time or even stay overnight in places that are of no interest (e.g. Algeciras). A day trip to Tangier really isn't worth it - it's an absolute dump, and is not representative of the rest of Morocco. |
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I would consider adding the Basque Country to your itinerary. I was in the Basque Country of Spain in June and it is one of the best places I have found in Europe. San Sebastian, in particular, is a beautiful beach town and has the best tapas bars I know. I was also in Pamplona (1 hour by bus from San Sebastian) and Bilbao (also 1 hour by bus) to see the Guggenheim Museum. Bayonne and Biarritz, France, are a half hour by train from San Sebastian and are also worth seeing. This area is also a good time value because it is compact and you won't have to spend a lot of time getting from one place to another. Joetino wrote: What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? Also what would be the best method of travel, bus, car, train? Joetino |
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I would consider adding the Basque Country to your itinerary. I was in the Basque Country of Spain in June and it is one of the best places I have found in Europe. San Sebastian, in particular, is a beautiful beach town and has the best tapas bars I know. I was also in Pamplona (1 hour by bus from San Sebastian) and Bilbao (also 1 hour by bus) to see the Guggenheim Museum. Bayonne and Biarritz, France, are a half hour by train from San Sebastian and are also worth seeing. This area is also a good time value because it is compact and you won't have to spend a lot of time getting from one place to another. Joetino wrote: What are the best places or sites to see in Spain and Portugal.. We have three weeks in May 05 and would like to see, Madrid toledo, Seville, Granda... is it possiable to see Morocco, Lisbon and Barcelona? Also what would be the best method of travel, bus, car, train? Joetino |
#7
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I frankly disagree with most things you say:
The highway network in the south of Spain is one of the most convenient in the country, connecting the capital city Seville with Huelva and the Portuguese border to the West in a fairly straight line, Granada and Málaga to the East and South East in yet nearly straight lines and finally Cadiz and the Strait of Gibraltar to the South in a rather straight line to the South (don't miss the new highway connection from Jerez to Algeciras-La Linea-Gibraltar... the scenery is simply marvellous). On the other hand the rest of national roads inside Andalusia are quite decent considering the vast mountain ranges running along most of the region. If you consider renting a car, you can certainly go off the beaten track. I see hundreds of rental cars in Seville on a daily basis, most driven by foreigners visiting the city after renting in the Costa del Sol or even Seville itself. And most of them simply take basic precautions as I'd do if I rented a car somewhere else in Europe (or even the rest of the world?): do not leave valuables inside the car, especially if they're visible form the outside! Moreover, I'd like to say that parking in any big city in Europe must be an 'absolute nightmare'. What did you expect in Spain? parking just outside Barcelona's Sagrada familia? Right in Madrid's Plaza Mayor? Maybe you thought you could leave your car anywhere in any city's downtown area? We all commute to our jobs and use publlic transport in order to avoid taking the car into the city centre. Bus is by far cheapest, but train is much faster and more pleasant. Don't underestimate the time involved in travelling by bus - especially in the south of spain the road between two cities is rarely a straight line. Don't rent a car unless you really plan on going off the beaten track. You don't want to have a car in the major cities - Seville has more smashed windshields than any city I've ever seen, and parking in Madrid or Barcelona must be an absolute nightmare. In three weeks, I'd recommend: Madrid (4 including a day trip to Toledo), Seville (2), Cordoba (2), Grenada (2), Valencia (2), Barcelona (5), San Sebastian (2), Bilbao (1), Madrid. You could see Portugal or Morocco, but if so you should cut out Barcelona, San Sebastian, Bilbao, and maybe Valencia from the itinerary above. If you want to see Morocco, you should plan to spend at least a week there, and you should consider flying into Casablanca or Marrakech. Travelling overland from Seville or Grenada to Rabat or Fez will cost almost as much as a flight, will take loads of time, and may force you to waste time or even stay overnight in places that are of no interest (e.g. Algeciras). A day trip to Tangier really isn't worth it - it's an absolute dump, and is not representative of the rest of Morocco. |
#8
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I frankly disagree with most things you say:
The highway network in the south of Spain is one of the most convenient in the country, connecting the capital city Seville with Huelva and the Portuguese border to the West in a fairly straight line, Granada and Málaga to the East and South East in yet nearly straight lines and finally Cadiz and the Strait of Gibraltar to the South in a rather straight line to the South (don't miss the new highway connection from Jerez to Algeciras-La Linea-Gibraltar... the scenery is simply marvellous). On the other hand the rest of national roads inside Andalusia are quite decent considering the vast mountain ranges running along most of the region. If you consider renting a car, you can certainly go off the beaten track. I see hundreds of rental cars in Seville on a daily basis, most driven by foreigners visiting the city after renting in the Costa del Sol or even Seville itself. And most of them simply take basic precautions as I'd do if I rented a car somewhere else in Europe (or even the rest of the world?): do not leave valuables inside the car, especially if they're visible form the outside! Moreover, I'd like to say that parking in any big city in Europe must be an 'absolute nightmare'. What did you expect in Spain? parking just outside Barcelona's Sagrada familia? Right in Madrid's Plaza Mayor? Maybe you thought you could leave your car anywhere in any city's downtown area? We all commute to our jobs and use publlic transport in order to avoid taking the car into the city centre. Bus is by far cheapest, but train is much faster and more pleasant. Don't underestimate the time involved in travelling by bus - especially in the south of spain the road between two cities is rarely a straight line. Don't rent a car unless you really plan on going off the beaten track. You don't want to have a car in the major cities - Seville has more smashed windshields than any city I've ever seen, and parking in Madrid or Barcelona must be an absolute nightmare. In three weeks, I'd recommend: Madrid (4 including a day trip to Toledo), Seville (2), Cordoba (2), Grenada (2), Valencia (2), Barcelona (5), San Sebastian (2), Bilbao (1), Madrid. You could see Portugal or Morocco, but if so you should cut out Barcelona, San Sebastian, Bilbao, and maybe Valencia from the itinerary above. If you want to see Morocco, you should plan to spend at least a week there, and you should consider flying into Casablanca or Marrakech. Travelling overland from Seville or Grenada to Rabat or Fez will cost almost as much as a flight, will take loads of time, and may force you to waste time or even stay overnight in places that are of no interest (e.g. Algeciras). A day trip to Tangier really isn't worth it - it's an absolute dump, and is not representative of the rest of Morocco. |
#9
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Travelling by car in Andalucia is a pleasure. I often motor from Malaga to
Cadiz and use the A381 road from Los Barrios (near Gibraltar) and Jerez de la Frontera. Apart from a few kms., this road is virtually finished and it is a great drive on new roads with 2 lanes. Through open country. I saw several (perhaps 12) eagles soaring around on my last journey. The road from Seville to the Algarve is easy and enjoyable. If you stay on the main roads (Autovias - toll roads) you won't be disappointed and the tolls are modest and worth it. The road from Seville to Granada is all 2 lane highway and not toll road so this route is great ! Also don't forget that hiring a car in Spain is cheap especially in Andalucia compared with other countries. I hired a compact small car but upgraded to a medium sized car on my last trip from Malaga and it cost all inclusive and no insurance deductible about Euros 10 PER DAY ! That is cheap. It's possible to hire in one place then drop off in another. But I believe hiring a car in Portugal and taking to Spain is going to be much more costly. Bus journies are not too bad either. There are many bus companies in Spain each having some kind of concession area. There is a web site with some journies already on but it's not totally reliable: http://www.movelia.es/ You may be lucky. However there are always good connections betwene major cities/towns in Spain by bus. just ask for the route and you will find the company .... Trains are good especially the fast ones like AVE. But those are more expensive. www.renfe.es Sometimes an internal flight using www.iberia.es can be reasonably priced so investigate the tariff online and you can also book using the ticketless method with a CC. Someimes the ticket 'with restrictions' in other words not transferable - can be cheap, especially the more unpopular times. There are many flights each day between Madrid-Barcelona - a sort of shuttle. On public holidays or fiestas they can be busy so it's a good idea to travel outside these days. Look for public holidays anyway in Spain and you will find some fun. For example in Jerez there will be the annual Horse Fair in early May (not sure exact time) which is great. That reminds me- El Rocio pilgrimage is in May next year. Always falls at Pentecost.(Whitsun) The pilgrimage to a place in the middle of the Donana Park south west of Seville. http://www.rocio.com/ But there will be other celebrations depending on the place at this time. |
#10
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Actually, I found parking in Madrid to be quite good. There was a large
underground garage just a couple of blocks from the major museums. For tourists it did quite well. FPdA wrote: I frankly disagree with most things you say: The highway network in the south of Spain is one of the most convenient in the country, connecting the capital city Seville with Huelva and the Portuguese border to the West in a fairly straight line, Granada and Málaga to the East and South East in yet nearly straight lines and finally Cadiz and the Strait of Gibraltar to the South in a rather straight line to the South (don't miss the new highway connection from Jerez to Algeciras-La Linea-Gibraltar... the scenery is simply marvellous). On the other hand the rest of national roads inside Andalusia are quite decent considering the vast mountain ranges running along most of the region. If you consider renting a car, you can certainly go off the beaten track. I see hundreds of rental cars in Seville on a daily basis, most driven by foreigners visiting the city after renting in the Costa del Sol or even Seville itself. And most of them simply take basic precautions as I'd do if I rented a car somewhere else in Europe (or even the rest of the world?): do not leave valuables inside the car, especially if they're visible form the outside! Moreover, I'd like to say that parking in any big city in Europe must be an 'absolute nightmare'. What did you expect in Spain? parking just outside Barcelona's Sagrada familia? Right in Madrid's Plaza Mayor? Maybe you thought you could leave your car anywhere in any city's downtown area? We all commute to our jobs and use publlic transport in order to avoid taking the car into the city centre. Bus is by far cheapest, but train is much faster and more pleasant. Don't underestimate the time involved in travelling by bus - especially in the south of spain the road between two cities is rarely a straight line. Don't rent a car unless you really plan on going off the beaten track. You don't want to have a car in the major cities - Seville has more smashed windshields than any city I've ever seen, and parking in Madrid or Barcelona must be an absolute nightmare. In three weeks, I'd recommend: Madrid (4 including a day trip to Toledo), Seville (2), Cordoba (2), Grenada (2), Valencia (2), Barcelona (5), San Sebastian (2), Bilbao (1), Madrid. You could see Portugal or Morocco, but if so you should cut out Barcelona, San Sebastian, Bilbao, and maybe Valencia from the itinerary above. If you want to see Morocco, you should plan to spend at least a week there, and you should consider flying into Casablanca or Marrakech. Travelling overland from Seville or Grenada to Rabat or Fez will cost almost as much as a flight, will take loads of time, and may force you to waste time or even stay overnight in places that are of no interest (e.g. Algeciras). A day trip to Tangier really isn't worth it - it's an absolute dump, and is not representative of the rest of Morocco. |
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