fees into Yosemite National Park won't be raised

Peter Lawrence wrote:

Even though the price increase didn't affect me personally in a major
way (I always bought the annual National Park Pass), I think the Park
Service did a major disservice to the American people by raising the
entrance fee so high.

Raising the fees so high is all part of the new "war on the poor," that
has replaced the "war on poverty."

Annual pass costs went way up this year. In 2008, the $50 National Park
Pass was discontinued, replaced by the $80 "America the Beautiful –
National Parks and Federal Recreational Lands Pass", and now includes
entrance to sites managed by Forest Service, National Park Service, Fish
& Wildlife Service, and Bureau of Land Management. With the National
Park Pass, if you wanted those other lands included it was an extra $15
for a Golden Eagle Pass.

The new, more expensive, pass has other disadvantages as well. For
instance, last week I was at Oregon Caves National Monument. We had five
people in our group. The new pass covers the cave tour fee for only four
people. At first they were about to charge me for the fifth person, then
she noticed that I had the old National Park Pass (purchased in December
2007) and not the new "America the Beautiful – National Parks and
Federal Recreational Lands Pass." She said that the National Park Pass
had no limitation on the number of people for the tour (limited to the
number of people in your vehicle). They haven't updated their web site
to reflect the decontenting of the new pass,
"http://www.nps.gov/archive/orca/cavetours.html". The five tours (2
adults, three kids) would have cost me $35 without a pass.

Hatunen wrote:
On 25 Jun 2007 15:10:10 -0800, (Eugene Miya)
wrote:


A lot of low-income people (in the hundred of thousands) live within an
easy 2-hour drive from Yosemite Valley, and even now, with gasoline
costing $3.50/gallon, they probably wouldn't have to spend more than $30
in gas for the round-trip to and from Yosemite.
Suggest public transportation.

What public transportaton goes to Yosemite?

YARTS

"http://www.yarts.com/"

Of course unless you're solo, public transportation costs more than driving.

One of the reasons why attendance at Yosemite has fallen so
dramatically recently is the landslide that has closed part of 140 and
forced a detour that tour buses can't use. Since buses now have to
either go south to 41 or north to 120, this has cut down the number of
visitors significantly. However the attendance had been falling even
before the road closure, and even before the higher price of gasoline.
It started when the entrance fee went from $5 per car to $20 per car
back in 1997. That was too big of an increase all at once, they should
have done a more gradual increase.

See "http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20070125/ai_n17165583"
"http://www.insidebayarea.com/ci_6202099?source=most_viewed"

In terms of back country use, the changing demographics have a lot to do
with reduced usage. I used to do a lot of backpacking in Yosemite, and
you'd find an occasional foreign visitor (usually German) in the back
country, but it wasn't an activity favored by many U.S. residents that
were recent immigrants, or that were low income (despite it being a very
cheap activity).

What always amused me is that it costs more for four people to walk in,
or bicycle in, to Yosemite than it costs for a car with four people to
enter.

The fee increases will only bring in $30 million nationwide. The way the
Republicans waste money on useless wars and other projects, this is peanuts.

On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 02:15:45 -0700, Peter Lawrence
wrote:

Hatunen wrote:
On 25 Jun 2007 15:10:10 -0800, (Eugene Miya)
wrote:


A lot of low-income people (in the hundred of thousands) live within an
easy 2-hour drive from Yosemite Valley, and even now, with gasoline
costing $3.50/gallon, they probably wouldn't have to spend more than $30
in gas for the round-trip to and from Yosemite.
Suggest public transportation.

What public transportaton goes to Yosemite?

YARTS - Yosemite Area Regional Transportation System

http://www.yarts.com/

Very interesting. And it links to the AMTRAK station.

It provides year-around bus service from Merced and Mariposa to Yosemite
Valley, and summertime service from Mammoth Lakes over Tioga Pass to
Yosemite Valley.

That must be quite a bus ride.


--
************* DAVE HATUNEN ) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *

In article ,
SMS wrote:
The new, more expensive, pass has other disadvantages as well. For
instance, last week I was at Oregon Caves National Monument. We
had five people in our group. The new pass covers the cave tour
fee for only four people.

Oregon Caves was the only place I ever encountered where they took
the National Parks pass to cover tours. I was surprised, but hey,
I was happy not to pay for the tours.

I don't think raising the price from $65 to $80 for the new pass
is a big deal. I agree the new rules seem more byzantine. (The
old rule was spouse, children, and parents for places with a
per-person entrance fee.)

Oregon Caves was a great deal, but the old pass had its limitations
already. I certainly remember showing up at Mount Rushmore, with
a pass that *had a picture of Mount Rushmore on it* and being told
it wasn't valid. I'm still steamed about that. (Their technicality
is that they're charging you to park, and don't have an entrance
fee.) We simply left.

Also, we have run into multiple BLM sites with posted "Golden Eagle
not Accepted" signs. These have all been unmanned, so I could never
quiz them, but uh, how can they just arbitrarily decide that? I
figure with the new pass, those places won't update their signs for
a long time, so I'll be good at least for a while. Actually, with
the new pass and their broad claims of all federal areas, I'm not
going to accept a sign like that without explanation.

The dumbest thing about the new pass in my opinion? When you order
it in advance, they don't print your name on it, as they did the
old pass. Yet they still ask you for ID. Brilliant!

Suggest public transportation.
What public transportaton goes to Yosemite?
YARTS - Yosemite Area Regional Transportation System
http://www.yarts.com/
Very interesting. And it links to the AMTRAK station.

While the number of YARTS buses per day is limited,
there are 4 S trains and 4 N trains per day on Amtrak.
And it is quite evident which passengers are going to Yosemite.
And there are independent Amtrak buses.
And other public bus lines.

It provides year-around bus service from Merced and Mariposa to Yosemite
Valley, and summertime service from Mammoth Lakes over Tioga Pass to
Yosemite Valley.

That must be quite a bus ride.

--

Todd Michel McComb wrote:
In article ,
SMS wrote:
The new, more expensive, pass has other disadvantages as well. For
instance, last week I was at Oregon Caves National Monument. We
had five people in our group. The new pass covers the cave tour
fee for only four people.

Oregon Caves was the only place I ever encountered where they took
the National Parks pass to cover tours. I was surprised, but hey,
I was happy not to pay for the tours.

I don't think raising the price from $65 to $80 for the new pass
is a big deal. I agree the new rules seem more byzantine. (The
old rule was spouse, children, and parents for places with a
per-person entrance fee.)

Oregon Caves was a great deal, but the old pass had its limitations
already. I certainly remember showing up at Mount Rushmore, with
a pass that *had a picture of Mount Rushmore on it* and being told
it wasn't valid. I'm still steamed about that. (Their technicality
is that they're charging you to park, and don't have an entrance
fee.) We simply left.

The California State Park Pass has similar issues. Some state beaches
just don't accept it. I used to buy the pass anyway, since you could pay
$25 extra and get a second pass, and we usually go with two cars and an
extended family. When they dropped the second pass, it was no longer a
good deal.

Todd Michel McComb wrote:

Oregon Caves was the only place I ever encountered where they took
the National Parks pass to cover tours. I was surprised, but hey,
I was happy not to pay for the tours.

I think it's because the caves are essentially the whole monument, and
the tour fee is really the admission fee to the monument.

Very cool park (literally) if you're in the area. Good lodge with good
restaurants too. We took some unpaved Forest Service roads on the way
back and saw some good wildlife sightings.

In article ,
SMS wrote:
I think it's because the caves are essentially the whole monument,
and the tour fee is really the admission fee to the monument.
Very cool park (literally) if you're in the area.

Yeah, Oregon Caves is a good destination.

Anyway, Mammoth or Carlsbad or Timpanogos or Jewel or Wind or... I
could go on... charge you for cave tours whether you have a National
Parks Pass or not. And there's nothing else at those places. It
really was designed to cover entrance fees, not tours. I have no
idea why Oregon Caves takes it for tours, but that's a pleasant
thing.

Todd Michel McComb wrote:
In article ,
SMS wrote:
I think it's because the caves are essentially the whole monument,
and the tour fee is really the admission fee to the monument.
Very cool park (literally) if you're in the area.

Yeah, Oregon Caves is a good destination.

Anyway, Mammoth or Carlsbad or Timpanogos or Jewel or Wind or... I
could go on... charge you for cave tours whether you have a National
Parks Pass or not. And there's nothing else at those places. It
really was designed to cover entrance fees, not tours. I have no
idea why Oregon Caves takes it for tours, but that's a pleasant
thing.

Maybe it's because it helps them sell more passes. If you're about to
spend $35 on tours, the pass suddenly looks like a very good deal.