What does the AlItalia situation mean for travellers?

As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.
A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end business,
if thats what they are forced to do.

The information level is as always in the airline industry just
short of saying nothing. I have been informed that I 'll take my trip
in September - unless I'll read different in the press.
With the ticket prepaid it seems impossible to rebook on another airline?
And what if the company actually goes bancrupt while I am out on
one of their destinations -- then I'll just have to buy a ticket from
another company? With my AlItalia ticket lost?
From a passenger viewpoint this is just about as bad as it can be?

What actually happened in the Swiss Air, Sabena situations?

What is the likely outcome in all of this? In case of strikes instead
og bankruptcy - does that put me in a better situation moneywise?

B.

"Boerge Olsen" wrote in message
om...
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.

The liability of shareholders in a limited company is, indeed, limited to
to the paid-up value of the shares in their hands. Alitalia is a
listed limited company partly owned by the Italian state through the
holding called IRI, not a government department. Moreover, I believe that
IRI's slice of the shareholding pie amount to slightly mode than 50% of
the total, with another 20% or so controlled by the employees and the rest
floated on the stockmarket: at least, this was the situation after the
restructuring completed in 1998.

A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end
business, if thats what they are forced to do.

Decency... Hmmm, that would be an interesting idea for a radical change!

The information level is as always in the airline industry just
short of saying nothing. I have been informed that I 'll take my trip
in September - unless I'll read different in the press.
With the ticket prepaid it seems impossible to rebook on another
airline?

I guess that the best thing to do for you is to talk with your travel
agent...

Good luck,

Enzo

"Boerge Olsen" wrote in message
om...
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.

The liability of shareholders in a limited company is, indeed, limited to
to the paid-up value of the shares in their hands. Alitalia is a
listed limited company partly owned by the Italian state through the
holding called IRI, not a government department. Moreover, I believe that
IRI's slice of the shareholding pie amount to slightly mode than 50% of
the total, with another 20% or so controlled by the employees and the rest
floated on the stockmarket: at least, this was the situation after the
restructuring completed in 1998.

A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end
business, if thats what they are forced to do.

Decency... Hmmm, that would be an interesting idea for a radical change!

The information level is as always in the airline industry just
short of saying nothing. I have been informed that I 'll take my trip
in September - unless I'll read different in the press.
With the ticket prepaid it seems impossible to rebook on another
airline?

I guess that the best thing to do for you is to talk with your travel
agent...

Good luck,

Enzo

"Boerge Olsen" wrote in message
om...
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.
A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end business,
if thats what they are forced to do.

The information level is as always in the airline industry just
short of saying nothing. I have been informed that I 'll take my trip
in September - unless I'll read different in the press.
With the ticket prepaid it seems impossible to rebook on another airline?
And what if the company actually goes bancrupt while I am out on
one of their destinations -- then I'll just have to buy a ticket from
another company? With my AlItalia ticket lost?
From a passenger viewpoint this is just about as bad as it can be?

What actually happened in the Swiss Air, Sabena situations?

What is the likely outcome in all of this? In case of strikes instead
og bankruptcy - does that put me in a better situation moneywise?

B.

If you paid for tickets using a credit card then you probably have some recourse
if the Airline goes out of business.

Otherwise, what does your travel insurance policy cover you for?

JohnT

(Boerge Olsen) writes:

And what if the company actually goes bancrupt while I am out on
one of their destinations -- then I'll just have to buy a ticket from
another company? With my AlItalia ticket lost?
From a passenger viewpoint this is just about as bad as it can be?

This happened earlier this year, when a low-cost irish airline
folded. A few hundred people stranded in Malaga. Had to find their
own way back.


Cheers, jonivar

--
| jonivar skullerud | http://www.jonivar.skullerud.name/ |
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where wages are high ... we shall always find the workmen more active,
diligent, and expeditious than where they are low ... In reality high
profits tend much more to raise the price of work than high wages.
Adam Smith, Wealth of Nations

(Boerge Olsen) writes:

And what if the company actually goes bancrupt while I am out on
one of their destinations -- then I'll just have to buy a ticket from
another company? With my AlItalia ticket lost?
From a passenger viewpoint this is just about as bad as it can be?

This happened earlier this year, when a low-cost irish airline
folded. A few hundred people stranded in Malaga. Had to find their
own way back.


Cheers, jonivar

--
| jonivar skullerud | http://www.jonivar.skullerud.name/ |
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where wages are high ... we shall always find the workmen more active,
diligent, and expeditious than where they are low ... In reality high
profits tend much more to raise the price of work than high wages.
Adam Smith, Wealth of Nations

Boerge Olsen wrote:
As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.

The state may own shares, but it is still a corporation with debts, contracts,
bank aco****s, lines of credit.

At one point, the creditors may decide to seize Alitalia's planes, at which
point, it can no longer fly. The government has already provided a bailout
package that was the limit of what the EU would allow.

A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end business,
if thats what they are forced to do.

Nop. The minute creditors demand their money back, they become de-facto
owners. If the airline is operationally losing money (once you factor out debt
and tax payments), then the creditors will want to stop the airline ASAP so it
stops losing money and will fire all employees except a very small skeleton staff.

Remember that secured creditors have a legal right to seize some of the assets
that were used as collateral when Alitalia entered into some debt
arranngement. So if Alitalia stops making lease payments on aircraft, the
lessors will simply seize the aircraft.

If Alitalia stops making payments to airports, then the airport can prevent
the aircraft from taking off (in essense seizing it) until it gets paid.


short of saying nothing. I have been informed that I 'll take my trip
in September - unless I'll read different in the press.


From what I read, the current issue is more to scar the unions into giving up
more perks, and that a shut down would be more a medium term thing.

And what if the company actually goes bancrupt while I am out on
one of their destinations -- then I'll just have to buy a ticket from
another company?

Correct. Although other companies may allow you to buy half of a return ticket
to get you back home (instead of forxing you to buy a last minute full fare
one way ticket). But they will not hnour the value of your alitalia ticket
since there won't be an alitalia to give the airline any cash as compensation
for it taking you home.

In some instances, passengers were asked to pay by cash. (When Nationair in
canada went belly up, Sabena offered to handle the pax stranded at Brussels,
but they had to pay cash !!!).

"Boerge Olsen" wrote in message
om...
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

The precarious position of Delta was the major reason I bought trip
insurance for my vacation this summer. The only real item prepaid and
needing insurance was the airline tickets. However, you want to make sure
that you insure the trip with a company not connected with your airline,
tour operator or cruise line. If the line goes bankrupt, they could too and
your insurance would be worthless. IMHO, YMMV, etc.

--
Donald Newcomb
DRNewcomb (at) attglobal (dot) net

"Boerge Olsen" wrote in message
om...
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

The precarious position of Delta was the major reason I bought trip
insurance for my vacation this summer. The only real item prepaid and
needing insurance was the airline tickets. However, you want to make sure
that you insure the trip with a company not connected with your airline,
tour operator or cruise line. If the line goes bankrupt, they could too and
your insurance would be worthless. IMHO, YMMV, etc.

--
Donald Newcomb
DRNewcomb (at) attglobal (dot) net

Boerge Olsen wrote:
As one of the many (perhaps) unfortunately ones who have
bought AlItalia tickets for Italy this September I am wondering
what to make of the latest news?

As a (primarily) state owned company I can't really understand how
the company could go bankrupt with passengers stranded on destinations.
A refund of tickets and stop for booking on flights from a particular
day seems a much more decent way for a state owned company to end business,
if thats what they are forced to do.

After reading your post, I started reading some on line local (Italy)
newspaper, and I can say that Alitalia isn't yet bankrupt, but just in
an emergency.
Maybe it will go sooner or later, but for your next travel in Italy you
shouldn't have to worry.
Regards