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"Ciao" - acceptable or what?



 
 
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  #11  
Old June 14th, 2005, 11:50 AM
Graeme Miller
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"tile" wrote in message
...
Ciao would be used among young people or among people that are well
acquainted with each other.
It would be funny to use it with people that you do not know or older than
you are.


Thanks.

So, ageism is built-in! Oh dear, Well I'm 50 this year, so I guess that
means I should act my age and stick with 'Buon Giorno'. But on the other
hand, from what you say I'll get loads of respect from the younger folk. ;-)


  #12  
Old June 14th, 2005, 11:54 AM
Gorazd Bozic
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Deep Foiled Malls wrote:

And that's usually mispronounced by foreigners as "GRAHT-zi", and not
"GRAHT-zi-ay" as it should be!


I guess this should be "by foreigners whose first language is English."

Gorazd
  #13  
Old June 14th, 2005, 11:54 AM
Gorazd Bozic
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Deep Foiled Malls wrote:

And that's usually mispronounced by foreigners as "GRAHT-zi", and not
"GRAHT-zi-ay" as it should be!


I guess this should be "by foreigners whose first language is English."

Gorazd
  #14  
Old June 14th, 2005, 12:26 PM
jcoulter
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Deep Foiled Malls wrote in
news


grazie!


And that's usually mispronounced by foreigners as "GRAHT-zi", and not
"GRAHT-zi-ay" as it should be!


is there any room for grah tzi uh ie not hitting the e long enough to
make a lot of noise sort of swaling it like a schwa at the end?


--
Joseph Coulter
Cruises and Vacations
http://www.josephcoulter.com/

  #15  
Old June 14th, 2005, 01:19 PM
Luca Logi
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Graeme Miller wrote:

Conversational Italian now...

The older language tapes suggest that "Ciao" is only for use between friends
of if you're talking to children. The more modern BBC late night programmes
sprinkle the greeting around quite liberally as if its got the same status
as "Hi" in English.

Lots of perfect strangers say "Hi" to each other in the English speaking
world, but would an Italian I don't know be affronted if I said "Ciao" to
them on first meeting?


The rule is: you should say "ciao" only to people familiar enough, that
you would address with the "tu" form. If the people are unfamiliar
enough to deserve the "lei" form, "ciao" is inappropriate.

Of course, most people will understand that such subtilities are lost to
foreigners, and will not be offended by a "ciao" coming from a
foreigner. However, it does not stop sounding inappropriate, especially
to older persons (at 42, I am old enough to hear it as inappropriate).


--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail:
Home page:
http://www.angelfire.com/ar/archivarius
(musicologia pratica)
  #16  
Old June 14th, 2005, 01:52 PM
tile
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and did you have use Salve as a greeting ??
I guess you use Buongiorno when you enter a shop or a restaurant or a
museum, or a hotel or an office.

when you part, and you feel people have been kind to you
you normally say
grazie e arrivederci.
I guess salve would be used a little more south than Umbria and Lazio. ( I
guess from the latin Salvete..
from salus / salutis health )
"Luca Logi" ha scritto nel messaggio
...
Graeme Miller wrote:

Conversational Italian now...

The older language tapes suggest that "Ciao" is only for use between
friends
of if you're talking to children. The more modern BBC late night
programmes
sprinkle the greeting around quite liberally as if its got the same
status
as "Hi" in English.

Lots of perfect strangers say "Hi" to each other in the English speaking
world, but would an Italian I don't know be affronted if I said "Ciao" to
them on first meeting?


The rule is: you should say "ciao" only to people familiar enough, that
you would address with the "tu" form. If the people are unfamiliar
enough to deserve the "lei" form, "ciao" is inappropriate.

Of course, most people will understand that such subtilities are lost to
foreigners, and will not be offended by a "ciao" coming from a
foreigner. However, it does not stop sounding inappropriate, especially
to older persons (at 42, I am old enough to hear it as inappropriate).


--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail:
Home page:
http://www.angelfire.com/ar/archivarius
(musicologia pratica)



  #17  
Old June 14th, 2005, 05:08 PM
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Well, this is all news to me - I was in Venice in June & got a lot of
Ciao's! & Ciao Bellas! - is it because it's such a touristy city (of
course, which large ones aren't?!)

  #18  
Old June 14th, 2005, 07:30 PM
Deep Foiled Malls
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On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 06:26:38 -0500, jcoulter
wrote:

Deep Foiled Malls wrote in
news


grazie!


And that's usually mispronounced by foreigners as "GRAHT-zi", and not
"GRAHT-zi-ay" as it should be!


is there any room for grah tzi uh ie not hitting the e long enough to
make a lot of noise sort of swaling it like a schwa at the end?


Just don't swal that schwa in your dinner.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
  #19  
Old June 14th, 2005, 07:33 PM
Deep Foiled Malls
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On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:50:24 +0100, "Graeme Miller"
wrote:

"tile" wrote in message
...
Ciao would be used among young people or among people that are well
acquainted with each other.
It would be funny to use it with people that you do not know or older than
you are.


Thanks.

So, ageism is built-in! Oh dear, Well I'm 50 this year, so I guess that
means I should act my age and stick with 'Buon Giorno'. But on the other
hand, from what you say I'll get loads of respect from the younger folk. ;-)


Just used 'salve'. It works fine in any situation and wont go wrong.
It's also the easiest to pronounce for anglo speakers.

Once you have made some personal friends, use ciao.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
  #20  
Old July 5th, 2005, 09:53 AM
B Vaughan
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On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 05:02:58 GMT, "tile" wrote:

i have never used salve in my life..


Many other Italians use it liberally, especially when they can't
decide whether "ciao" or "buon giorno" would be more appropriate, or
when they want to avoid being too informal yet don't want to feel
servile. (For instance employees to their boss.)

"Arrivederci" is likewise neutral in formality.

Buongiorno or Buonasera is the greeting..
when you part from somebody use

arrivederci..
ha scritto nel messaggio
ups.com...
An easy solution is "salve" wihich is more formal than "ciao" and less
formal than "Buongiorno" etc.
"Ciao" is fine in an equal status situation like friend/friend or same
age relationship, but it would be a little strange in a situation like
shop assistant/customer or in case of age gap, whereas "salve" passes
in almost all cases.
Try "salve" and see how it goes.
Peace
Cris



--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup
 




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