An American's Impressions

We have just returned from our 3 week cruise-tour of Australia and New
Zealand. We found the people to be very friendly and helpful. We tasted
Vegamite (not as bad as it looks), ate quite a lot of yummy lamb and got
to see some awesome scenery and lots of sheep and cows :-)

In Australia we visited Ularu and did the Sounds of Silence dinner which
was a wonderful experience. I snorkeled on the Great Barrier Reef, too.
One interesting thing I learned is that Australians don't drink that
awful Foster's beer. They just export it :-) If they made it here, I'd
export it, too. I did taste some of the local brews and found them to be
very nice. The wines of both countries were fabulous, but that goes
without saying.

Sidney is a big city. It has some interesting architecture, like the
opera house, but urban is urban, no matter where. Melbourne was a little
more interesting. My impression was that the financial institutions were
more grand than the churches, which led us to believe that money was
definitely more important to the founders of the city than religion. Or
perhaps money was their religion?

The Olgas and Ularu are awe-inspiring. I have just managed to clean the
red earth stains from my white walking shoes. The laces are permanently
stained and will have to be trashed. We did a Liru walk with two
Aborigine gents and an interpretor and learned quite a bit from them
about how they managed to survive in the desert. We got to pet a live
koala and saw fields-full of kangaroo. They seem to adore the sports
fields as a habitat. We saw some crocs, too, not to mention tasting them
and "skippy" meat as well.

Our ship sailed through the fjords of the South Island of NZ and the
scenery was breath-taking. It had rained for several days before we came
so we were treated to a myriad of waterfalls. We took the scenic train
in Dunedin through the gorge and I got the best souvenir ever on the
train. It's a little purse that is made of lambskin and looks like a
lamb's face. I had it on the ship and it was so unique that I was taped
with it for the DVD that the cruise line sells as a rememberence of the
voyage.

We also went to Rotorua and the Maori village, the Gloworm caves at
Waitomo (awesome!) and did some touring around in Christchurch and
Wellington. Unfortunately the ship had a mechanical problem and we
couldn't put in at Napier. We were in Wellington on the open visit to
Parliament day so we took a tour of the government buildings. You Kiwis
who haven't been should go next year. The library is very pretty. The
"Beehive" in my opinion, was quite ugly.

We looked at all the stuff that tourists are supposed to purchase but
I'm not fond of opals so there wasn't much in Oz to tempt me. In NZ, the
woolens were lovely but very expensive. The thought of possum fur being
in some of the wool goods turned my stomach. To me possum is road kill.
Ugh! The other gift shop stuff was exactly the same in every place we
visited and it was too tourist-tacky to consider. I did get post cards
of a kiwi and that wonderful tree fern. We did get to see live Kiwis on
one of our excursions to the center where they are raising them. I also
did the Antarctic place, but the Te Papa museum was the best. What a
treasure you Kiwis have in that museum!

Thanks to all of you for your hospitality. It was much appreciated and I
hope that any of you who are visiting way-the-heck-south Texas will
email me so that I can return the kindness.

Kia Ora and G'Day,

Janet


--
Janet Wilder
Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
Good Friends. Good Life

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 17:37:29 -0600, Janet Wilder
wrote:

We have just returned from our 3 week cruise-tour of Australia and New
Zealand. We found the people to be very friendly and helpful. We tasted
Vegamite (not as bad as it looks), ate quite a lot of yummy lamb and got
to see some awesome scenery and lots of sheep and cows :-)

In Australia we visited Ularu and did the Sounds of Silence dinner which
was a wonderful experience. I snorkeled on the Great Barrier Reef, too.
One interesting thing I learned is that Australians don't drink that
awful Foster's beer. They just export it :-) If they made it here, I'd
export it, too. I did taste some of the local brews and found them to be
very nice. The wines of both countries were fabulous, but that goes
without saying.

Sidney is a big city. It has some interesting architecture, like the
opera house, but urban is urban, no matter where. Melbourne was a little
more interesting. My impression was that the financial institutions were
more grand than the churches, which led us to believe that money was
definitely more important to the founders of the city than religion. Or
perhaps money was their religion?

The Olgas and Ularu are awe-inspiring. I have just managed to clean the
red earth stains from my white walking shoes. The laces are permanently
stained and will have to be trashed. We did a Liru walk with two
Aborigine gents and an interpretor and learned quite a bit from them
about how they managed to survive in the desert. We got to pet a live
koala and saw fields-full of kangaroo. They seem to adore the sports
fields as a habitat. We saw some crocs, too, not to mention tasting them
and "skippy" meat as well.

Our ship sailed through the fjords of the South Island of NZ and the
scenery was breath-taking. It had rained for several days before we came
so we were treated to a myriad of waterfalls. We took the scenic train
in Dunedin through the gorge and I got the best souvenir ever on the
train. It's a little purse that is made of lambskin and looks like a
lamb's face. I had it on the ship and it was so unique that I was taped
with it for the DVD that the cruise line sells as a rememberence of the
voyage.

We also went to Rotorua and the Maori village, the Gloworm caves at
Waitomo (awesome!) and did some touring around in Christchurch and
Wellington. Unfortunately the ship had a mechanical problem and we
couldn't put in at Napier. We were in Wellington on the open visit to
Parliament day so we took a tour of the government buildings. You Kiwis
who haven't been should go next year. The library is very pretty. The
"Beehive" in my opinion, was quite ugly.

We looked at all the stuff that tourists are supposed to purchase but
I'm not fond of opals so there wasn't much in Oz to tempt me. In NZ, the
woolens were lovely but very expensive. The thought of possum fur being
in some of the wool goods turned my stomach. To me possum is road kill.
Ugh! The other gift shop stuff was exactly the same in every place we
visited and it was too tourist-tacky to consider. I did get post cards
of a kiwi and that wonderful tree fern. We did get to see live Kiwis on
one of our excursions to the center where they are raising them. I also
did the Antarctic place, but the Te Papa museum was the best. What a
treasure you Kiwis have in that museum!

Thanks to all of you for your hospitality. It was much appreciated and I
hope that any of you who are visiting way-the-heck-south Texas will
email me so that I can return the kindness.

Kia Ora and G'Day,

Janet

Thanks for the trip report. It's always interesting to see
how others see us.

Frame the shoelaces and hang them on the wall as a
memento:-)

Possums here are actually a totally different animal and a
bloody nuisance if you get them in your roof-space. The most
common road-kill is roos.



Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com/
latest: Slovenia
http://loraltraveloz.blogspot.com/
latest: Mossman Gorge in the Daintree Rainforest

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:57:04 +1100, Alan S
wrote in :

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 17:37:29 -0600, Janet Wilder
wrote:

We have just returned from our 3 week cruise-tour of Australia and New
Zealand. We found the people to be very friendly and helpful. We tasted
Vegamite (not as bad as it looks), ate quite a lot of yummy lamb and got
to see some awesome scenery and lots of sheep and cows :-)

In Australia we visited Ularu and did the Sounds of Silence dinner which
was a wonderful experience. I snorkeled on the Great Barrier Reef, too.
One interesting thing I learned is that Australians don't drink that
awful Foster's beer. They just export it :-) If they made it here, I'd
export it, too. I did taste some of the local brews and found them to be
very nice. The wines of both countries were fabulous, but that goes
without saying.

Sidney is a big city. It has some interesting architecture, like the
opera house, but urban is urban, no matter where. Melbourne was a little
more interesting. My impression was that the financial institutions were
more grand than the churches, which led us to believe that money was
definitely more important to the founders of the city than religion. Or
perhaps money was their religion?

The Olgas and Ularu are awe-inspiring. I have just managed to clean the
red earth stains from my white walking shoes. The laces are permanently
stained and will have to be trashed. We did a Liru walk with two
Aborigine gents and an interpretor and learned quite a bit from them
about how they managed to survive in the desert. We got to pet a live
koala and saw fields-full of kangaroo. They seem to adore the sports
fields as a habitat. We saw some crocs, too, not to mention tasting them
and "skippy" meat as well.

Our ship sailed through the fjords of the South Island of NZ and the
scenery was breath-taking. It had rained for several days before we came
so we were treated to a myriad of waterfalls. We took the scenic train
in Dunedin through the gorge and I got the best souvenir ever on the
train. It's a little purse that is made of lambskin and looks like a
lamb's face. I had it on the ship and it was so unique that I was taped
with it for the DVD that the cruise line sells as a rememberence of the
voyage.

We also went to Rotorua and the Maori village, the Gloworm caves at
Waitomo (awesome!) and did some touring around in Christchurch and
Wellington. Unfortunately the ship had a mechanical problem and we
couldn't put in at Napier. We were in Wellington on the open visit to
Parliament day so we took a tour of the government buildings. You Kiwis
who haven't been should go next year. The library is very pretty. The
"Beehive" in my opinion, was quite ugly.

We looked at all the stuff that tourists are supposed to purchase but
I'm not fond of opals so there wasn't much in Oz to tempt me. In NZ, the
woolens were lovely but very expensive. The thought of possum fur being
in some of the wool goods turned my stomach. To me possum is road kill.
Ugh! The other gift shop stuff was exactly the same in every place we
visited and it was too tourist-tacky to consider. I did get post cards
of a kiwi and that wonderful tree fern. We did get to see live Kiwis on
one of our excursions to the center where they are raising them. I also
did the Antarctic place, but the Te Papa museum was the best. What a
treasure you Kiwis have in that museum!

Thanks to all of you for your hospitality. It was much appreciated and I
hope that any of you who are visiting way-the-heck-south Texas will
email me so that I can return the kindness.

Kia Ora and G'Day,

Janet

Thanks for the trip report. It's always interesting to see
how others see us.

As Bobbie Burns said [English translation]

O would some Power the gift to give us
To see ourselves as others see us!
It would from many a blunder free us,
And foolish notion:
What airs in dress and gait would leave us,
And even devotion!

For both the original Scots dialect and the English translation,
readers can check both at:

http://www.worldburnsclub.com/poems/...ations/552.htm



Frame the shoelaces and hang them on the wall as a
memento:-)

Good suggestion! Why not?

Although the stains are probably mainly iron oxide. If she
wants to restore the laces to their original pristine condition
of "whiteness" she could try consulting

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...821cbd852a8a8e

Or much more simply,
http://tinyurl.com/yvjdqv

Still, your suggestion is much more elegant.

In either case, she could enclose the shoelaces in a
elaborate glassed in frame for $100 or so.

Sounds like something I might do. A visitor or a guest is
psychologically likely to ask the reason for such a display of
the original stained laces or the cleaned laces.

Likely response from visitor or guest:

"Why such an expensive display of a pair of shoelaces?"

Perhaps needless to say, my response would probably be along the
lines of:

"Well, since you have asked, they are there to remind me of my
experiences in Australia."

10,000 or 100,000 words later, they might grasp the
essentials. :-)

....If they don't put their hands over their ears, and find an
excuse to get away from me, of course.

Possums here are actually a totally different animal and a
bloody nuisance if you get them in your roof-space. The most
common road-kill is roos.



A totally different animal? Not all that different. See: [for
a start]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opossum
http://www.hsus.org/wildlife/a_close.../opossums.html

"The opossum, Didelphis marsupials, is the only marsupial found
in the United States (the young are born prematurely and brought
to term in the mother's marsupium, or pouch, in which she
nurtures them until they are weaned.) The opossum has several
relatives throughout Central and South America, but Australia has
the largest number and the greatest variety of these ancient
mammals, such as the koala, wallaby, wombat, kangaroo, and sugar
glider."

http://www.wildliferescueleague.org/report/opossum.html

"The Australian opossum or phalanger (Trichosurus vulpecula) was
first liberated at Riverton, Southland, in 1858 with the idea of
starting a skin trade. Since then innumerable recorded and
unrecorded liberations have been made all over New Zealand, in
Stewart Island and the Chatham Islands and in the outlying
islands. There are now few areas without opossums, exceptions
being the high country and northern Northland."

http://www.teara.govt.nz/1966/M/Mamm...ianOpossums/en

From a strictly scientific point of view, of course, you are
correct.

To the average tourist, kangaroos and wallabies are "identical"
as they have several things in common.

Perhaps they use a rough definition along the lines of "if it
over waist high, it is a "Kangaroo". If under, probably a
"Wallaby".

From a strictly scientific point of view, many species of each.

While in the U.S. wouldn't want to pick up a "black widow spider"
with my bare hands. Most children can recognize that they are a
hazard.

----------------------
Black widow spider
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
• Ten things you may not know about Wikipedia •
Jump to: navigation, search
Black widow

Scientific classification
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Arthropoda
Class: Arachnida
Order: Araneae
Family: Theridiidae
Genus: Latrodectus
Species

L. mactans Fabricius, 1775
L. hesperus Chamberlin & Ivie, 1935
L. variolus Walckenaer, 1837

The black widow spider (Latrodectus spp.) is a spider notorious
for its neurotoxic venom. It is a large widow spider found
throughout the world and commonly associated with urban habitats
or agricultural areas. Although the name 'black widow spider' is
most commonly used to refer to the three North American species
best known for their dark coloration, black hair and red
hourglass pattern, occasionally it is applied to several other
members of a the Latrodectus (widow spider) genus in which there
are 31 recognized species including the Australian red-back,
brown widow spider (sometimes called the gray widow), and the red
widow spider. In South Africa, widow spiders are also known as
the button spiders.

Currently, there are three recognized species of black widow
found in North America: The southern black widow (L. mactans),
the northern black widow (L. variolus), and the western black
widow (L. hesperus). As the name indicates, the southern widow is
primarily found (and is indigenous to) the southeastern United
States, ranging from Florida to New York, and west to Texas,
Oklahoma and they run particularly rampant in parts of Arizona...
More at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_widow_spider

For practical purposes, though, it doesn't pay to play with any
of the above. :-)

In Australia, we are more likely to encounter the "redback". Same
genera, different species.

---------------------------------
Redback spider
The redback spider is one of Australia’s most recognisable
species and they are commonly found in habitats ranging from
bushland to urban areas.

Description

Redback spiders, Latrodectus hasselti, are almost too familiar to
need description.

Mature female redbacks are jet black spiders with a variable red
stripe on the back of their spherical abdomen... [more at]

http://www.csiro.au/resources/ps1rv.html

When I first came to Australia, I knew nothing about
"redbacks", but they looked and acted enough like "black
widows" that I wasn't tempted to mess with them.

[Sorry about that, Cath!]

Nor was I aware of the "Sydney Funnel Web" spider.

Interested readers, if any, can check on
http://www.amonline.net.au/factsheets/funnelweb.htm

In many ways, though, I am a pretty pragmatic person. If I
encounter a spider that I've never seen before, the long and
highly visible fangs are enough of a warning to me.:-)

Ever been to the U.S.A., Alan? Or tempted to visit?

The good news is that you wouldn't have to worry much about
spiders or snakes, especially in cities.

The bad news is that some of the animals, such as "Homo sapiens"
are extremely prolific and some can be extremely dangerous.

Anyway, enough for now, must have a look at other groups. :-)

Cheers,
Kangaroo16









Cheers, Alan, Australia

"kangaroo16" wrote in message
...

10,000 or 100,000 words later, they might grasp the
essentials. :-)


In your case I would suspect much closer to 100,000 if not more. :-)

Gerrit

On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:01:20 +0800, "gerrit"
wrote in
:


"kangaroo16" wrote in message
.. .

10,000 or 100,000 words later, they might grasp the
essentials. :-)




In your case I would suspect much closer to 100,000 if not more. :-)

Gerrit


Well, mate, I've spent most of my life in Oz, have accumulated a
lot of new experiences, seen a lot of new things, done a lot of
things, given them a fair bit of thought, and so on.

It would be interesting to know how many words I could speak in
an hour of conversation, actually. There might be a market for a
compact electronic device that would actually count them, just to
satisfy my curiosity. I suppose I could ask my wife how many
words she has heard from me since we married a few decades ago.

If she told be about a googolplex, I wouldn't know for sure if
she was exaggerating or not, though! :-) It would be nice to
have an actual count, or even a rough approximation.

A nice addition might be if it sounded a beep every 500 words or
so, but the constant beeping might become an annoyance.:-)

My typing speed is around 50 WPM, and I can probably do 2 or 3
times better than that with speech.

Hmm, wonder how good the current models of speech to text
converters are these days? Perhaps should get one to speed up my
Usenet posts a bit?

I will admit that I am seldom at a loss for words. Took a public
speaking class once at uni. Class members would have to reach
into a box filled with an assortment of random small items, pick
one out at random and talk about it for five minutes or so. It
was great fun, actually.

Think what I could have accomplished had I been born with a
photographic memory...:-)

For people who were having sleep problems, I could give a long
boring lectures and have some of the audience asleep in minutes
:-)

Or I could turn my hand to writing pulp western or romance
novels. Even at the old rate of a couple of cents a word, could
bring in a nice income.

I see from this weeks "Time" magazine, Nov.19, that a section
dealing with new products, mostly technical. One is:


[to quote Time]
An ATM for Books

The "Expresso Book Machine"--meaning "fast" not coffee--can churn
out a 300 page paperback on demand, complete with color cover, in
just 3 min. The $50,000 machine could transform libraries into
minibook stores, making hard-to-find titles as accessible as
cappuccinos. At $3 a book they might be cheaper too.
Available Now
www.ondemandbooks.com

Oh well, enough for the moment, have been off doing some actual
housework.

Cheers,
Kangaroo16

[Who happily hops from one subject to another, even within
individual posts...]

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 17:37:29 -0600, Janet Wilder
wrote in
:

We have just returned from our 3 week cruise-tour of Australia and New
Zealand. We found the people to be very friendly and helpful.

Excellent post, Janet! IMHO, both this group and
misc.immigration.australia+nz need more such feedback
from both tourists and successful migrants.

This group seems to get a bit more feedback than the immigration
group, actually. There we get a lot of posts from people who are
applying for a migrant visa, and when they get it, they let the
group know about their success.

After that, though, many seem to drop off the group, or even
off the face of the earth. We seem to get little or no feedback
about their first, and subsequent, impressions of Australia.

Perhaps they are too busy? When I migrated to Australia from
the U.S. decades ago, computers were rare enough, & the Internet
as we know it now, was a distant dream. I kept in touch with
family and friends by mail, but the net would have been far more
convenient.

We tasted
Vegamite (not as bad as it looks),

I can't say that am a great fan of Vegamite, although have tried
it. Australians who migrate to the US are often disappointed
that it isn't readily available there.

For readers who have never encountered it, the product is
probably very similar to English "Marmite". AFIK, both were
mainly developed as a vitamin supplement. The main ingredient
is "yeast cream", a by-product of yeast production.

Various strains of yeast are cultivated, then pressed into cakes.
The liquid exudates are known in the trade as "yeast cream".

So why is Vegamite black? It is coloured by carmel, usually
from burnt sugar. Why bother? Consumer acceptance, basically.
The colour of the yeast cream varies from white to a shade of
yellow. If the end product was marketed without the carmel, the
colour would vary depending on the species of yeast, and the
customers might get upset at the variation. The addition of
carmel makes it a uniform black. Salt is added as a
preservative. Various other flavors are added.

Unfortunately, the carmel also makes it a bit bitter, and the
end product is definitely an acquired taste.

ate quite a lot of yummy lamb
Can offer some info here as well. In the following quote,
"ovine" is derived from the scientific name for sheep,
which is "Ovis aries".

"What is lamb, hogget and mutton?

Lamb is the meat from the ovine that is less than one year old.
It has a mild flavour and low in internal and external fat.
Requires short cooking times

Hogget is the meat from the ovine that is one to two years old.
It has a more intense flavour than lamb, low to medium in
internal and external fat. Requires longer cooking times than
lamb and more suited to roasting, stewing and braising

Mutton is the meat from the ovine that is more than two years
old. It has a very strong flavour, is high in internal and
external fat. Requires extended cooking times and more suited to
curing, 2nd class roasting (slow and low heat), stewing and
braising. These cooking methods will render the excess fat which
may be spooned or scooped and discarded, they will also ensure
the meat is nice and tender."

http://www.hub-uk.com/tallytip01/tip0031.htm

If the meat comes from an animal less than a year old, it can
be legally sold or served as "lamb".

Unfortunately, in many states in the U.S.A. the regulations
are more lax, and what we would call "hogget" here is often
sold as "lamb" there.

Perhaps that is one of the reasons you were impressed by the
flavour of Australian or N.Z. lamb.

Farm animals are sold mainly by gross weight, so lamb meat costs
more per pound [or kilogramme] than hogget or mutton.

and got
to see some awesome scenery and lots of sheep and cows :-)

Australia has more sheep than humans. The human population
passed 21 million not all that long ago. Last time I checked,
about 100 million sheep.

Plenty of kangaroos around too. Perhaps 50 million or so.

In Australia we visited Ularu and did the Sounds of Silence dinner which
was a wonderful experience. I snorkeled on the Great Barrier Reef, too.

Assume that you found it interesting.:-) One of our greatest
tourist attractions.

One interesting thing I learned is that Australians don't drink that
awful Foster's beer. They just export it :-) If they made it here, I'd
export it, too.

Laughed at these lines, as totally agree with you. XXXX [a.k.a
"Fourex"] is a pretty good brew. All "Aussie" beer is generally
better than U.S. beer, of course, perhaps because most of it
contains more alcohol than the 3.2% "beer" in the USA. :-)

At least this was the standard percentage when I was last in the
U.S.A.

I did taste some of the local brews and found them to be
very nice. The wines of both countries were fabulous, but that goes
without saying.

Yep, we export a lot of it. Probably a lot more expensive there
than here.

-----------------
Wine price falls despite record high in exports

Tuesday, 09/01/2007

Australian wine exports set new records last year, but the price
per litre has continued to fall.

Exports grew by 8 per cent to 757 million litres and were worth 1
per cent more, at $2.82 billion.

The average price per litre fell 17 cents... [more at]

http://www.abc.net.au/rural/news/con...6/s1823722.htm

Sidney is a big city.
It certainly is that. Of course, Los Angeles is a pretty big
city too, but it isn't as pleasant a place to live, IMHO.

Readers can check
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/
or various links from this site such as
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/A...on/Default.asp
It has some interesting architecture, like the
opera house, but urban is urban, no matter where.

It was still under construction when I arrived. I had to ask a
passing Aussie what the hell it was. :-)

Yes, "urban" is "urban" but some cities are much better than
others. In 2002, Melbourne, Australia and Vancouver, B.C.,
Canada were tops.

Melbourne, Vancouver top city list

Friday, October 4, 2002 Posted: 2:38 PM EDT (1838 GMT)

LONDON, England (CNN) -- Melbourne and Vancouver are the best
cities in the world for expatriates to live in, according to a
survey by the Economist Intelligence Unit.

Both Australia and Canada fared well in the survey, with the west
Australian city of Perth ranking third, and Sydney, Brisbane and
Adelaide tying in eighth place.

Toronto and Montreal also made the top 10, while Calgary was
16th. (Full list)

Links from the above site, but is:
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/e...ties/#fulllist

In Australia, Sydney, Hobart, & Brisbane rated #8. In the USA,
Honolulu, Hawaii rates as #21. / #28. Boston, Massachusetts./
#39. Houston, Texas.

A search would probably provide a more current list. As you
imply, though, urban areas are a bit of a drag, as have too high
a population density.

Wikapedia gives the population of the USA as 31 per square
kilometer. [by population/area/density] Ranks 144 on list.

298,212,900 9,629,091 31

Australia is a bit smaller than the continental US, but much
less crowded, especially once get out of the state capitals.
192 on the list.

21,050,000 7,682,300 2.6

Melbourne was a little
more interesting.

Will have to take your word for this. Never been there, let
alone lived there. Haven't been in Hobart, Tasmania either.
Have lived in others. [ Sydney, Adelaide, Perth, Darwin.] Have
passed through Brisbane.

My impression was that the financial institutions were
more grand than the churches, which led us to believe that money was
definitely more important to the founders of the city than religion. Or
perhaps money was their religion?

ROTFL! Not that Sydney is much better, though. Much more
"Americanised" than it was in the sixties!

The Olgas and Ularu are awe-inspiring. I have just managed to clean the
red earth stains from my white walking shoes. The laces are permanently
stained and will have to be trashed.

White walking shoes in Australia? :-) Elastic sided boots are
more practical.

We did a Liru walk with two
Aborigine gents and an interpretor and learned quite a bit from them
about how they managed to survive in the desert.

And they may have wondered how you manage to survive in the
U.S.A., especially if you live in a city...

We got to pet a live
koala and saw fields-full of kangaroo. They seem to adore the sports
fields as a habitat. We saw some crocs, too, not to mention tasting them
and "skippy" meat as well.

Congratulations for being an adventuresome traveler! Many
wouldn't. I've been here for decades, and consider kangaroo
equal,or better than beef. Lower fat content.

For the ultimate tourist food, were you offered, and did you
try a "wichetty grub". Bores into trees, can be fished out with
a twig or a bit of wire. Sort of like a large hairless
caterpillar.

Highly nutritious, lots of protein. Snap off the head before
eating.

More seriously, though, don't tell me you have actually tried
one. I've been here for decades, and I haven't.

Before I left the US, did try canned rattlesnake, though. Much
like chicken.

Our ship sailed through the fjords of the South Island of NZ and the
scenery was breath-taking.

It usually is in less populated countries, especially those along
the "Pacific ring of fire", with live volcanoes, lots of rugged
mountains, and so on. Australia is a much older continent, with
a lot less tectonic activity. Even a small earthquake makes the
news here.

It had rained for several days before we came
so we were treated to a myriad of waterfalls. We took the scenic train
in Dunedin through the gorge and I got the best souvenir ever on the
train. It's a little purse that is made of lambskin and looks like a
lamb's face. I had it on the ship and it was so unique that I was taped
with it for the DVD that the cruise line sells as a rememberence of the
voyage.

Sounds like you are a very discerning tourist! Am sure that
many visitors to Sydney take home a plastic or ceramic model of
the Sydney Opera House. On the bottom, it will probably say
"Made in China", though. :-)


We also went to Rotorua and the Maori village, the Gloworm caves at
Waitomo (awesome!) and did some touring around in Christchurch and
Wellington. Unfortunately the ship had a mechanical problem and we
couldn't put in at Napier. We were in Wellington on the open visit to
Parliament day so we took a tour of the government buildings. You Kiwis
who haven't been should go next year. The library is very pretty. The
"Beehive" in my opinion, was quite ugly.

I like your honesty! You don't worry about possibly offending
readers!


We looked at all the stuff that tourists are supposed to purchase but
I'm not fond of opals so there wasn't much in Oz to tempt me.

Not even the black opals? AFIK, only found in Australia. Solid
ones can be more valuable, weight by weight, than diamonds.

Even the cheaper ones, "doublets" and "triplets" with a thin
layer of black opal would be sure to attract attention even in
Texas. Had you bought an opal ring, you could walk around the
streets of your home town and wait for a comment on it. This
would give you a conversional opening to tell others about
your trip to Australia and N.Z. :-)

In NZ, the
woolens were lovely but very expensive. The thought of possum fur being
in some of the wool goods turned my stomach. To me possum is road kill.

Likewise, but most of the native animals in Australia are
marsupials. In the US, from memory, the opossum is the
only "native" marsupial.

The possums in N.Z. aren't really native, AFIK, probably came
from Australia. Here we have a lot of imported mammals, such as
dingos, rabbits, foxes, wild house cats, wild pigs, camels, and
so on.

Why foxes and rabbits? Well, an early English ["pommie"]
immigrant missed the pleasure of fox hunting in "Jolly old
England"

Someone else thought it would be a good idea to import rabbits.
No natural predators here, so they became a plague.

Camels? Were used for early exploration of Australia. Were
released into the wild when no longer required. As a
consequences, AFIK, Australia is the only country in the world
with herds of wild camels. One of our exports, actually.

Ugh! The other gift shop stuff was exactly the same in every place we
visited and it was too tourist-tacky to consider.

You obviously have good taste!

I did get post cards
of a kiwi and that wonderful tree fern. We did get to see live Kiwis on
one of our excursions to the center where they are raising them. I also
did the Antarctic place, but the Te Papa museum was the best. What a
treasure you Kiwis have in that museum!

Thanks to all of you for your hospitality. It was much appreciated and I
hope that any of you who are visiting way-the-heck-south Texas will
email me so that I can return the kindness.

Kia Ora and G'Day,

Janet


Far south Texas on the Rio Grande, perhaps? Ever met "Cath" who
is a frequent poster on misc.immigration.australia+nz. She
sometimes appears on this group.

Apparently a N.Z. migrant to Texas. Name that she posts under is
"Cath". Do a search on both groups if you want to contact her.

If you manage to do so, give her my regards. She often
criticizes me for what she perceives as my "long" posts, but
almost willing to bet that she will read this one to see if her
name is mentioned.

Obsessive/Compulsive personalities often do such things.

If she doesn't like my posts, she could choose not to read them,
or with a cheap program could "killfile" them.

I doubt that she does, though.

Anyway, if you ever do encounter her, give her my regards. :-)

Obsessive/compulsive types are a bit rare on Usenet groups,
actually.

Most Usenet users are pretty open-minded, and tend not to
criticize other posters.

Still, not worth discussing her.

Again, I praise you for an excellent post, and hope that other
travelers or migrants report their experiences.

Their is a subtle difference between "tourists" and "travelers".
You belong in the latter class, as far as I am concerned, as your
post indicates that you were not a mere "tourist".

What is a "tourist"? by one definition, one that takes an
around the world trip, looks at his calendar wris****ch, checks
his tour guide, and says to his wife or companions "This is
Thursday, we must be in Belgium"

If they stay in a well-known chain of international hotels, this
is possibly understandable. I don't have to name the chain,
except to mention that if I and my wife were staying in one, we
might have to look out the window to try to find out where we
were at the time.

Anyway, thanks again for your post. It impresses me, and I am
not that easily impressed.

"Gidday" to you as well, although Tuesday here, 4:13 PM. In
Houston, Texas, it is around 11:13 PM Monday.

Cheers!

Kangaroo16

wasn't belgium on a wendsday


Ron (from belgium)



"kangaroo16" schreef in bericht
...
On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 17:37:29 -0600, Janet Wilder
wrote in
:

We have just returned from our 3 week cruise-tour of Australia and New
Zealand. We found the people to be very friendly and helpful.

Excellent post, Janet! IMHO, both this group and
misc.immigration.australia+nz need more such feedback
from both tourists and successful migrants.

This group seems to get a bit more feedback than the immigration
group, actually. There we get a lot of posts from people who are
applying for a migrant visa, and when they get it, they let the
group know about their success.

After that, though, many seem to drop off the group, or even
off the face of the earth. We seem to get little or no feedback
about their first, and subsequent, impressions of Australia.

Perhaps they are too busy? When I migrated to Australia from
the U.S. decades ago, computers were rare enough, & the Internet
as we know it now, was a distant dream. I kept in touch with
family and friends by mail, but the net would have been far more
convenient.

We tasted
Vegamite (not as bad as it looks),

I can't say that am a great fan of Vegamite, although have tried
it. Australians who migrate to the US are often disappointed
that it isn't readily available there.

For readers who have never encountered it, the product is
probably very similar to English "Marmite". AFIK, both were
mainly developed as a vitamin supplement. The main ingredient
is "yeast cream", a by-product of yeast production.

Various strains of yeast are cultivated, then pressed into cakes.
The liquid exudates are known in the trade as "yeast cream".

So why is Vegamite black? It is coloured by carmel, usually
from burnt sugar. Why bother? Consumer acceptance, basically.
The colour of the yeast cream varies from white to a shade of
yellow. If the end product was marketed without the carmel, the
colour would vary depending on the species of yeast, and the
customers might get upset at the variation. The addition of
carmel makes it a uniform black. Salt is added as a
preservative. Various other flavors are added.

Unfortunately, the carmel also makes it a bit bitter, and the
end product is definitely an acquired taste.

ate quite a lot of yummy lamb
Can offer some info here as well. In the following quote,
"ovine" is derived from the scientific name for sheep,
which is "Ovis aries".

"What is lamb, hogget and mutton?

Lamb is the meat from the ovine that is less than one year old.
It has a mild flavour and low in internal and external fat.
Requires short cooking times

Hogget is the meat from the ovine that is one to two years old.
It has a more intense flavour than lamb, low to medium in
internal and external fat. Requires longer cooking times than
lamb and more suited to roasting, stewing and braising

Mutton is the meat from the ovine that is more than two years
old. It has a very strong flavour, is high in internal and
external fat. Requires extended cooking times and more suited to
curing, 2nd class roasting (slow and low heat), stewing and
braising. These cooking methods will render the excess fat which
may be spooned or scooped and discarded, they will also ensure
the meat is nice and tender."

http://www.hub-uk.com/tallytip01/tip0031.htm

If the meat comes from an animal less than a year old, it can
be legally sold or served as "lamb".

Unfortunately, in many states in the U.S.A. the regulations
are more lax, and what we would call "hogget" here is often
sold as "lamb" there.

Perhaps that is one of the reasons you were impressed by the
flavour of Australian or N.Z. lamb.

Farm animals are sold mainly by gross weight, so lamb meat costs
more per pound [or kilogramme] than hogget or mutton.

and got
to see some awesome scenery and lots of sheep and cows :-)

Australia has more sheep than humans. The human population
passed 21 million not all that long ago. Last time I checked,
about 100 million sheep.

Plenty of kangaroos around too. Perhaps 50 million or so.

In Australia we visited Ularu and did the Sounds of Silence dinner which
was a wonderful experience. I snorkeled on the Great Barrier Reef, too.

Assume that you found it interesting.:-) One of our greatest
tourist attractions.

One interesting thing I learned is that Australians don't drink that
awful Foster's beer. They just export it :-) If they made it here, I'd
export it, too.

Laughed at these lines, as totally agree with you. XXXX [a.k.a
"Fourex"] is a pretty good brew. All "Aussie" beer is generally
better than U.S. beer, of course, perhaps because most of it
contains more alcohol than the 3.2% "beer" in the USA. :-)

At least this was the standard percentage when I was last in the
U.S.A.

I did taste some of the local brews and found them to be
very nice. The wines of both countries were fabulous, but that goes
without saying.

Yep, we export a lot of it. Probably a lot more expensive there
than here.

-----------------
Wine price falls despite record high in exports

Tuesday, 09/01/2007

Australian wine exports set new records last year, but the price
per litre has continued to fall.

Exports grew by 8 per cent to 757 million litres and were worth 1
per cent more, at $2.82 billion.

The average price per litre fell 17 cents... [more at]

http://www.abc.net.au/rural/news/con...6/s1823722.htm

Sidney is a big city.
It certainly is that. Of course, Los Angeles is a pretty big
city too, but it isn't as pleasant a place to live, IMHO.

Readers can check
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/
or various links from this site such as
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/A...on/Default.asp
It has some interesting architecture, like the
opera house, but urban is urban, no matter where.

It was still under construction when I arrived. I had to ask a
passing Aussie what the hell it was. :-)

Yes, "urban" is "urban" but some cities are much better than
others. In 2002, Melbourne, Australia and Vancouver, B.C.,
Canada were tops.

Melbourne, Vancouver top city list

Friday, October 4, 2002 Posted: 2:38 PM EDT (1838 GMT)

LONDON, England (CNN) -- Melbourne and Vancouver are the best
cities in the world for expatriates to live in, according to a
survey by the Economist Intelligence Unit.

Both Australia and Canada fared well in the survey, with the west
Australian city of Perth ranking third, and Sydney, Brisbane and
Adelaide tying in eighth place.

Toronto and Montreal also made the top 10, while Calgary was
16th. (Full list)

Links from the above site, but is:
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/e...ties/#fulllist

In Australia, Sydney, Hobart, & Brisbane rated #8. In the USA,
Honolulu, Hawaii rates as #21. / #28. Boston, Massachusetts./
#39. Houston, Texas.

A search would probably provide a more current list. As you
imply, though, urban areas are a bit of a drag, as have too high
a population density.

Wikapedia gives the population of the USA as 31 per square
kilometer. [by population/area/density] Ranks 144 on list.

298,212,900 9,629,091 31

Australia is a bit smaller than the continental US, but much
less crowded, especially once get out of the state capitals.
192 on the list.

21,050,000 7,682,300 2.6

Melbourne was a little
more interesting.

Will have to take your word for this. Never been there, let
alone lived there. Haven't been in Hobart, Tasmania either.
Have lived in others. [ Sydney, Adelaide, Perth, Darwin.] Have
passed through Brisbane.

My impression was that the financial institutions were
more grand than the churches, which led us to believe that money was
definitely more important to the founders of the city than religion. Or
perhaps money was their religion?

ROTFL! Not that Sydney is much better, though. Much more
"Americanised" than it was in the sixties!

The Olgas and Ularu are awe-inspiring. I have just managed to clean the
red earth stains from my white walking shoes. The laces are permanently
stained and will have to be trashed.

White walking shoes in Australia? :-) Elastic sided boots are
more practical.

We did a Liru walk with two
Aborigine gents and an interpretor and learned quite a bit from them
about how they managed to survive in the desert.

And they may have wondered how you manage to survive in the
U.S.A., especially if you live in a city...

We got to pet a live
koala and saw fields-full of kangaroo. They seem to adore the sports
fields as a habitat. We saw some crocs, too, not to mention tasting them
and "skippy" meat as well.

Congratulations for being an adventuresome traveler! Many
wouldn't. I've been here for decades, and consider kangaroo
equal,or better than beef. Lower fat content.

For the ultimate tourist food, were you offered, and did you
try a "wichetty grub". Bores into trees, can be fished out with
a twig or a bit of wire. Sort of like a large hairless
caterpillar.

Highly nutritious, lots of protein. Snap off the head before
eating.

More seriously, though, don't tell me you have actually tried
one. I've been here for decades, and I haven't.

Before I left the US, did try canned rattlesnake, though. Much
like chicken.

Our ship sailed through the fjords of the South Island of NZ and the
scenery was breath-taking.

It usually is in less populated countries, especially those along
the "Pacific ring of fire", with live volcanoes, lots of rugged
mountains, and so on. Australia is a much older continent, with
a lot less tectonic activity. Even a small earthquake makes the
news here.

It had rained for several days before we came
so we were treated to a myriad of waterfalls. We took the scenic train
in Dunedin through the gorge and I got the best souvenir ever on the
train. It's a little purse that is made of lambskin and looks like a
lamb's face. I had it on the ship and it was so unique that I was taped
with it for the DVD that the cruise line sells as a rememberence of the
voyage.

Sounds like you are a very discerning tourist! Am sure that
many visitors to Sydney take home a plastic or ceramic model of
the Sydney Opera House. On the bottom, it will probably say
"Made in China", though. :-)


We also went to Rotorua and the Maori village, the Gloworm caves at
Waitomo (awesome!) and did some touring around in Christchurch and
Wellington. Unfortunately the ship had a mechanical problem and we
couldn't put in at Napier. We were in Wellington on the open visit to
Parliament day so we took a tour of the government buildings. You Kiwis
who haven't been should go next year. The library is very pretty. The
"Beehive" in my opinion, was quite ugly.

I like your honesty! You don't worry about possibly offending
readers!


We looked at all the stuff that tourists are supposed to purchase but
I'm not fond of opals so there wasn't much in Oz to tempt me.

Not even the black opals? AFIK, only found in Australia. Solid
ones can be more valuable, weight by weight, than diamonds.

Even the cheaper ones, "doublets" and "triplets" with a thin
layer of black opal would be sure to attract attention even in
Texas. Had you bought an opal ring, you could walk around the
streets of your home town and wait for a comment on it. This
would give you a conversional opening to tell others about
your trip to Australia and N.Z. :-)

In NZ, the
woolens were lovely but very expensive. The thought of possum fur being
in some of the wool goods turned my stomach. To me possum is road kill.

Likewise, but most of the native animals in Australia are
marsupials. In the US, from memory, the opossum is the
only "native" marsupial.

The possums in N.Z. aren't really native, AFIK, probably came
from Australia. Here we have a lot of imported mammals, such as
dingos, rabbits, foxes, wild house cats, wild pigs, camels, and
so on.

Why foxes and rabbits? Well, an early English ["pommie"]
immigrant missed the pleasure of fox hunting in "Jolly old
England"

Someone else thought it would be a good idea to import rabbits.
No natural predators here, so they became a plague.

Camels? Were used for early exploration of Australia. Were
released into the wild when no longer required. As a
consequences, AFIK, Australia is the only country in the world
with herds of wild camels. One of our exports, actually.

Ugh! The other gift shop stuff was exactly the same in every place we
visited and it was too tourist-tacky to consider.

You obviously have good taste!

I did get post cards
of a kiwi and that wonderful tree fern. We did get to see live Kiwis on
one of our excursions to the center where they are raising them. I also
did the Antarctic place, but the Te Papa museum was the best. What a
treasure you Kiwis have in that museum!

Thanks to all of you for your hospitality. It was much appreciated and I
hope that any of you who are visiting way-the-heck-south Texas will
email me so that I can return the kindness.

Kia Ora and G'Day,

Janet


Far south Texas on the Rio Grande, perhaps? Ever met "Cath" who
is a frequent poster on misc.immigration.australia+nz. She
sometimes appears on this group.

Apparently a N.Z. migrant to Texas. Name that she posts under is
"Cath". Do a search on both groups if you want to contact her.

If you manage to do so, give her my regards. She often
criticizes me for what she perceives as my "long" posts, but
almost willing to bet that she will read this one to see if her
name is mentioned.

Obsessive/Compulsive personalities often do such things.

If she doesn't like my posts, she could choose not to read them,
or with a cheap program could "killfile" them.

I doubt that she does, though.

Anyway, if you ever do encounter her, give her my regards. :-)

Obsessive/compulsive types are a bit rare on Usenet groups,
actually.

Most Usenet users are pretty open-minded, and tend not to
criticize other posters.

Still, not worth discussing her.

Again, I praise you for an excellent post, and hope that other
travelers or migrants report their experiences.

Their is a subtle difference between "tourists" and "travelers".
You belong in the latter class, as far as I am concerned, as your
post indicates that you were not a mere "tourist".

What is a "tourist"? by one definition, one that takes an
around the world trip, looks at his calendar wris****ch, checks
his tour guide, and says to his wife or companions "This is
Thursday, we must be in Belgium"

If they stay in a well-known chain of international hotels, this
is possibly understandable. I don't have to name the chain,
except to mention that if I and my wife were staying in one, we
might have to look out the window to try to find out where we
were at the time.

Anyway, thanks again for your post. It impresses me, and I am
not that easily impressed.

"Gidday" to you as well, although Tuesday here, 4:13 PM. In
Houston, Texas, it is around 11:13 PM Monday.

Cheers!

Kangaroo16

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 08:49:14 +0100, "maxi"
wrote in :

wasn't belgium on a wendsday


Ron (from belgium)

As am a curious human (some would say in more ways than one) I
really do have to ask why!

Are there no "Wednesdays" in Belgium? If so, this must be pretty
confusing to European travelers.

Does this apply equally in Wallonia, Flanders, and Brussels?

A quick net search reveals the following:

-----------------
As linguistic spats endure, Belgium nears record of 150 days
without a government
The Associated Press
Published: November 4, 2007

BRUSSELS, Belgium: Belgium heads for a record this week — 150
days with no government — unless the Christian Democrat and
Liberal winners of spring elections suddenly resolve linguistic
spats deadlocking their bid to form a government...

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/...ment-Talks.php

Golly gee, Batman! A nice quiet country in Europe with no
government?

Perhaps it should prepare for a truly massive influx of
potential migrants!

If no Government, this implies no enforceable laws. :-)

Businesses and "spammer's" [if they aren't the same thing] should
be rushing to establish a base there! :-)

After all, if "no government", then no "laws", and no need for
"migrant visas". :-)

If you have "dual nationality" why are you bothering to reveal
such information to this group?

Perhaps you could return and become a "Minister [or Czar] of
Immigration?"

Can you still speak Fleming or Waloon? Fly there immediately,
make ten friends, get the support of six or seven of them, and
you could claim that a majority of those polled wanted you
you in charge of immigration. :-)

Don't get too excited at this possibility, though. Have a nice
rest, or even sleep while considering the possibilities.

It might be interesting to see a European country with no
established government.

Update: See:

Bye bye Belgium?

"With deep divisions between its French and Dutch speakers, not
to mention a ludicrously complex administrative system, it's a
wonder Belgium has stayed united for so long. Now, after 156 days
without a national government, the country is heading for
meltdown."

Jon Henley reports

Tuesday November 13, 2007
The Guardian
[more at]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,,2209988,00.html


Regards,
Kangaroo16

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 03:24:06 GMT, kangaroo16
wrote:

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 08:49:14 +0100, "maxi"
wrote in :

wasn't belgium on a wendsday


Ron (from belgium)

As am a curious human (some would say in more ways than one) I
really do have to ask why!

Are there no "Wednesdays" in Belgium? If so, this must be pretty
confusing to European travelers.

The OP was wrong, Belgium was on a Tuesday. And roo16,
you've had a culturally deprived childhood.
http://movies.nytimes.com/movie/2429...lgium/overview

Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com/
latest: Slovenia
http://loraltraveloz.blogspot.com/
latest: Mossman Gorge in the Daintree Rainforest

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:34:15 +1100, Alan S
wrote in :

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 03:24:06 GMT, kangaroo16
wrote:

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 08:49:14 +0100, "maxi"
wrote in :

wasn't belgium on a wendsday


Ron (from belgium)

As am a curious human (some would say in more ways than one) I
really do have to ask why!

Are there no "Wednesdays" in Belgium? If so, this must be pretty
confusing to European travelers.

The OP was wrong, Belgium was on a Tuesday. And roo16,
you've had a culturally deprived childhood.
http://movies.nytimes.com/movie/2429...lgium/overview

You could be right, Alan. Depending on how you define "culture",
of course.:-) My wife was watching the musical quiz show,
"Singing Bee" I had never heard of most of the songs or the
groups.

Even as a child, I preferred Jazz & Classical. Never developed a
taste for most pop music. When Elvis Presley hit the national
scene, he didn't appeal to me at all, nor did the other rock or
pop music stars.

I often preferred early jazz rather than modern jazz. Have you
ever heard a Bessie Smith recording of "Empty Bed Blues"?

I did listen to some modern music, liked some of the early songs
of Bob Dylan. I like songs such as "The Gamblers Song", "The
Band Played Waltzing Matilda" by Eric Bogle. Some of the older
traditional Australian songs are pretty good, and easy to listen
to.

Most pop music since the 1950's or so do nothing for me. Even
some Country & Western is better than pop music, in small doses
at least. On radio, I seldom listen to anything but various
commercial free ABC stations on FM. ABC classical is good,
Radio National often has interesting programs.

A few months ago even heard one ABC station play "House of the
Rising Sun". The ABC must have a huge library of old songs. I
wonder how often it is played in the US these days? :-)

Basically, though as far as music is concerned, I could get along
quite nicely if I didn't hear anything composed after, say,
1955 or so. Perhaps I was born old?

Even then, though, all music is more of a ''background" sound for
when I'm doing something else.

I am a bit of a news junkie, though. When 9/11 news was on T.V.
I even slept in front of the T.V. If a radio is on in the
background, programs will still be interrupted with important
breaking news. I would hate to miss important items like
the outbreak of WW3, the possibility of the first contact with
extraterrestrials, a large meteor or asteroid strike, etc. :-)

I posted an item earlier about the group of pilots in the USA
who want the U.S. Government to start investigating UFOs again
after a about a 30 year gap.

I somehow doubt that they will though. See
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5...l6ZR1ROk1DoR1A

final line of above report:
"When Callahan suggested the government tell Americans about a
UFO, the CIA official allegedly told him: "'No way, if we were to
tell the American public there are UFOs they would panic.'"

As they did decades ago when the Orson Wells broadcast
of "The War of the Worlds" was broadcast.

Actually, though, a fear of an extraterrestrial invasion is
probably the only thing that would ever unite the citizens of the
world to work together to prepare to fight the alien foe.

From memory, the first TV broadcast was of the Olympic Games
in Germany in the late 1930s. VHF and higher frequencies,
especially radar don't bounce of the Heaviside layer, but
are broadcast into space.

So if there was any race at our level of civilization or greater
within 100 light years or so, they would know we were here.:-)

To quote from
"The Growing Problem of UFOs and Aliens"

"Belief in UFOs and aliens is not just a fringe belief. USA
Today says that their surveys show that 43% of all Americans
believe in UFOs and aliens as being real. In 1977 a plaque was
attached to a spaceship leaving the solar system that showed
where we live in our solar system and what we look like. The
justification for this was that aliens outside of our solar
system would find the space ship and we needed to let them know
that we are friendly and that we welcome them."

http://www.doesgodexist.org/MayJun03...AndAliens.html

I somehow doubt that the level of belief is anywhere this high in
Australia, though!

Have you noticed that a lot fewer sightings and "aliens" since
people started carrying camera phones, cameras, video cams, etc.
around in the bush?

Personally, am pretty skeptical. I've yet to see any convincing
proof of such encounters. There is or was a US female
Psychiatrist who wrote a book reporting stories told by her
patients, and she seemed to think UFOs were genuine.

I'm not saying that there is no advanced civilization somewhere
out there, but so far "Project Seti" hasn't found any intelligent
signals from space despite decades of searching. If there was
any alien civilization within 100 light years or so, we should
have detected it.

The universe, though, is a very large place, and when consider
the estimated number of suns in it, it seems a bit odd that the
earth, which is a minor planet in a solar system far out on the
edge of our local galaxy would be the only place with advanced
life.

Perhaps they can't be bothered to come check us out? Perhaps we
are "off limits" for some reason? :-) Given the total number of
wars in human history, we may be considered as too dangerous for
a civilized race to risk contact. :-)

Cheers,
Kangaroo16





Cheers, Alan, Australia