Another warning to outback drivers.

in article , Roger Martin at
wrote on 12/14/03 1:33 AM:



Whassa bet that when they check his car, the radiator's still full of
water?

If you want to die another way drink coolant from a vehicle radiator - only
if you know its 100% rusty water would it be safe to drink. Most modern
vehicles have glycol based coolants with various rust inhibitors, anti boil
additives, etc. not something to sip as a pre dinner cocktail.

I had wondered about this (being Canadian, where our rads are either pure
antifreeze or nothing less than 70% glycol mix).....it might be possible to
distill the water, but it'd be a last resort.

Believe it or not, the bloke in WA who carved "SOS" on the beach was touted
on our national news as an exemplary sample of "Hollywood ingenuity." A
satphone might have been a little less dramatic, but far more practical
(speaking as a guy who actually had occasion to use this when I blew a head
in the Simpson in 2001).

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
wrote in message
Believe it or not, the bloke in WA who carved "SOS" on the beach was
touted
on our national news as an exemplary sample of "Hollywood ingenuity."

Christ,

Next thing there'll be a bloody mini-series about his wonderful survival.

As for the SOS, I suppose he'll be thanking Tom Hanks for the idea.

--
Tony Bailey
Mercury Travel Books

I wonder if he had OUR cup final rugby ball, he could have called it Jonnie
tho.

in article , Tony Bailey at
wrote on 12/14/03 4:20 AM:

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
wrote in message
Believe it or not, the bloke in WA who carved "SOS" on the beach was
touted
on our national news as an exemplary sample of "Hollywood ingenuity."

Christ,

Next thing there'll be a bloody mini-series about his wonderful survival.

As for the SOS, I suppose he'll be thanking Tom Hanks for the idea.


Didn't the Seppo bloke who went walkabout in the Simpson a few years ago get
an endorsement from Mars Bars?

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
wrote in message
news:BC0182E0.1E5FC%walkabout@TAKEOUTTHETRASHTOREP LY.ns.sympatico.ca...

I had wondered about this (being Canadian, where our rads are either pure
antifreeze or nothing less than 70% glycol mix).....it might be possible
to
distill the water, but it'd be a last resort.

Believe it or not, the bloke in WA who carved "SOS" on the beach was
touted
on our national news as an exemplary sample of "Hollywood ingenuity." A
satphone might have been a little less dramatic, but far more practical
(speaking as a guy who actually had occasion to use this when I blew a
head
in the Simpson in 2001).

Neither actually expected to get into trouble, which is where it starts. You
expected to , so didn't get into much. Neither gave notice of
departure/arrival
but both had sufficient resources until rescue arrived.

That being said, if in trouble in Canada I could probably with the
best of intentions and thinking I was doing the right thing or in no danger
do something the locals would think amazingly stupid. :-(

With one person fear and doubt can make people do silly things,
one day can seem like an eternity, with more than one the same
things get multipled manyfold.


Glycol Antifreeze-antiboil is usual here, distillation is troublesome.
A small amount may even kill you before you die of dehydration.
Similar to wood alcohol.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/e...cle/002751.htm
The standard treatment for glycol is .. large quantities of water or ethyl
(drinking) alcohol and get to medical help,

The one rescued was down to last day of water but being on a beach could
possibly have rigged some sort of distiller , once he decided the hire-car
deposit was the least of his problems.
He was also a mountain rescuer so had some idea, still lucky.
The one who died left water and food and fuel in the vehicle sufficient for
weeks,
could have lasted in comfort in an air-conditioned vehicle for days,
so the news says. And the vehicle was found in a few days.

Maybe when you are down to as much water as you can carry you could
consider leaving. But travel in the cool of day, leave a note and arrange a
marker
to say when you left, what direction, how much water , how you intend to
travel etc.
And when you feel comfortable and energetic..stop, it's a bad sign.
All in the handbook.

In 40+C you cannot carry enough water for 100km. Much less if you travel by
day.
A town 50km away on a bush track may as well be on the moon.
It may help to have a look around for dams etc but is easy to become
disoriented.
If you wander off the track some of those roads you cannot see
if standing up 20 metres away.
Then all you have to do is twist an ankle....

Keith Willshaw wrote:
[deleted]
Their was a classic case at lake Ayre a few years ago when
a german couple got bogged down. They tried to walk out but
the man wised up and returned to the car. His companion
tried to walk out and died. Not only was there enough food
and water for a week in their campervan but they were
stuck next to a survival tank with 200 litres of water !

To be fair to these people:

- They *did* leave a note at the pub/hotel in Williams Creek, but the
son of the owner put it in a new logbook because he could not find the
old one and thought that it was full, and the father only knew/checked
the old one.

- They had been told that probably no-one was coming down that track for
*weeks*. What were they supposed to do, wait for weeks? (They *did*
wait several days.)

People often criticize people for leaving their vehicle, and they are
'right'. But not leaving your vehicle, i.e. doing *nothing*, is very,
very hard to do. Some compassion, especially when people *die* 'because'
of their 'mistakes', wouldn't go astray.

in article , Frank Slootweg at
lid wrote on 12/15/03 4:22 AM:

Keith Willshaw wrote:
[deleted]
Their was a classic case at lake Ayre a few years ago when
a german couple got bogged down. They tried to walk out but
the man wised up and returned to the car. His companion
tried to walk out and died. Not only was there enough food
and water for a week in their campervan but they were
stuck next to a survival tank with 200 litres of water !

To be fair to these people:

- They *did* leave a note at the pub/hotel in Williams Creek, but the
son of the owner put it in a new logbook because he could not find the
old one and thought that it was full, and the father only knew/checked
the old one.

- They had been told that probably no-one was coming down that track for
*weeks*. What were they supposed to do, wait for weeks? (They *did*
wait several days.)

People often criticize people for leaving their vehicle, and they are
'right'. But not leaving your vehicle, i.e. doing *nothing*, is very,
very hard to do. Some compassion, especially when people *die* 'because'
of their 'mistakes', wouldn't go astray.


Is this the same instance as the couple doctors who got bogged on the Oona
track after having left word at Williams Creek? (they were found dead; the
rangers simply slackened the tyres and drove the bogged vehicle away). If
it's not, that's TWO instances in which Williams Creek Pub had something to
do with a fatality (a local gave me the "inside scoop" on the instance I've
outlined and there's a bit more to it than just missed communication, if -
as I do - one believes it).

Raffi Balmanoukian a wrote:
in article , Frank Slootweg at
lid wrote on 12/15/03 4:22 AM:

Keith Willshaw wrote:
[deleted]
Their was a classic case at lake Ayre a few years ago when
a german couple got bogged down. They tried to walk out but
the man wised up and returned to the car. His companion
tried to walk out and died. Not only was there enough food
and water for a week in their campervan but they were
stuck next to a survival tank with 200 litres of water !

To be fair to these people:

- They *did* leave a note at the pub/hotel in Williams Creek, but the
son of the owner put it in a new logbook because he could not find the
old one and thought that it was full, and the father only knew/checked
the old one.

- They had been told that probably no-one was coming down that track for
*weeks*. What were they supposed to do, wait for weeks? (They *did*
wait several days.)

People often criticize people for leaving their vehicle, and they are
'right'. But not leaving your vehicle, i.e. doing *nothing*, is very,
very hard to do. Some compassion, especially when people *die* 'because'
of their 'mistakes', wouldn't go astray.

Is this the same instance as the couple doctors who got bogged on the Oona
track after having left word at Williams Creek? (they were found dead; the
rangers simply slackened the tyres and drove the bogged vehicle away). If
it's not, that's TWO instances in which Williams Creek Pub had something to
do with a fatality (a local gave me the "inside scoop" on the instance I've
outlined and there's a bit more to it than just missed communication, if -
as I do - one believes it).

Well the details differ. The case I am talking about was not *on* the
Oodnadatta track, but on a side-track from the Oodnadatta track to Lake
Eyre. The "couple", if that means two, matches. I am not aware that the
couple (i.e. man and woman) of 'my' case, were doctors. They were people
from Austria. In 'my' case the woman died, but the man survived. The
part about the 'authorities' (I think it was the police) slackening the
tyres and driving the bogged vehicle away again matches 'my' case. 'My'
case was documented in by Ray Mears in one of his Extreme Survival
documentaries. We had a rerun of it, just days before this new case in
WA, so I remember most of the details.

in article , Frank Slootweg at
lid wrote on 12/15/03 11:30 AM:

Raffi Balmanoukian a wrote:
in article , Frank Slootweg at
lid wrote on 12/15/03 4:22 AM:

Keith Willshaw wrote:
[deleted]
Their was a classic case at lake Ayre a few years ago when
a german couple got bogged down. They tried to walk out but
the man wised up and returned to the car. His companion
tried to walk out and died. Not only was there enough food
and water for a week in their campervan but they were
stuck next to a survival tank with 200 litres of water !

To be fair to these people:

- They *did* leave a note at the pub/hotel in Williams Creek, but the
son of the owner put it in a new logbook because he could not find the
old one and thought that it was full, and the father only knew/checked
the old one.

- They had been told that probably no-one was coming down that track for
*weeks*. What were they supposed to do, wait for weeks? (They *did*
wait several days.)

People often criticize people for leaving their vehicle, and they are
'right'. But not leaving your vehicle, i.e. doing *nothing*, is very,
very hard to do. Some compassion, especially when people *die* 'because'
of their 'mistakes', wouldn't go astray.

Is this the same instance as the couple doctors who got bogged on the Oona
track after having left word at Williams Creek? (they were found dead; the
rangers simply slackened the tyres and drove the bogged vehicle away). If
it's not, that's TWO instances in which Williams Creek Pub had something to
do with a fatality (a local gave me the "inside scoop" on the instance I've
outlined and there's a bit more to it than just missed communication, if -
as I do - one believes it).

Well the details differ. The case I am talking about was not *on* the
Oodnadatta track, but on a side-track from the Oodnadatta track to Lake
Eyre. The "couple", if that means two, matches. I am not aware that the
couple (i.e. man and woman) of 'my' case, were doctors. They were people
from Austria. In 'my' case the woman died, but the man survived. The
part about the 'authorities' (I think it was the police) slackening the
tyres and driving the bogged vehicle away again matches 'my' case. 'My'
case was documented in by Ray Mears in one of his Extreme Survival
documentaries. We had a rerun of it, just days before this new case in
WA, so I remember most of the details.

Two different situations then (and I seem to recall the one you're talking
about). In "my" case, both participants snuffed it.

Guess another moral of the story may not be to rely leaving word in just one
place, but with at least two reliable spots (I actually learned this one
without consequences, thankfully - I had emailed a friend with my itin with
notification to send up the alarms if I hadn't called in by X date. As it
turns out, her email was down with a virus of some kind and never got the
message). Guess we shouldn't be relying on the William Creek crowd in
particular!!

"Frank Slootweg" wrote in message
...
Well the details differ. The case I am talking about was not *on* the
Oodnadatta track, but on a side-track from the Oodnadatta track to Lake
Eyre. The "couple", if that means two, matches. I am not aware that the
couple (i.e. man and woman) of 'my' case, were doctors. They were people
from Austria. In 'my' case the woman died, but the man survived. The
part about the 'authorities' (I think it was the police) slackening the
tyres and driving the bogged vehicle away again matches 'my' case. 'My'
case was documented in by Ray Mears in one of his Extreme Survival
documentaries. We had a rerun of it, just days before this new case in
WA, so I remember most of the details.

Neither of the two latest seemed from photos to have lowered pressure
or attempted to decrease vehicle wieght, not that you can properly tell
from cropped aerial photos.

People go to great length to avoid accepting they are stuffed.
They just do, it isn't something the knowing can help you avoid.
Someone who panics today may be rational tomorrow, and viceversa,
it just depends who had their button pushed.

Rule 1. lifes a bitch and then you die, probably in a really funny pose.
Rule 2. The cavalry is always late, they have a budget you know.

In this case they can probably thank illegal immigrants for extra coas****ch
flights.

This is a disaster photo, I am the one making teapot impressions ;-)