Opinions on trains and planes.

Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey people
would undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains were
available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours as
the unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the
track is laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to drive
to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at noon and
drive a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I have to allocate
most of a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco.
I've never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really that!

--


James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Aug 18, 7:57*am, "James Silverton"
wrote:
Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey people
would undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains were
available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours as
the unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the
track is laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to drive
to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at noon *and
drive a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I have to allocate
most of a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco.
I've never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really that!

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not


I just ask Scotty to beam me there.

Even if there were 400k/h trains, it would take more than 10 hrs from
DC to SF. There'll be stops along the way and huge mountain ranges to
go over.

"PeterL" schrieb

There'll be stops along the way and huge mountain ranges to
go over.

Or tunnels to go right through the mountains. The fast trains in Europe
don't bother to climb up the Alps - ok, the Rockies would need longer
tunnels, but when you can build one 60 km long, you can just as well
dig twice as far while you're at it.

Big advantage over planes: You can take your car with you on many
trains (I just found one auto train in the US: From Lorton, VA to
Sanford, FL): No need to rent one at your destination.

Jochen

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:58:44 +0200, "Jochen Kriegerowski"
wrote:

"PeterL" schrieb

There'll be stops along the way and huge mountain ranges to
go over.

Or tunnels to go right through the mountains. The fast trains in Europe
don't bother to climb up the Alps - ok, the Rockies would need longer
tunnels, but when you can build one 60 km long, you can just as well
dig twice as far while you're at it.

Big advantage over planes: You can take your car with you on many
trains (I just found one auto train in the US: From Lorton, VA to
Sanford, FL): No need to rent one at your destination.

At $191 and up each way for the car, I think it might be cheaper
and more convenient to rent a car at the other end.

Thre's also the cost of getting your car to Lorton to put it on
the train when you could have just taken the train all the way
from wherever.

--
************* DAVE HATUNEN ) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *

James Silverton wrote:
Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour
check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey
people
would undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains
were available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to
San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours
as
the unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as
the track is laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to
drive to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at
noon and drive a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I
have
to allocate most of a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to
San
Francisco. I've never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are
really that!

The real question is how much it costs. Amtrak charges about the same
to take you from Boston to DC on their cut-down TGV that the cheap
airlines charge.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

James Silverton wrote:
Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey people
would undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains were
available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours as
the unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the
track is laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to drive
to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at noon and
drive a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I have to allocate
most of a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco.
I've never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really that!

Fifteen years ago I traveled around Europe on rail pass and had a great
time. The TGV from Nice to Paris was about 8 hours, going the top speed
for only part of the trip. There are a lot of advantages to train over
there. It is a very popular mode of transport because they have more
frequent service and the passenger trains service so many more towns,
unlike train travel here in Canada which is infrequent and services only
the main corridors.

Most European train stations are located downtown and there are lots of
good hotels and restaurants close to the station. You don't have to be
there for hours before your departure, and even if you have to wait
there are usually good and affordable restaurants in the station
Airports OTOH, are generally way out of city so you have spend the extra
money and time to get there and to be there at least an hour before
departure time to check in and go through security. When I went to
Europe back in June I was advised to be there three hours before
departure.

"James Silverton" wrote in message
news:j5gqk.169$482.96@trnddc06...
Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour check-ins and
waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey people would
undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains were
available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours as the
unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the track
is laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to drive to
the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at noon and drive
a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I have to allocate most of
a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco. I've never
been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really that!

I would have thought that 5 hours is going to be the absolute max.

If you really can manage 400kph,
Boston-NY-Phili-Washington-Richmond-Raleigh/Durham-Columbia-Savannah-Jacksonville-Orlando-Miami
looks achievable.

Whether it is affordable is another matter

tim

On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 14:57:19 +0000, James Silverton wrote:

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a journey people
would undertake by train if fast European or Japanese style trains were
available (say, 400 kph)? I would think that Washington DC to San
Francisco might be a bit far. The journey would take about 10 hours as
the unstopping crow flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the
track is laid.

Well, if the train has a club car, dining car, and you have a private
compartment-bath, so, you can lie down and sleep or refresh yourself,
probably, quite a long time.

I doubt if we'll ever see "bullet" trains (other than for commuting) in
the US. The rail system here, which is 60+ years old, just can't handle
really high speed trains. Also, Americans have a different mindset than
Europeans with regards to travel: Americans are too much in a hurry to
enjoy the trip.

As far a maglev trains: The technology just isn't there. A US company
using a German company's maglev system has been trying for about 20 years
to build an elevated train from Las Vegas to Anaheim, CA--about a 300
mile trip. Total travel time, including two intermediate stops, would be
about 1.5 hours. Top speed of train is projected to be 350 miles per
hour. It's still on the drawing board.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing time to drive
to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a plane leaving at noon and
drive a rental car to my hotel or other destination, I have to allocate
most of a day (certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco.
I've never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really that!

You could always charter a small private jet. No security check, no
waiting in line, leaves when you're ready, can land at smaller, non-major
airports, probably even have a limo pick you up. About $5000, one way.
What a deal! ;-)

Stef

Eugene wrote on 18 Aug 2008 10:14:25 -0800:

In article j5gqk.169$482.96@trnddc06,
James Silverton not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not wrote:
Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour
check-ins
cattle cars ARE train cars.
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a
journey people would undertake by train if fast European or
Japanese style trains were available (say, 400 kph)? I would
think that Washington DC to San Francisco might be a bit far.
The journey would take about 10 hours as the unstopping crow
flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the track is
laid.

Who has a 400 kph train?
A 300 KPH train with stops is not a 300 KPH train.

The Japanese Shinkansen initially ran in 1964 at 210 km/h. Running
speeds of up to 300 km/h (188 mph) have been recorded and test run
speeds have been 443 km/h (275 mph) for conventional rail in 1996, and a
world record of 581 km/h for maglev, in 2003.

A French TGV reached 575 kph last year. Not regular scheduled runs but
it shows what is possi9ble.



--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

J. wrote on Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:00:26 -0400:

James Silverton wrote:
Hello All!

Given the current cattle-car, skinflint conditions, two hour
check-ins
and waits including security, etc. I wonder how long a
journey people would undertake by train if fast European or
Japanese style trains were available (say, 400 kph)? I would
think that Washington DC to San Francisco might be a bit far.
The journey would take about 10 hours as the unstopping crow
flies but more likely 15 with a few stops and as the track is
laid.

I don't like to get up early in the morning but, allowing
time to drive to the airport, get thro' security, fly on a
plane leaving at noon and drive a rental car to my hotel or
other destination, I have to allocate most of a day
(certainly at least 12 hours) to get to San Francisco. I've
never been able to sleep on planes so "red eyes" are really
that!

The real question is how much it costs. Amtrak charges about
the same to take you from Boston to DC on their cut-down TGV
that the cheap airlines charge.

Amtrak's seats are more comfortable than cheap airlines and can you tell
me how long it would take from DC to Boston in comparison with wasted
time getting to and from airports, including all check-in times etc.

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not