Immigration patrols on domestic Amtrak

"Sapphyre" wrote in message
ups.com...
It's amazing the stuff that happens ONCE that never ever happens
again... it seems like when I'm prepared to answer a question, they've
found something new to bug me about. I'm really scared to know what
they've typed into that computer about me...

What it really comes down to is that they're trying to intimidate you so
that you'll slip and give them some detail they can use to deny you entry.
They don't particularly care what that detail is, and they'll try to trip
you up in different ways every time; if they used the same question
repeatedly, it would lose its effectiveness.

I doubt they type _anything_ into their computers other than the fact
they've admitted a person with your name on a particular date. It's only
the folks whose entry they _deny_ that get detailed records. A coworker of
mine, who is a Canadian citizen, was denied entry once; now he has to have a
green card to travel to the US even for vacation because some agent flagged
him as a "foreign worker" despite him never having held a job in the US in
his life (and has no intention of ever doing so).

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "Those people who think they know everything
CCIE #3723 are a great annoyance to those of us who do."
K5SSS --Isaac Asimov


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"Adam H. Kerman" wrote in message
reenews.net...
Cute selective quoting bit. The OP had stated that Social Security Cards
are not forms of identification. I pointed out that they ARE forms of
identification at hiring.

An SS card is _never_ a form of identification. The reason the I-9 has
three groups of documents is that some prove identity, some prove work
elligibility, and others prove both. An SS card is in the second category.
It is _not_ a form of ID.

Therefore a SSN card is not even required to be shown to an employer,

That is what the form says, this is true. An employer wishing to avoid
hassle later asks to see the card.

I have never, in my entire life, been asked for my SS card. I don't have
one, and I can't recall ever having held one. These days I use my passport
for the I-9 form, but I held four jobs before getting that and none of them
asked to see any documentation, not even my driver's license. For that
matter, only one employer _since_ I got my passport has bothered checking it
to verify what I wrote on the I-9 was true.

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "Those people who think they know everything
CCIE #3723 are a great annoyance to those of us who do."
K5SSS --Isaac Asimov


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Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Sapphyre" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Jul 15, 9:10 pm, Fred Ellis wrote:
You must not have gone through one of these Border Patrol
check points before. All you do is drive up to the Border Patrol
officer, lower your window and he asks if you are a U.S. citizen.
You answer yes while he looks inside your vehicle to see if there
are any other passengers. Then you tell the officer to have a
nice day, raise your window and you drive on.

That works if you're a U.S. Citizen. I am not. When I say "no", then
what?

Tip: Don't say "no"; say you're a Canadian citizen.

I've been through only one of these checkpoints (Van Horn, Texas,
on Greyhound). The officers boarded the bus, the driver told us
they were "checking the bus" but I didn't know what for until he
started asking people where they were born. When I told him
where I was born, he demanded "immigration documents". (Uh,
I could have been born somewhere and came to the US with my
parents at 3 months of age, if I were then a citizen I wouldn't
necessarily have immigration documents...)

If you weren't born in the US, expect to be hassled your entire life. That
includes folks who are naturalized citizens. As a general rule, the higher
your birth country's Human Development Index, the less hassle you'll get.

Since I was travelling on a foreign passport (and permanently residing
in Canada), I had "immigration documents", but I have to wonder
whether or not he'd accept a Canadian passport with no stamps if
that's what I showed this time around. I've never had my passport
stamped by the US officials ever since I had it (three years now). I
always had my foreign one stamped and filled in an arrival/departure
green card, but they don't seem to do that with Canadian passports.
That leads me to wonder how they can tell if I'm legal or not...

If you hold a passport from a Visa Waiver Program country or Canada, you're
assumed to be in the US legally unless you give them a reason to think
otherwise.

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "Those people who think they know everything
CCIE #3723 are a great annoyance to those of us who do."
K5SSS --Isaac Asimov


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Sapphyre" wrote in message
ups.com...
I live near Lewiston, so we have Nexus/Fast there. I can also cross
at Port Huron if I'm heading west (very rare that I would), but if I
never see Michigan again, it will be too soon. it's busy and crazy
over there, but coming back into Canada isn't so bad. No
different than when I come back into Canada any other time. The
Canadians just don't seem to care, they don't even ask for photo
ID, passports, or anything to prove I'm even allowed to be coming
back into Canada. It really makes me wonder...

Canada's lax border controls are why the US has tightened up its side. As
far as I can tell, all that Canada cares about is that you're not going
there to seek employment.

The first time I crossed into Canada as an adult, I made the mistake of
saying I was traveling "for work" and they locked me in a room and
interrogated me. After discovering that I was just attending some business
meetings, they let me in and advised me to phrase it exactly that way in the
future. They've never given me another second of grief since I learned the
magic phrase.

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "Those people who think they know everything
CCIE #3723 are a great annoyance to those of us who do."
K5SSS --Isaac Asimov


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

In article ,
"Stephen Sprunk" wrote:

I have never, in my entire life, been asked for my SS card. I don't have
one, and I can't recall ever having held one. These days I use my passport
for the I-9 form, but I held four jobs before getting that and none of them
asked to see any documentation, not even my driver's license. For that
matter, only one employer _since_ I got my passport has bothered checking it
to verify what I wrote on the I-9 was true.

I suspect few people could find their original SS card. I still have mine
stashed away somewhere, but it was issued almost 60 years ago and is a bit
tattered and torn.

I have been asked for my SSN many times, but I have never been asked to
show my SS card. I don't know about newer cards, but mine is clearly
marked "This card is not to be used for identification".

Merritt

In article ,
"Stephen Sprunk" wrote:

The first time I crossed into Canada as an adult, I made the mistake of
saying I was traveling "for work" and they locked me in a room and
interrogated me. After discovering that I was just attending some business
meetings, they let me in and advised me to phrase it exactly that way in the
future. They've never given me another second of grief since I learned the
magic phrase.

When I used to go to Toronto on business (1970s), the big thing they
worried about was if you were carrying any software into the country. I
guess, like magazines, any software used in Canada must be produced in
Canada. Apparently they were concerned that I might be carrying a disk or
software code from Litton USA to Litton Canada.

Merritt

Merritt Mullen wrote:
In article ,
"Stephen Sprunk" wrote:

I have never, in my entire life, been asked for my SS card. I don't
have one, and I can't recall ever having held one. These days I use
my passport for the I-9 form, but I held four jobs before getting
that and none of them asked to see any documentation, not even my
driver's license. For that matter, only one employer _since_ I got
my passport has bothered checking it to verify what I wrote on the
I-9 was true.

I suspect few people could find their original SS card. I still have
mine stashed away somewhere, but it was issued almost 60 years ago
and is a bit tattered and torn.

I have been asked for my SSN many times, but I have never been asked
to show my SS card. I don't know about newer cards, but mine is
clearly marked "This card is not to be used for identification".

Mine was in the wallet that fell out of my pocket while I was riding my
motorcycle in 1980. Never needed it since, so I've never applied for a
replacement.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Stephen Sprunk wrote:
""Király"" wrote in message
news:5FLoi.46829$Io4.15252@edtnps89...
In rec.travel.usa-canada Adam H. Kerman wrote:
To cross the Canadian border, a birth certificate was sufficient

Photo ID has always (at least for several decades) been required.
Without photo ID there's no way for the immigration official to know
if you are the person whose name is on the birth certificate.

It's required in theory. I crossed the US-Canadian border dozens of
times without any ID at all, not even a birth certificate, back
before the recent increase in security. My family also flew to
several Carribean countries (and back, obviously) with just birth
certificates; my parents had photo ID, but they were never asked for
them.

Crossing the US border is relatively painless if you're caucasian. If
you're asking about actual practice, as opposed to laws, you need to
specify what ethnicity you appear to be. The experience of a
blond-haired, blue-eyed person will differ greatly from someone who
appears to be hispanic or (these days) arab.

or verification of voter registration was sufficient.

Maybe long long ago, but certainly not anymore. Verification of
citizenship for issuance of those cards is so spotty that immigration
officials of both countries no longer accept them as proof of
citizenship.

Definitely; even the dead can get voter registration cards (and cast
votes)

"What's 'Bring out your dead'?" "The cry of a Chicago ward boss on
election day."

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On 2007-08-03, Merritt Mullen wrote:

I have been asked for my SSN many times, but I have never been asked to
show my SS card. I don't know about newer cards, but mine is clearly
marked "This card is not to be used for identification".

You've never tried to get a driver's license in Illinois, I take it. it
certainly caught me off guard on that first visit to the Secretary of State.

--

__o Kristian Zoerhoff
_'\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Kristian wrote on Fri, 03 Aug 2007 14:30:42 GMT:

KMZ On 2007-08-03, Merritt Mullen
wrote:
??
?? I have been asked for my SSN many times, but I have never
?? been asked to show my SS card. I don't know about newer
?? cards, but mine is clearly marked "This card is not to be
?? used for identification".

KMZ You've never tried to get a driver's license in Illinois,
KMZ I take it. it certainly caught me off guard on that first
KMZ visit to the Secretary of State.

My SS card is similarly marked tho' I don't carry it and can't
remember where it is. For many years, until I was threatened
with dire penalties, I gave banks 314-15-9265 (digits of PI)
with complete success.

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not