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#1
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Ship appeal through time
Karen is unhappy with the QM2. And I understand her comments about the
service on the ship not meeting Cunard standards. But, I think Cunard may have one of the few ships that anybody will care that much about 15 to 20 years from now. I was going on and on in my head about great ships being one-offs, ships like the Rotterdam V, QE2, France/Norway, and yes, these ships satisfied folks for years. This is the ship I'm most interested in. I'm not that enamored by new ships or ships built for current trends because I'm not into the popularity of the now. I'm into what's going to be appealing for a long time way after the newness and the trendiness of it has worn off. Right now, I see few ships that will be that. Century? Maybe. P&O Oriana, I think a stronger possibility. Deutschland, a retro ship but something that may hold appeal as a modern era ship. Voyager as a class might. For a long time a ship that wasn't a one-off, the Pacific Princess, twin to the Island Princess, satisfied due to some intangible quality. A small, 70s era ship that nonetheless had people raving about service, food, and a feeling of community--she had ratings higher than the more contemporary ships of the Princess line. I don't have a crystal ball, but I just see the time now for cruise expansion and the great mass marketing commodity cruise era as something current and only that. I don't know if we'll ever get back into building one-offs at all or trying to make ships to appeal for ages. I don't know how long the corporate structures and emphasis will be in place. I do know that times change and there are cycles of values. 15 to 20 years from now the cruise industry will be different than today. Who knows what company or corporation will be the big players then (may not be American). And, what current ship will still be sailing and will build a legacy for itself. What in 15 years from now will be the Norway or QE2? The ship or ship class with lasting appeal. Ben S. (I do admire some mass industries, btw) |
#2
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Ben
The whole aura of bygone ships, IMO, is due in some ways to old movies, romance stories and the mystery of the seas. In real life there were three classes. First, second and third. Those sailing third class would have an entirely different tale to tell than those in first class.and it wouldn't contain stories of wrap-around-promenade teak decks, multiple servings of food ` room service etc. Would we, the majority of posters here, be able to go first class today?. I think not. Again IMO the cruse industry has flourlshed because the cruising public today does not want the ships of yesterday. My son wa six years old when we sailed on the original QM and QE. He remembers only the good things. I remember no good things Perhaps that had to do with us sailing third class. As a matter of interest what do you discuss at your get togethers re old ships? I have sailed on all the mass cruising lines I have sailed inside, outside, balconies, suites and know I prefer "now" to "then" regardless of where my cabin is. S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#3
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Ben
The whole aura of bygone ships, IMO, is due in some ways to old movies, romance stories and the mystery of the seas. In real life there were three classes. First, second and third. Those sailing third class would have an entirely different tale to tell than those in first class.and it wouldn't contain stories of wrap-around-promenade teak decks, multiple servings of food ` room service etc. Would we, the majority of posters here, be able to go first class today?. I think not. Again IMO the cruse industry has flourlshed because the cruising public today does not want the ships of yesterday. My son wa six years old when we sailed on the original QM and QE. He remembers only the good things. I remember no good things Perhaps that had to do with us sailing third class. As a matter of interest what do you discuss at your get togethers re old ships? I have sailed on all the mass cruising lines I have sailed inside, outside, balconies, suites and know I prefer "now" to "then" regardless of where my cabin is. S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#4
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I would like to add to my post that the food - third class - was so bad
I requested to be allowed into the galley to cook for my son and myself. Request denied. Steak was served one night and when I asked for a steak knife "they" said they did not have any I ordered boiled eggs one morning and they were delivered to the table in a shot glass. I was informed there were no egg cups available. On my very first cruise - NCL - Seaward I brought my own egg cup. Needless to say it was not needed.and I walked around all week in awe Yes I will take "now" and not "then" S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#5
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I would like to add to my post that the food - third class - was so bad
I requested to be allowed into the galley to cook for my son and myself. Request denied. Steak was served one night and when I asked for a steak knife "they" said they did not have any I ordered boiled eggs one morning and they were delivered to the table in a shot glass. I was informed there were no egg cups available. On my very first cruise - NCL - Seaward I brought my own egg cup. Needless to say it was not needed.and I walked around all week in awe Yes I will take "now" and not "then" S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#6
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Sunny,
I don't disagree with what you state. The ships I mentioned, Rotterdam V, QE2, Norway, Pacific Princess, are ships that were recently retired and ships many of us have sailed on. My argument is more a concept argument of building ships for the ages opposed to building ships around trends and actually building in planned obsolesence. I'm wondering aloud if we'll get out of the commodity ships and back into making ships with a longer vision of how long they'll be in service and remembered. Ben S. villa deauville wrote: Ben The whole aura of bygone ships, IMO, is due in some ways to old movies, romance stories and the mystery of the seas. In real life there were three classes. First, second and third. Those sailing third class would have an entirely different tale to tell than those in first class.and it wouldn't contain stories of wrap-around-promenade teak decks, multiple servings of food ` room service etc. Would we, the majority of posters here, be able to go first class today?. I think not. Again IMO the cruse industry has flourlshed because the cruising public today does not want the ships of yesterday. My son wa six years old when we sailed on the original QM and QE. He remembers only the good things. I remember no good things Perhaps that had to do with us sailing third class. As a matter of interest what do you discuss at your get togethers re old ships? I have sailed on all the mass cruising lines I have sailed inside, outside, balconies, suites and know I prefer "now" to "then" regardless of where my cabin is. S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#7
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Sunny,
I don't disagree with what you state. The ships I mentioned, Rotterdam V, QE2, Norway, Pacific Princess, are ships that were recently retired and ships many of us have sailed on. My argument is more a concept argument of building ships for the ages opposed to building ships around trends and actually building in planned obsolesence. I'm wondering aloud if we'll get out of the commodity ships and back into making ships with a longer vision of how long they'll be in service and remembered. Ben S. villa deauville wrote: Ben The whole aura of bygone ships, IMO, is due in some ways to old movies, romance stories and the mystery of the seas. In real life there were three classes. First, second and third. Those sailing third class would have an entirely different tale to tell than those in first class.and it wouldn't contain stories of wrap-around-promenade teak decks, multiple servings of food ` room service etc. Would we, the majority of posters here, be able to go first class today?. I think not. Again IMO the cruse industry has flourlshed because the cruising public today does not want the ships of yesterday. My son wa six years old when we sailed on the original QM and QE. He remembers only the good things. I remember no good things Perhaps that had to do with us sailing third class. As a matter of interest what do you discuss at your get togethers re old ships? I have sailed on all the mass cruising lines I have sailed inside, outside, balconies, suites and know I prefer "now" to "then" regardless of where my cabin is. S'nd I XXX (* _ *) |
#8
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Karen Segboer wrote:
Benjamin Smith wrote: Karen is unhappy with the QM2. And I understand her comments about the service on the ship not meeting Cunard standards. But, I think Cunard may have one of the few ships that anybody will care that much about 15 to 20 years from now. I'm not all that sure about that now, Ben. I thought the QM2 would be a one-of-a-kind ocean liner, and although it *is* an ocean liner rather than a cruise ship, it's being used more as a cruise ship. Karen, I would elect you to a "panel of experts" to educate the people running Cunard on the folly of their ways. I've read reviews on the ship and a lot of the problems with the product is how the ship is being used. I tihnk that's what the ship line's need. I'd elect Peg for Celebrity and Tim Rubacky advisor to all lines. Tim has a sharp business head along with knowledge of the various lines and brands over a good period of time Right now it seems highly marketing based. I feel marketing results will bring a Wal-Mart type of overall experience in this industry. Effective, profitable business, good value, but a by-the-numbers product to use. I was going on and on in my head about great ships being one-offs, ships like the Rotterdam V, QE2, France/Norway, and yes, these ships satisfied folks for years. They still do, even while not in service. Ships like the Regal Princess, the Carnival Triumph or the Majesty of the Seas could go to scrap and nobody would much care. Not true at all of the ships you mentioned. Agreed. 15 to 20 years from now the cruise industry will be different than today. Who knows what company or corporation will be the big players then (may not be American). And, what current ship will still be sailing and will build a legacy for itself. What in 15 years from now will be the Norway or QE2? The ship or ship class with lasting appeal. Ben S. (I do admire some mass industries, btw) I'd like to see smaller, boutique-type lines gain a following in the future. I'd also like to see a cruise line like Ren break into the industry again. Yes. Ren, IMO, revealed an example of besides business bungling, too quick an expansion and overestimating the true size of their market. But their concept was very appealing and they could've had a loyal, even passionate following. Ocenia is what we have left, but they aren't quite the same. Hopefully, sometime in the future the climate may be favorable for smallish, boutique-type lines. Karen, who in 2004 discovered all mass market lines are not created equally and the label of premium, mass market and economy don't hold water. I'm with you, now. I see these terms being used less. Something much more accurate and descriptive is needed now. Ben S. __ /7__/7__/7__ \::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ http://www.cupcaked.com/reviews =AE (...and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail) |
#9
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"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message ink.net... Karen is unhappy with the QM2. And I understand her comments about the service on the ship not meeting Cunard standards. But, I think Cunard may have one of the few ships that anybody will care that much about 15 to 20 years from now. I was going on and on in my head about great ships being one-offs, ships like the Rotterdam V, QE2, France/Norway, and yes, these ships satisfied folks for years. This is the ship I'm most interested in. I'm not that enamored by new ships or ships built for current trends because I'm not into the popularity of the now. I'm into what's going to be appealing for a long time way after the newness and the trendiness of it has worn off. Right now, I see few ships that will be that. Century? Maybe. P&O Oriana, I think a stronger possibility. Deutschland, a retro ship but something that may hold appeal as a modern era ship. Voyager as a class might. For a long time a ship that wasn't a one-off, the Pacific Princess, twin to the Island Princess, satisfied due to some intangible quality. A small, 70s era ship that nonetheless had people raving about service, food, and a feeling of community--she had ratings higher than the more contemporary ships of the Princess line. I don't have a crystal ball, but I just see the time now for cruise expansion and the great mass marketing commodity cruise era as something current and only that. I don't know if we'll ever get back into building one-offs at all or trying to make ships to appeal for ages. I don't know how long the corporate structures and emphasis will be in place. I do know that times change and there are cycles of values. 15 to 20 years from now the cruise industry will be different than today. Who knows what company or corporation will be the big players then (may not be American). And, what current ship will still be sailing and will build a legacy for itself. What in 15 years from now will be the Norway or QE2? The ship or ship class with lasting appeal. There were classic cars made back in the 60's and 70's as well. And you had a feeling that they were special when they came out. The 63 Corvette The 67 Split Back Window Stingray The 65 Mustang [Lee Iacocca) The 67 GTO (Muscle Cars) [John DeLorean] The 69 Dodge Charger of Dukes of Hazard Vintage The 70's Era TransAm's of Smokey & the Bandit Vintage I don't see any of the cars of today becoming classics. Nor do I see any cars today that I have that special feeling about. And, other than the QM2, I don't see any ships with any lasting appeal. And the ONLY reason I say that about the QM2 is because of her predecessors. Not because of her. If the Corvette was a Ford instead of a Chevy she'd still have been special. If the QM2's body was one of 6 RCI ships, she'd be forgotten in 10 years as well. --Tom |
#10
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"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message ink.net... Karen is unhappy with the QM2. And I understand her comments about the service on the ship not meeting Cunard standards. But, I think Cunard may have one of the few ships that anybody will care that much about 15 to 20 years from now. I was going on and on in my head about great ships being one-offs, ships like the Rotterdam V, QE2, France/Norway, and yes, these ships satisfied folks for years. This is the ship I'm most interested in. I'm not that enamored by new ships or ships built for current trends because I'm not into the popularity of the now. I'm into what's going to be appealing for a long time way after the newness and the trendiness of it has worn off. Right now, I see few ships that will be that. Century? Maybe. P&O Oriana, I think a stronger possibility. Deutschland, a retro ship but something that may hold appeal as a modern era ship. Voyager as a class might. For a long time a ship that wasn't a one-off, the Pacific Princess, twin to the Island Princess, satisfied due to some intangible quality. A small, 70s era ship that nonetheless had people raving about service, food, and a feeling of community--she had ratings higher than the more contemporary ships of the Princess line. I don't have a crystal ball, but I just see the time now for cruise expansion and the great mass marketing commodity cruise era as something current and only that. I don't know if we'll ever get back into building one-offs at all or trying to make ships to appeal for ages. I don't know how long the corporate structures and emphasis will be in place. I do know that times change and there are cycles of values. 15 to 20 years from now the cruise industry will be different than today. Who knows what company or corporation will be the big players then (may not be American). And, what current ship will still be sailing and will build a legacy for itself. What in 15 years from now will be the Norway or QE2? The ship or ship class with lasting appeal. There were classic cars made back in the 60's and 70's as well. And you had a feeling that they were special when they came out. The 63 Corvette The 67 Split Back Window Stingray The 65 Mustang [Lee Iacocca) The 67 GTO (Muscle Cars) [John DeLorean] The 69 Dodge Charger of Dukes of Hazard Vintage The 70's Era TransAm's of Smokey & the Bandit Vintage I don't see any of the cars of today becoming classics. Nor do I see any cars today that I have that special feeling about. And, other than the QM2, I don't see any ships with any lasting appeal. And the ONLY reason I say that about the QM2 is because of her predecessors. Not because of her. If the Corvette was a Ford instead of a Chevy she'd still have been special. If the QM2's body was one of 6 RCI ships, she'd be forgotten in 10 years as well. --Tom |
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