Tipping in USA/Canada

America the Beautiful wrote:



Greg Procter wrote:

Ken Ehrett wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 20:47:48 -0500, Groggy the imbecile wrote:


I've had jobs that were well below my intellectual capabilities....


That's pretty hard to imagine coming from someone who has been
outwitted by riding lawn mowers.



You'd be hard pressed to out-think my lawn mower!


You speak like you own a great American John Deere.


Nah, he owns a NZ brand. I think they are called "sheep".

NZ, where men are men, and sheep are scared.

Sarah Czepiel wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:42:29 -0800, mrtravel wrote:

:Greg Procter wrote:
:
:
: Face it, on my travels in the USA I can stop at a restaurant, choose a
: meal and have no precise figure as to what the total bill will be. Ill
: be entering a contract without knowing what I am agreeing to and without
: knowing what I will receive.
:
:Rubbish.
:
:You determine what items you are going to buy based on the price of the
:item, the tax, and the tip you intend to leave.
:How do you feel a tip is part of a contract you are entering into?
:You are free to tip whatever you please.
:If you don't want to tip, don't tip. Nobody is holding a damn gun to
:your head, and you aren't going to be sued, because there is no damn
:contract. As far as the tax goes, I have already explained how, unlike
:NZ, US sales taxes are a bit more complicated and tax rates are
:localized. You can cross the street and be in a different sales tax rate
:area.

mrtravel......just fyi, Greg Procter has never set foot on US soil.

I would guess he's never set foot off NZ soil.

Sarah Czepiel wrote:

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 16:02:08 +1300, Greg Procter
wrote:

:Hey Dopy Sarah, the internet didn't exist in 1984.

Are you attempting to blubber your usual excuse for not posting a link
ie: if something took place before the ' internet existed ' there is
no record of that event on the 'net?

FWIW, the Internet DID exist in 1984.
Perhaps not in NZ,

Greg Procter wrote:

DevilsPGD wrote:

In message Greg Procter
wrote:


DevilsPGD wrote:

If you pay $20 on credit card, your receipt shows $20, but the merchant
will get at most $19.85 or so (and probably less unless they're
extremely high volume, low fraud)

The wait staff will pay their share of merchant fees too.

That's hardly fair!

How is that unfair?


Why should staff pay a part of the merchant's cost?

The cost was due to the tip. Had there been no tip, there would have
been no charge to the merchant for this tip.

Greg Procter wrote:



The employer gets the money, deducts whatever he/she calculates is
his/her cut and then in his own time hands the remainder to the waiting
staff.
The tip isd to the waiting staff so the process should go the other way.

If the tip is charged to a credit card, why shouldn't the recipient of
the tip pay the fee for the credit card being used for the tip?

Greg Procter wrote:


Not me Sarah, the US refused to co-operate with New Zealand on catching
the terrorists, both on information sharing and physical aprehending of
said terrorists. That's FACT.

Were the "terrorists" in the US at the time?


Possibly - we can't know that because the US refused to co-operate.


I don't quite understand. If they weren't in the US, how is the US
supposed to help? Is NZ incapable of tracking people?

Greg Procter wrote:

mrtravel wrote:


Perhaps if sales tax was uniform throughout the country, it would
be easy to advertised the full price.


You're suggesting that people don't know where they are selling? That
advertisements can't be adjusted by State and region???

We are talking about very small regions, much smaller than states.
The tax at a store across the street could have a different tax rate.


However, the people living here
know the sales tax, appropriate for the area, will be added. Nobody is
hiding anything. How is this a lie?


The advertised price is not the selling price - that's not a difficult
concept, even for you surely?

How is this a lie? There is no claim the advertised price is the
complete price, including tax.



I find that visitors to the US generally do a bit of research before
coming, and are not surprised at this when they arrive.


Visitors aren't surprised at institutional lying - well no, of course
they aren't, it's to be expected of the US.


This is America. States and cities provide different services to their
residents and create taxes they feel are in the best interest of those
they serve. This is a bit different from location to location. Some
states, like Washington and Nevada, don't have personal state income
tax. They have other methods for getting the money they need. For
example, Washington charges a higher sales tax than average.
Some cities add local amounts to sales taxes to pay for things like
public transportation or sports arenas. Is it not logical that a city
with a large public transit sysstem might have a higher sales tax to pay
for it? They could choose to pay for things with property taxes or
income taxes, but sales tax is a common form of collection, and this is
why there is standardization of price is common BEFORE adding the sales
tax appropriate for the area.


I fully understand all that. It still leaves anyone travelling in the
USa with no precise knowledge of the actual purchase price of any item
they may need to buy.

Yet, we manage to adjust. However, if you feel confused, you can always
ask the salesperson or cashier to give you the price with tax included.

Greg Procter wrote:

mrtravel wrote:

Greg Procter wrote:


Face it, on my travels in the USA I can stop at a restaurant, choose a
meal and have no precise figure as to what the total bill will be. Ill
be entering a contract without knowing what I am agreeing to and without
knowing what I will receive.

Rubbish.

You determine what items you are going to buy based on the price of the
item, the tax, and the tip you intend to leave.


I would know the ticket price, but I don't know the tax rates or the
size of tip beforehand.

If you really want to know, then ask.



How do you feel a tip is part of a contract you are entering into?
You are free to tip whatever you please.


I've already been informed that local custom is to tip beteween 10% for
attrocious service to 20% for excellent service.
That's 'local custom' which is obviously a part of the contract as far
as the restaurant is concerned.

In your Kiwi dictionary, are the words "custom" and "contract" synonymous?

We've already agreed that the tip is 60%+ of the waiter's income.

No, we didn't. You made that assumption. That number would approximately
be an accurate representation only for a worker making mimimum wage.

Qanset wrote:

DevilsPGD wrote:

In message Qanset
wrote:

WE work hard for our money and dont expect rewards from strangers
like you.


And what you still have apparently not grasped is that in the US,
service staff also work hard for their money.


They work hard, but they are exploited


The difference is that instead of the full cost of service being built
into the cost of food, the customer is allowed to control the staff's
compensation directly.


I think that sucks. Americans deserve better than that

Ate you referring to the tipper or the tippee?

Greg Procter wrote:
mrtravel wrote:

Greg Procter wrote:


mrtravel wrote:


Greg Procter wrote:



I'm not sure that the CIA and I are on speaking terms.

That's because you haven't tip an agent lately.


One has to tip CIA agents??? Before or after they assassinate you

That would be stupid. You don't tip them for killing yourself, you tip
them for killing other people.


I don't want them to kill anyone.

Then don't tip.