A Travel and vacations forum. TravelBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » TravelBanter forum » Other Travel Groups » Travel - anything else not covered
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old September 25th, 2003, 11:22 PM
Hatunen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 15:35:24 -0700, "Peter L"
wrote:

I am quite sure no one can toss an earlier segment and still have later
segments honored. But I don't see any ethnical problem with tossing the
last segment of a ticket.


Only if one is an ethnic.

(I couldn't resist)

I feel pretty much the same but I remain aware that it is a
violation of the contract and therefore bears a taint of lack of
ethics.


************* DAVE HATUNEN ) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
  #22  
Old September 25th, 2003, 11:35 PM
Peter L
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection


"Juliana L Holm" wrote in message
...
In rec.travel.europe Binyamin Dissen wrote:
I make no such promise. Perhaps you do?


Actually, Legally you do, as when you buy a ticket you are buying a
contract of carriage, and by implication accepting the restrictions
associated with the fares. I have no doubt that people get away with
using only part of tickets, but if you do not abide by the contract of
carriage, then the airline has a legal right to refuse you boarding on
a later segment.

Sometimes I toss the tickets.


I have no problem with this. If you are denied boarding some day because
you tossed an earlier portion of a ticket, though, I would not be shocked.


I am quite sure no one can toss an earlier segment and still have later
segments honored. But I don't see any ethnical problem with tossing the
last segment of a ticket.

Julie
--
Binyamin Dissen
http://www.dissensoftware.com


--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm



  #23  
Old September 25th, 2003, 11:36 PM
devil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 12:10:59 -0700, Malcolm Weir wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 20:02:50 +0300, Binyamin Dissen
wrote:

[ Snip ]

no, I do not have an ethical problem with
using just part of a purchased service.


What Mr. Dissen meant to write is:

"I do not have an ethical problem with lying to obtain preferential
pricing when purchasing a service".



So? Do you think most businesses have a problem with lying to you when
marketing their junk?

The issue is contractual, not ethical, I submit.


  #24  
Old September 25th, 2003, 11:55 PM
devil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 14:35:22 -0600, Hatunen wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 21:23:56 GMT, "George Greene"
wrote:


mrtravel wrote in message news:tXHcb.9506
You and the airline agree to the rules regarding the tariff you bought
the ticket under. These rules state that you fly the segments in the
order they are booked and that you fly all segments.


The airline may be agreeing to those rules, but I am NOT agreeing, not
what how you wish to interpet things


Oh, you are agreeing, at least legally, and it is an enforceable
contract. That fact that you have your fingers crossed when
making the agreement doesn't legally absolve you of the
agreement, nor does the fact that you can frequently get away
with violating the agreement, as when a round trip ticket from At
to C through B costs less than a oneway ticket from A to B, and
you simply toss the rest of the ticket on arriving at B. The
airline's recourse is negligible, whether legally enforceable or
not.

The airline's recourse is not negligible should you wish to use
the ticket from B to C because the RT A to C is cheaper; failure
to show up for the leg from A to B will result in automatic
cancellation of the leg from B to C (as well as the return trip).


If the airlines were so sure it is indeed enforceable, surely they would
try their best to have it tested in court? Until then, I'll take the view
that these rules are not enforceable, so these parts of the CoC are not
part of the contract.


  #25  
Old September 26th, 2003, 12:02 AM
mrtravel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

devil wrote:

If the airlines were so sure it is indeed enforceable, surely they would
try their best to have it tested in court? Until then, I'll take the view
that these rules are not enforceable, so these parts of the CoC are not
part of the contract.



They have been tested in court.
Try this sometime.

1. Buy a round trip ticket SFO-ORD-MIA-ORD-SFO
2. Skip the SFO-ORD flight
3. Try boarding in ORD for the flight to MIA

So, if they don't let you board, are you going to sue?

They have already won, in court, against travel agents that have sold
tickets to avoid ticketing rules.

  #26  
Old September 26th, 2003, 12:23 AM
devil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 23:02:54 +0000, mrtravel wrote:

devil wrote:

If the airlines were so sure it is indeed enforceable, surely they would
try their best to have it tested in court? Until then, I'll take the view
that these rules are not enforceable, so these parts of the CoC are not
part of the contract.



They have been tested in court.
Try this sometime.

1. Buy a round trip ticket SFO-ORD-MIA-ORD-SFO
2. Skip the SFO-ORD flight
3. Try boarding in ORD for the flight to MIA

So, if they don't let you board, are you going to sue?


This is not testing in court. In situations where you would have to go to
court, they win; when the situation would be for them to go to court, you
win. Isn't that fair, BTW? :-)

They have already won, in court, against travel agents that have sold
tickets to avoid ticketing rules.


Sure. But that's a very different issue. Different contract. The TA is
the agent of the airline, and as such he is under contractual obligation
to the airline to enforce their rules regardless of whether they would
stand in court, against the customer.


  #27  
Old September 26th, 2003, 12:26 AM
devil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 16:20:03 -0600, Hatunen wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 22:55:38 GMT, "devil"
wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 14:35:22 -0600, Hatunen wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 21:23:56 GMT, "George Greene"
wrote:


mrtravel wrote in message news:tXHcb.9506
You and the airline agree to the rules regarding the tariff you bought
the ticket under. These rules state that you fly the segments in the
order they are booked and that you fly all segments.

The airline may be agreeing to those rules, but I am NOT agreeing, not
what how you wish to interpet things

Oh, you are agreeing, at least legally, and it is an enforceable
contract. That fact that you have your fingers crossed when
making the agreement doesn't legally absolve you of the
agreement, nor does the fact that you can frequently get away
with violating the agreement, as when a round trip ticket from At
to C through B costs less than a oneway ticket from A to B, and
you simply toss the rest of the ticket on arriving at B. The
airline's recourse is negligible, whether legally enforceable or
not.

The airline's recourse is not negligible should you wish to use
the ticket from B to C because the RT A to C is cheaper; failure
to show up for the leg from A to B will result in automatic
cancellation of the leg from B to C (as well as the return trip).


If the airlines were so sure it is indeed enforceable, surely they would
try their best to have it tested in court? Until then, I'll take the view
that these rules are not enforceable, so these parts of the CoC are not
part of the contract.


"Enforceable" doesn't mean "worth enforcing".


Sure.

Except, in the current case, surely these rules would be worth enforcing,
I would think.

They do go to court against TAs, against whom they have a strong case
since the TAs are their agents. So, seems like they think it's worth
enforcing, doesn't it?


  #28  
Old September 26th, 2003, 12:28 AM
devil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 16:22:39 -0600, Hatunen wrote:

On Thu, 25 Sep 2003 15:35:24 -0700, "Peter L"
wrote:

I am quite sure no one can toss an earlier segment and still have later
segments honored. But I don't see any ethnical problem with tossing the
last segment of a ticket.


Only if one is an ethnic.

(I couldn't resist)

I feel pretty much the same but I remain aware that it is a
violation of the contract and therefore bears a taint of lack of
ethics.


Violation of the letter of the contract. But when the "contract" is pure
blackmail (i.e., "these are my rules, if you don't like them, go get
lost"), I would expect the courts would tend to be sympathetic to the
small guy. At least if there is some ground for interpretation.

  #29  
Old September 26th, 2003, 12:55 AM
mrtravel
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

devil wrote:


Violation of the letter of the contract. But when the "contract" is pure
blackmail (i.e., "these are my rules, if you don't like them, go get
lost"), I would expect the courts would tend to be sympathetic to the
small guy. At least if there is some ground for interpretation.


They don't say "if you don't like them, get lost".
They say "if you want a discounted ticket, you agree to these restrictions".

They don't force you to buy a discounted ticket.

  #30  
Old September 26th, 2003, 02:19 AM
Deirdre Saoirse Moen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default PLS HELP: use of tickets with connection

In article , mrtravel
wrote:

They have been tested in court.
Try this sometime.

1. Buy a round trip ticket SFO-ORD-MIA-ORD-SFO
2. Skip the SFO-ORD flight
3. Try boarding in ORD for the flight to MIA


Actually, I have done some variant on this. I had a ticket SFO-PIT-LBE-PIT-SFO.

When I arrived in Latrobe, I found that I'd have to be in the airport
before cabs were running and I had no way to get to the airport! I
couldn't take a later flight or I'd have missed my long flight back home.

So I called US Air, explained the situation, and they allowed me to skip
that leg without a change fee and without cancelling my later segment.
Then again, I asked ahead of time, I didn't just skip the flight.

--
_Deirdre http://deirdre.net
"Dogs may have kept us company on the hunt, but it was the cats who
insisted we invent houses and discover fire." -- Khiem Tran
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Airline Ticket Consolidators and Bucket Shops FAQ Edward Hasbrouck Travel Marketplace 0 April 17th, 2004 12:28 PM
Airline Ticket Consolidators and Bucket Shops FAQ Edward Hasbrouck Air travel 0 March 18th, 2004 10:16 AM
Airline Ticket Consolidators and Bucket Shops FAQ Edward Hasbrouck Travel Marketplace 0 March 18th, 2004 10:16 AM
Airline Ticket Consolidators and Bucket Shops FAQ Edward Hasbrouck Air travel 0 February 16th, 2004 11:03 AM
Airline Ticket Consolidators and Bucket Shops FAQ Edward Hasbrouck Air travel 0 January 16th, 2004 10:20 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 TravelBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.