info Pompeii and Herculaneum

In article ,
(Poetic Justice) wrote:

Lil wrote:
Regarding how exhausting it was to go to
Pompeii as a daytrip from Rome, perhaps
we should do Herculaneum. According to
the Blue Guide it is possible to take a tour
of Herculaneum in 2 hours...I will keep
Ostia in mind, although I did have my
heart set on seeing Pompeii,
Herculaneum or both.

Hi Lil, I've been to Pompeii 4x, Herculaneum and Ostia Antica 2x.
IMO and as a fellow history nut there is only one Pompeii and
although the other two sites are unique in certain areas in general they
are a distant 2nd to Pompeii.
Pompeii is a complete small city with it's walls and gates still
intact. Amphitheatre, gyms, theaters, Gladiator school & barracks,
Forum, temples, Baths, shops, cemeteries, rich homes, poor apts, villas,
a whorehouse etc.

I definitely agree that Pompeii is the one to see -- and I too have seen
the others. spend a night in Sorento and take the train there -- [you
can leave luggage at the site before going into Pompeii if you have an
overnight bag] -- or stay in Naples and see the museum as well.

Jenn wrote:

YOU MUST have a good guidebook or else hire a guide [I found the guides
annoying and filled with the usual travel guide nonsense when I
overheard them with other groups -- I prefer to get actually good
information and go it alone -- ]

these places are ruins with virtually no signing at all -- if you don't
have a good guidebook, it will be tedious and boring and meaningless -
and I love ruins

I'm not sure if I'd agree with that, but it depends on what you're into
really. We had a wonderful day, just wandering around, and we just had a
rudimentary map, and read a little bit from Let's Go- which is probably
not what you meant by "good guidebook." Pompeii in particular is one of
those sites that most people visiting will have _some_ idea about. For a
lot of people, just being there, under the slightly menacing gaze of
Vesuvius- can be thrilling in itself.

Oh, and there are _some_ signs, thinking of the intriguing pictures over
some of the rooms in the Lupernarium!

David

--
David Horne- (website under reconstruction)
davidhorne (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk

I visited Pompeii on a trip while at school in Rome, so was lucky enough
to have an excellent professor of Classics as our guide, and
consequently I don't know much about finding other guides or audio
tours. We ended up splitting up for the afternoon, though, so I went
around with 2 other students, and although we didn't know exactly what
we were looking at most of the time, it was still fascinating.



Regarding the cement casts of the 'bodies', as I recall there were
several places within the cities that you could see them. One was in
the Garden of the Fugitives, which was the place that really made me
realize how horrifying it must have been for the inhabitants of Pompeii.
There was a larger exhibit in the center of the town with more of them,
and I think one or two in the Villa of the Mysteries. But perhaps I am
remembering wrong.



I haven't been to Herculaneum, but I think Pompeii and the archeological
museum in Naples are fascinating enough for one day. You may want to go
to the secret rooms in the museum in Naples-- they show all the items
retrieved from Pompeii that were deemed too salacious to show to the
public for many years. Gives a rather interesting insight into an
aspect of Roman culture that isn't often part of the history books.



Also, if you know any Latin, take the time to look at the graffiti on
the walls. A lot of it is from back then and can be pretty amusing.
One thing to remember, especially if you bring a lunch, is to beware of
the dogs. They follow around groups of people because they know
tourists will often give them bits of their food, and they can be pretty
mangy and repulsive, and will steal your food if you aren't careful. If
you speak Italian, you'll be all right, but beware the vendors outside
the gates-- I overheard some idiot person buying a disposable camera for
40.000 lire, which at that time was the equivalent of about $20.



Hope some of this helps-- good luck on your trip!



Liliana


--
Posted via http://britishexpats.com

Liliana wrote in message ...

Also, if you know any Latin, take the time to look at the graffiti on
the walls. A lot of it is from back then and can be pretty amusing.
One thing to remember, especially if you bring a lunch, is to beware of
the dogs. They follow around groups of people because they know
tourists will often give them bits of their food, and they can be pretty
mangy and repulsive, and will steal your food if you aren't careful.

I guess the Pompeii graffiti "cave canem" ("beware of the dog"), that
I learned in high school Latin class, is still in effect after almost
2000 years! ;-)

In article
1g6ojgp.i6flzxfa3289N%this_address_is_for_spam@ya hoo.co.uk,
(David Horne) wrote:

Jenn wrote:

YOU MUST have a good guidebook or else hire a guide [I found the guides
annoying and filled with the usual travel guide nonsense when I
overheard them with other groups -- I prefer to get actually good
information and go it alone -- ]

these places are ruins with virtually no signing at all -- if you don't
have a good guidebook, it will be tedious and boring and meaningless -
and I love ruins

I'm not sure if I'd agree with that, but it depends on what you're into
really. We had a wonderful day, just wandering around, and we just had a
rudimentary map, and read a little bit from Let's Go- which is probably
not what you meant by "good guidebook." Pompeii in particular is one of
those sites that most people visiting will have _some_ idea about. For a
lot of people, just being there, under the slightly menacing gaze of
Vesuvius- can be thrilling in itself.

Oh, and there are _some_ signs, thinking of the intriguing pictures over
some of the rooms in the Lupernarium!

David

unfortunately the Lupernarium is locked up and accessible only to those
with guides [or to those like us who sneak in on the tail end of guided
tours for such events] we saw many gardens and homes the same way -- as
guides opened them for their tour groups

I think that it is mostly a pile of rocks without a good map and
guideboook -- and endlessly fascinating with

In article ,
Liliana wrote:

I visited Pompeii on a trip while at school in Rome, so was lucky enough
to have an excellent professor of Classics as our guide, and
consequently I don't know much about finding other guides or audio
tours. We ended up splitting up for the afternoon, though, so I went
around with 2 other students, and although we didn't know exactly what
we were looking at most of the time, it was still fascinating.



Regarding the cement casts of the 'bodies', as I recall there were
several places within the cities that you could see them. One was in
the Garden of the Fugitives, which was the place that really made me
realize how horrifying it must have been for the inhabitants of Pompeii.
There was a larger exhibit in the center of the town with more of them,
and I think one or two in the Villa of the Mysteries. But perhaps I am
remembering wrong.



I haven't been to Herculaneum, but I think Pompeii and the archeological
museum in Naples are fascinating enough for one day. You may want to go
to the secret rooms in the museum in Naples-- they show all the items
retrieved from Pompeii that were deemed too salacious to show to the
public for many years. Gives a rather interesting insight into an
aspect of Roman culture that isn't often part of the history books.

when we were there you had to get the tickets for that BEFORE entering
the museum -- or you were SOL [although frankly seen one giant phalus,
you've seen'em all]



Also, if you know any Latin, take the time to look at the graffiti on
the walls. A lot of it is from back then and can be pretty amusing.
One thing to remember, especially if you bring a lunch, is to beware of
the dogs. They follow around groups of people because they know
tourists will often give them bits of their food, and they can be pretty
mangy and repulsive, and will steal your food if you aren't careful. If
you speak Italian, you'll be all right, but beware the vendors outside
the gates-- I overheard some idiot person buying a disposable camera for
40.000 lire, which at that time was the equivalent of about $20.



Hope some of this helps-- good luck on your trip!



Liliana

Jenn wrote:

unfortunately the Lupernarium is locked up and accessible only to those
with guides

Is that a recent thing? We certainly had access to it in 1997, but I
can't remember if it was controlled- i.e. a certain number of people in
at a certain time, as they often do on historic sites.

David

--
David Horne- (website under reconstruction)
davidhorne (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk

Liliana wrote in message ...
I visited Pompeii on a trip while at school in Rome, so was lucky enough
to have an excellent professor of Classics as our guide, and
consequently I don't know much about finding other guides or audio
tours. We ended up splitting up for the afternoon, though, so I went
around with 2 other students, and although we didn't know exactly what
we were looking at most of the time, it was still fascinating.



Regarding the cement casts of the 'bodies', as I recall there were
several places within the cities that you could see them. One was in
the Garden of the Fugitives, which was the place that really made me
realize how horrifying it must have been for the inhabitants of Pompeii.
There was a larger exhibit in the center of the town with more of them,
and I think one or two in the Villa of the Mysteries. But perhaps I am
remembering wrong.


Thanks for the warning. We may want to avoid it since it might
"upset" one of us.



I haven't been to Herculaneum, but I think Pompeii and the archeological
museum in Naples are fascinating enough for one day. You may want to go
to the secret rooms in the museum in Naples-- they show all the items
retrieved from Pompeii that were deemed too salacious to show to the
public for many years. Gives a rather interesting insight into an
aspect of Roman culture that isn't often part of the history books.



Also, if you know any Latin, take the time to look at the graffiti on
the walls. A lot of it is from back then and can be pretty amusing.

I don't know if I remember too much of my Latin, but it would be great
to try translating some of the graffiti!

One thing to remember, especially if you bring a lunch, is to beware of
the dogs. They follow around groups of people because they know
tourists will often give them bits of their food, and they can be pretty
mangy and repulsive, and will steal your food if you aren't careful.


Hmmmm. How pesky are the dogs? One of our parties is a bit afraid of
dogs because they've been bitten as a child.


If
you speak Italian, you'll be all right, but beware the vendors outside
the gates-- I overheard some idiot person buying a disposable camera for
40.000 lire, which at that time was the equivalent of about $20.


Thanks for the warning. We will come prepared with photographic
equipment and supplies.



Hope some of this helps-- good luck on your trip!



Liliana

On 26 Dec 2003 10:43:27 -0800, (Lil) wrote:

Going there from Rome would be a long trip, but still manageable.
quite few friends of mine used to commute every working day between
Naples and Rome by train and one of them even by car...

If someone is not really "up" on Roman history, would they be bored?
absolutely not!


cheers,

webpecker

In article ,
(Lil) wrote:

Is Pompeii and Herculaneum like colonial Williamsburg, but without the
guides and interpreters?

(speaking of pompeii in this post as i haven't been to herculaneum yet)

only in the loosest possible sense! the buildings are -not- recreations,
they are the real thing - albeit structurally shored up here and there.

If someone is not really "up" on Roman history, would they be bored?

i don't think so, insofar as much of the interest of the place is in
seeing how ancient rome's mundane things differed from our mundane things.
a curious attitude and a decent guidebook should be enough. it might be
more fun if they learned a little about roman -daily life- -- but there's
no real need to know anything about the great sweep of roman history to
appreciate the places.

incidentally, if your travelling companions don't like the idea of getting
into history books, suggest they read robert harris's new novel 'pompeii',
which is a pretty vivid picture of life at the time of the eruption. it's
about the right length for a transatlantic flight.

Or freaked out by the plaster casts of bodies strewn about the place
and they discover that these were actually remains of people?

there are hardly any of these, in fact.

Can you rent out audiophones describing the exhibits?

i -think- i saw people using them.

If anyone has any more insights or comments about these sites, I would
appreciate it if you would share them.

i was at pompeii about the same time as you earlier this year and it was
-extremely- cold -- so wrap up warm -- but almost empty of visitors, which
was great. also be aware that it is a lot bigger, geographically, than you
might expect and there are no refreshment facilities beyond the entrance.