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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
How retarded is this.
You've got a plane in the air, and someone notices that some seats are (or have become) loose. Passengers in those seats are moved to other (presumably empty) seats. Everyone is now sitting in a secure seat. So why does the plane need to make an emergency landing? What difference does it make at this point if the plane continues on and lands at it's scheduled destination? American Airlines. Something Retarded In The Air. ================================== http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/10/...ts-come-loose/ NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) – An American Airlines flight from Boston to Miami had to make an emergency landing in New York over the weekend. An American Airlines spokesperson said Flight 443 departed John F. Kennedy International Airport at around 7:15 a.m. Monday en route to Miami. A row of three seats came loose just like on Saturday’s flight from Boston. Passengers were moved to other seats and the flight landed safely at JFK. All of the passengers were put on another plane which landed in Miami at 2:15 p.m. On Saturday, American Airlines Flight 685 was diverted to JFK after a row of three seats had become loose in the coach cabin of the Boeing 757, an airline spokesperson said. Three passengers were moved to other seats on the flight before the plane landed safely around 12:50 p.m., officials said. No injuries were reported in either incident. Like the aircraft from Saturday’s flight, Flight 443, also a 757, had recently had maintenance done, officials said. American Airlines is taking a total of eight aircraft with similar seating assemblies out of service as a result. The airline said it is looking at the incidents as a maintenance issue. In a call to air traffic control, the pilot of Flight 685 can be heard saying, “Got an unusual one for you. Passenger seats rows 12D, E and F, uh, came loose out of the floor. Passengers are unable to, uh, sit in that seat.” Several hours later, passengers were placed on another flight to Miami. The airline is conducting an internal investigation. “Safety is our top priority,” American Airlines spokesperson Matt Miller said in a statement. “We never have – and never will – compromise the safety and reliability of our fleet.” American issued another statement Monday afternoon. “An initial internal investigation into why a row of seats became loose on an American Airlines Boeing 757 bound from Boston to Miami on Saturday has indicated that there could be a possible issue with a certain model of seats and how they fit into the tracking used to secure the seats. Out of an abundance of caution, American has decided to proactively reinspect eight 757s today that could possibly have this same issue. “The seats were installed by American maintenance and contract maintenance. The issue does not seem to be tied to any one maintenance facility or one workgroup. This afternoon, the company flew engineers, tech crew chiefs, and inspectors from its Tulsa maintenance base to New York to evaluate the aircraft and determine the next course of action to correct the problem. “We are in contact with the FAA they are aware of our internal review.” The Federal Aviation Administration issued the following statement on Monday: “The Federal Aviation Administration is looking into two separate incidents involving American Airlines Boeing 757 jetliners that were taken out of service after passenger seat rows became loose in flight. “On Saturday, American Flight 685, on a flight from Boston to Miami, diverted to John F. Kennedy International Airport (JFK) and on Monday, Flight 443, from JFK to Miami, returned to JFK without incident after loose seats were discovered. The airline’s initial inspection of each aircraft found other rows of seats that were not properly secured. “Preliminary information indicates that both aircraft had recently undergone maintenance during which the seats had been removed and re-installed. “Including these two airplanes, the airline has taken eight aircraft with similar seat assemblies out of service until they can be inspected.” The loose seat mishap is the latest blunder for American Airlines. The carrier is facing heightened scrutiny by the FAA in the wake of its bankruptcy filing last year, and a string of maintenance and employee problems — all of which have led to significant delays and cancellations. Many travelers are taking a second look when it comes to choosing American. “Obviously, American Airlines is not being transparent with information,” said concerned flier Patrick Rodgers. “If there are issues, they owe it to the American public.” |
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
On Mon, 01 Oct 2012 19:58:40 -0400, Fly Guy wrote:
How retarded is this. You've got a plane in the air, and someone notices that some seats are (or have become) loose. Passengers in those seats are moved to other (presumably empty) seats. Everyone is now sitting in a secure seat. So why does the plane need to make an emergency landing? What difference does it make at this point if the plane continues on and lands at it's scheduled destination? That's because the problem may be progressive and you could end up with seats just floating about the place and not bolted down. I imagine the aircraft puts down at the nearest airport that can take it. Obviously that would be exceptional, but there's nobody on the aircraft who will say that it's safe to continue, so it lands as soon as possible. |
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
On Mon, 01 Oct 2012 19:58:40 -0400 Fly Guy wrote:
:How retarded is this. :You've got a plane in the air, and someone notices that some seats are :(or have become) loose. :Passengers in those seats are moved to other (presumably empty) seats. :Everyone is now sitting in a secure seat. Assuming facts not in evidence. :So why does the plane need to make an emergency landing? Why did these seats get loose? If these seats got loose, how likely is it a systematic flaw and other seats will be following? For example, perhaps the crew maintaining the seats did it improperly? Perhaps they did other rows as well. :What difference does it make at this point if the plane continues on and :lands at it's scheduled destination? Because while certain symptoms are visible, one does not know the entire problem. Best to be safe. -- Binyamin Dissen http://www.dissensoftware.com Should you use the mailblocks package and expect a response from me, you should preauthorize the dissensoftware.com domain. I very rarely bother responding to challenge/response systems, especially those from irresponsible companies. |
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
Binyamin Dissen wrote:
: Everyone is now sitting in a secure seat. Assuming facts not in evidence. : So why does the plane need to make an emergency landing? Why did these seats get loose? If these seats got loose, how likely is it a systematic flaw and other seats will be following? Simple reasoning. Statistical probability. You have a plane with probably at least 70 seating units (each unit consisting of a row of 3 seats). If there was a systematic flaw, the likelyhood that NONE OF THEM were detected as being loose DURING BOARDING or taxi for take-off is pretty much zero. Secondly, in the air, the crew would have (or should have) checked all remaining seats for this condition, in an attempt to relocate ALL passengers sitting in unsafe seats. We can logically presume this happened. It can also be assumed that the seats did not become loose at any point - they were loose (not properly fastened to the floor) to begin with. Any other condition (such as they were secure and became insecure) would require the invention of self-unscrewing or self-detaching fasteners. In other words, it would have been irrational to assume that seats initially found to be secure would have at some point in the flight become insecure. Also, the media story was sufficiently detailed and did not say that some passengers were forced to sit or remain seated in loose seats. Hence there would have been no rational reason NOT to continue the 1.5 or 2 hours remaining to fly to the original destination. |
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 07:11:28 -0400, Fly Guy wrote:
Binyamin Dissen wrote: : Everyone is now sitting in a secure seat. Assuming facts not in evidence. : So why does the plane need to make an emergency landing? Why did these seats get loose? If these seats got loose, how likely is it a systematic flaw and other seats will be following? Simple reasoning. Statistical probability. You have a plane with probably at least 70 seating units (each unit consisting of a row of 3 seats). If there was a systematic flaw, the likelyhood that NONE OF THEM were detected as being loose DURING BOARDING or taxi for take-off is pretty much zero. Secondly, in the air, the crew would have (or should have) checked all remaining seats for this condition, in an attempt to relocate ALL passengers sitting in unsafe seats. We can logically presume this happened. It can also be assumed that the seats did not become loose at any point - they were loose (not properly fastened to the floor) to begin with. Any other condition (such as they were secure and became insecure) would require the invention of self-unscrewing or self-detaching fasteners. In other words, it would have been irrational to assume that seats initially found to be secure would have at some point in the flight become insecure. Also, the media story was sufficiently detailed and did not say that some passengers were forced to sit or remain seated in loose seats. Hence there would have been no rational reason NOT to continue the 1.5 or 2 hours remaining to fly to the original destination. You'll be making presumptions like those above and assuming technical skills in the crew that they don't have as the aircraft ploughs into the ground. Look, it's a large complicated machine full of small fragile people and flying at a Hell of a speed and one Hell of a height. When it goes wrong it needs looking at RIGHT NOW, and not after some mouthy punk with a big gob and a chip on his shoulder has arrived at his destination, picked up his luggage and started out for his hotel. |
#6
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
Hi!
Fly Guy wrote: It can also be assumed that the seats did not become loose at any point - they were loose (not properly fastened to the floor) to begin with. No, you can install a screw incorrectly by applying more torque to it. This one may break. Then the other ones might be overloaded. Gunter in Orlando, Fla (who has a degree in Mechanical Engineering) |
#7
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
Gunter Herrmann wrote:
It can also be assumed that the seats did not become loose at any point - they were loose (not properly fastened to the floor) to begin with. No, you can install a screw incorrectly by applying more torque to it. This one may break. Then the other ones might be overloaded. These seats are not held down by screws. The problem has been blamed on accumulation of soft-drink residue in the "seat-lock plunger" mechanism. http://blog.apex.aero/cms/wp-content...at-plunger.jpg See this: http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/05/travel...lem/index.html ============= Something called the seat lock plunger mechanism can "get gunked up over time with people spilling sodas, popcorn, coffee or whatever and that can affect that locking mechanism on the ground that locks the seat to the floor," airline spokeswoman Mary Frances Fagan said Friday. 11 witty and sage airline 'gunk' retorts Apparently, worn locking pins can get stuck when food and beverages spill onto them, allowing seat rows to come unhinged, she said. American earlier said saddle-shaped clamps installed to hold the seats down were put in backwards. While the clamps may have played a role, the soda and snack gunk now seems to be among the culprits, Fagan said. And while that explains what happened to the three American flights that experienced loose seats, it doesn't explain why the problem has affected only American flights in recent days, or why it's happened so many times in such a short period. Besides presumably cleaning out the gunk, Fagan says American mechanics are "taking extra steps to ensure that the seats do not dislodge from the track." That includes installing industrial-strength metal ties as a backup, airline spokeswoman Courtney Wallace said. ============== I would say that it doesn't seem possible that this seat-lock mechanism can be partially engaged. Seems that it has only 2 states - locked and unlocked. And if locked, it doesn't seem possibly to unlock without a special tool. |
#8
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Second AA Flight Returns To JFK After Row Of Seats Comes Loose
On Thu, 01 Nov 2012 09:55:56 -0400, Fly Guy wrote:
I would say that it doesn't seem possible that this seat-lock mechanism can be partially engaged. Seems that it has only 2 states - locked and unlocked. And if locked, it doesn't seem possibly to unlock without a special tool. I've wondered why this hasn't been a problem on all of the other airlines. |
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