IATA bids farewell to paper tickets

"mrtravel" wrote in message
. ..
wrote:

On Sep 3, 7:01 am, "TMOliver" wrote:

wrote ....




E-tickets are not written contracts if there is no writing, and there
is no writing when they are booked by phone. You do know the
definition of "writing," don't you?

Question...

E - tickets purchased on the Internet - or by phone - from AA (and I
suppose most other airlines) are followed by an email from the airline to
the purchaser acknowledging the details of the purchase (and transmitting
a
link to the conditions of carriage). I am of the impression that the
acknowledgement describing and defining the purchase consitutes the legal
equivalent of a contract. Apparently, acknowledgements of transactions
do
constitute contracts in some other tranactions mentioned in the UCC.




By the way, where is your law degree from? Where are you authorized
to practice law?

TMO


Sorry for the additional follow-up.

The UCC applies only as between _merchants_.


Huh?
So, I guess lines like the following are meaningless?
"(e) If one of the parties to a transaction is a consumer, the following
rules apply"

WRONG

What section of the UCC (which stands for "Uniform _Commercial_ Code" are
you looking at?

In article om,
wrote:

The context was your ridiculous claim that (quote) ``an e-ticket is not
a written contract,'' followed by a long blovation that any opinion
of yours about e-tickets must be correct because you are a Licensed
Attorney (TM)... even though it was blindingly clear that you knew
bugger-all about e-tickets and how they work. E-tickets were written
contracts back in 2000, and they still are.

You haven't a clue, have you? Spend some time on google and then see
what you have to say, both about "Brooklyn Academy of Law," where I
practice law, what position I hold and whether I am a "once-a-year
traveler to Las Vegas.

According to Google, you have a degree from a fourth-rate law school
(Brooklyn^H^H^H^HLoyola Academy of Law or something - doesn't seem
to appear among the top fifty US law schools, per US News rankings)
and hold a position as ``counsel'' (isn't that a shorthand for failed
lawyers who didn't make partner?) at a third-rate firm. Apparently,
law is not the first career at which you failed, which would explain
why you imagine that a law degree is a license to spout nonsense
about e-tickets.

E-tickets are not written contracts if there is no writing, and there
is no writing when they are booked by phone. You do know the
definition of "writing," don't you?

I do know that no so long ago you claimed that (quote) ``an e-ticket
is an oral promise.'' Apparently, all these annual joints to Vegas
still haven't taught you that e-tickets come in forms other than oral
promises by airline representatives. Tsk, tsk.

By the way, where is your law degree from? Where are you authorized
to practice law?

I don't need a law degree to steer you - ever gently and kindly -
towards realizing that your claims about e-tickets (``an e-ticket
is an oral promise'' and ``an e-ticket is not a written contract'')
are pure nonsense. But if you don't believe me, why don't you stomp
your little feet at IATA and tell *them* what you think about legality
of e-tickets.

On Sep 8, 10:55 pm, (VS) wrote:
In article om,

wrote:
The context was your ridiculous claim that (quote) ``an e-ticket is not
a written contract,'' followed by a long blovation that any opinion
of yours about e-tickets must be correct because you are a Licensed
Attorney (TM)... even though it was blindingly clear that you knew
bugger-all about e-tickets and how they work. E-tickets were written
contracts back in 2000, and they still are.

You haven't a clue, have you? Spend some time on google and then see
what you have to say, both about "Brooklyn Academy of Law," where I
practice law, what position I hold and whether I am a "once-a-year
traveler to Las Vegas.

According to Google, you have a degree from a fourth-rate law school
(Brooklyn^H^H^H^HLoyola Academy of Law or something - doesn't seem
to appear among the top fifty US law schools, per US News rankings)

Loyola Law is fourth rate? Try again, sonny.


and hold a position as ``counsel'' (isn't that a shorthand for failed
lawyers who didn't make partner?) at a third-rate firm.

My firm is third-rate? "Counsel" is short-hand for "didn't make
partner?"

Try again, sonny.

Apparently,
law is not the first career at which you failed, which would explain
why you imagine that a law degree is a license to spout nonsense
about e-tickets.

Yeah, right. I used to wonder why you drew constant attacks from so
many people on the net. Guess I know, don't I?


E-tickets are not written contracts if there is no writing, and there
is no writing when they are booked by phone. You do know the
definition of "writing," don't you?

I do know that no so long ago you claimed that (quote) ``an e-ticket
is an oral promise.'' Apparently, all these annual joints to Vegas
still haven't taught you that e-tickets come in forms other than oral
promises by airline representatives. Tsk, tsk.

I think you mean, "jaunt," not "joint." And I have no idea what
you're talking about. I don't take "annual jaunts" to Las Vegas, and
when I do go I don't fly.


By the way, where is your law degree from? Where are you authorized
to practice law?

I don't need a law degree to steer you -

Sure, you're clearly a well-qualified legal expert.


ever gently and kindly -
towards realizing that your claims about e-tickets (``an e-ticket
is an oral promise'' and ``an e-ticket is not a written contract'')
are pure nonsense. But if you don't believe me, why don't you stomp
your little feet at IATA and tell *them* what you think about legality
of e-tickets.

As I said (though I understand you have trouble with content as well
as context), in 2000, when I made those comments, etickets were mad
eon the phone and no written confirmations were provided. However,
don't let the facts get in your way.

wrote:


As I said (though I understand you have trouble with content as well
as context), in 2000, when I made those comments, etickets were mad
eon the phone and no written confirmations were provided. However,
don't let the facts get in your way.



I have a question. How does emailing an e-ticket receipt change whether
this is a written contract or not?
Isn't a written contract signed by both parties?

On Sep 10, 1:03 am, mrtravel wrote:
wrote:

As I said (though I understand you have trouble with content as well
as context), in 2000, when I made those comments, etickets were mad
eon the phone and no written confirmations were provided. However,
don't let the facts get in your way.

I have a question. How does emailing an e-ticket receipt change whether
this is a written contract or not?
Isn't a written contract signed by both parties?

There weren't email confirmations in 2000. However:

1. Why do you think phone reps always (and still) read you the terms
and restrictions when you book a ticket?
2. Supposing the contemporary system malfunctions and no email
receipt is ever transmitted by the airline -- where is the writing,
signed by the party to be charged?
3. Supposing the email receipt is received, but it reflects the wrong
date, or the wrong price or different terms and conditions (e.g. non-
refundable when you asked for refundable)?

How will you prove up the terms of your "written" agreement?

In article .com,
wrote:

I used to wonder why you drew constant attacks from so
many people on the net. Guess I know, don't I?

You don't know anything, and never did - just consider your ``legal
opinion'' that e-ticket is an oral promise, and that an e-ticket is
not a written contract.

Why dontcha take this legal opinion to IATA? They'll be delighted
to learn that (quote) ``an e-ticket is not a written contract.''
Tell them about California statute of frauds, while you are at it.

Sure, you're clearly a well-qualified legal expert.

I am not a legal expert, I just know more about e-tickets than a failed
lawyer who thinks that ``an e-ticket is an oral promise.''

As I said (though I understand you have trouble with content as well
as context), in 2000, when I made those comments, etickets were mad
eon the phone and no written confirmations were provided.

In 2000, e-tickets were bought online and booked by travel agents.
Even when they were booked by phone, airlines always provided e-mail,
fax and postal-mail confirmations. There was *never* a time when
e-tickets were not accompanied by written confirmations.

I've got a stack of written e-ticket receipts and confirmations going
back to at least 1997, if not earlier. All you've got is a diploma from
a fourth-rate law school noone has heard about, and the delusion that
it gives the force of law to any nonsense opinion you happen to hold.
You like a lance corporal who, when he barges into a pub, demands to
be addressed as ``Mr. Staff Sergeant-Major, Sir!''

Do take your legal opinions to IATA. Tell them that an e-ticket is
not a written contract, then let us know where they tell ya to stick it