Arizona, Show Your Papers? So What!

Earl Evleth wrote:

On 5/05/10 18:41, in article ,
"Hatunen" wrote:

A lot of people don't have drivers licenses at all...

My daughter, who had a French license (still does, they are good for life)
use to use in Arizona to dodge tickets, smiling and pretending to
be this ignorant French girl.

However in visiting death row at Florence Arizona, the people
there insisted on a driver's license but did not like my French license.
They rejected my US passport and wanted a driver's license, which for some
stupid reason they thought was better. So I ended up showing my
my collection of ID documents (French ID card, French and American
passports and French driver's license). Dumb and dumbfounded they
accepted on of them.

Is "on" supra short for "none" or "one"? Did you get in?


Anyway, the keystone cops of Arizona will have a lovely time.

Finally someone will be doing something about illegals.




--
"It is illuminating for purposes of reflection, if not for
argument, to note that one of the greatest 'fictions' of our
federal system is that the Congress exercises only those powers
delegated to it, while the remainder are reserved to the States or
to the people. The manner in which this Court has construed the
Commerce Clause amply illustrates the extent of this fiction.",
Hodel v. Virginia Surface Mining, 452 U.S. 264, 307 (1981)

On 5/05/10 18:41, in article ,
"Hatunen" wrote:

A lot of people don't have drivers licenses at all...


My daughter, who had a French license (still does, they are good for life)
use to use in Arizona to dodge tickets, smiling and pretending to
be this ignorant French girl.

However in visiting death row at Florence Arizona, the people
there insisted on a driver's license but did not like my French license.
They rejected my US passport and wanted a driver's license, which for some
stupid reason they thought was better. So I ended up showing my
my collection of ID documents (French ID card, French and American
passports and French driver's license). Dumb and dumbfounded they
accepted on of them.

Anyway, the keystone cops of Arizona will have a lovely time.

Earl Evleth wrote:

On 5/05/10 18:38, in article
, "Mike"
wrote:

Not the Arizona law. An Arizona drivers license is acceptable.
And even non-citizen legal immigrants can get an Arizona drivers
license.


Agreed. Problem solved.

especially since they are easy to forge.

http://www.espionage-store.com/fakeidletter.html

or

How You Can Get A Complete Fake ID & Identity Fast and Easy!

perhaps a scam since payment, with a credit card, exposes
you to a rip off with an unknown outfit.

Since they would get in trouble for illegal credit card business,
and not get paid by the credit card company, it would seem like the
goal is to fish for credit card numbers. If AZ has a decent driving
licence, some have chips in them now, it would be hard to fake. And
the cop can just look you up. So it isn't like they can make up a
licence that says anything, it has to be in the database. So does
the picture look like you? How easy is it to find someone to
pretend to be? That's on the level of what Israel is accused of
doing when that Pali terrorist was killed.





--
"It is illuminating for purposes of reflection, if not for
argument, to note that one of the greatest 'fictions' of our
federal system is that the Congress exercises only those powers
delegated to it, while the remainder are reserved to the States or
to the people. The manner in which this Court has construed the
Commerce Clause amply illustrates the extent of this fiction.",
Hodel v. Virginia Surface Mining, 452 U.S. 264, 307 (1981)

Earl Evleth wrote:

On 5/05/10 18:58, in article , "Bill Bonde
{Colourless green ideas don't sleep furiously)"
wrote:

If AZ has a decent driving
licence, some have chips in them now,

IF, always IF.

Even if it's a paper card, the cop can look up the person and get
the fact of that person's existence and the right picture. Do they
match? Fake ID to get into the bar is one thing, but to fool a cop
in 2010, not so easy.



--
"It is illuminating for purposes of reflection, if not for
argument, to note that one of the greatest 'fictions' of our
federal system is that the Congress exercises only those powers
delegated to it, while the remainder are reserved to the States or
to the people. The manner in which this Court has construed the
Commerce Clause amply illustrates the extent of this fiction.",
Hodel v. Virginia Surface Mining, 452 U.S. 264, 307 (1981)

On 5/05/10 18:54, in article , "Bill Bonde
{Colourless green ideas don't sleep furiously)"
wrote:

Is "on" supra short for "none" or "one"? Did you get in?

Of course. But it is supermax and that is depressing.

Donna is co-translator of the book by a man on death row.
He wrote it in poor English and the book was essentially rewritten
in France, not exactly translated. Retold

http://www.lairdcarlson.com/celldoor...itingToDie.htm


Anyway, the keystone cops of Arizona will have a lovely time.

Finally someone will be doing something about illegals.


Don't you believe it. The only effective policy is doing
something drastic about those hiring illegals.

On 5/05/10 18:58, in article , "Bill Bonde
{Colourless green ideas don't sleep furiously)"
wrote:

If AZ has a decent driving
licence, some have chips in them now,

IF, always IF.

So what martin ?


"Martin" a écrit dans le message de groupe de
discussion : ...
William Black wrote:
On 05/05/10 12:11, O'Donovan, PJ, Himself wrote:

These people who are protesting being asked for identification by
Arizona cops—have they been anywhere lately, like out of the country?
Like Mexico, or Canada, or India, or Italy, or Tanzania, or Singapore,
or Britain—places where people in uniforms have routinely demanded my
papers?


People do write the silliest stuff.

No-one in the UK has the right to demand to see your papers on the spot.
The police have limited rights to either arrest you if they suspect a
crime has been committed or to request that you produce your papers
within 48 hours at a police station.

In India, where I have 'right of abode', the police have the right to
ask that I produce my papers within 24 hours at a police station.

I have never heard of either case happening.

In the Netherlands the police have the right to ask for ID. They
occasionally do. I think thew fine for not carrying ID is EUR60

On 5/05/10 21:05, in article , "Bill Bonde
{Colourless green ideas don't sleep furiously)"
wrote:

the cop can look up the person and get
the fact of that person's existence and the right picture.

What information does the Arizona driver's license have?

Our French ID cqrd tells the officer immediately; this person
is a French citizen. It gives the date and place of birth, which
tells the officer that I was born in the USA, it gives current
address (if I move I have a certain number of days until
I get the care changed). It has my biometrics and photo.

Looking up the web available examples I don't find any of this
information on the Arizona Driver's license.

What is on it?

From: harry k
Organization: http://groups.google.com
Newsgroups:
alt.activism.death-penalty,uk.politics.misc,aus.politics,soc.retireme nt,rec.tr
avel.europe
Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 07:08:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Arizona, Show Your Papers? So What!

Somehow he apparently missed the "prove you are a US citizen" bit.
That law requires much more than just a driver's license. "show me
your papers" brings up instant memories of jack booted thugs, What
comes next? Make every legal Hispanic (and don't even try to tell me
that law is targeted at 'everybody) where a prominent badge of some
type? Maybe get a chip implant?

Harry K

I learned from experience that this sort of thing can happen to anybody. In
1983, I wanted to show my French neighbor and best friend my home state of
California. Bad idea. We were burgled in our motel at 1 AM on our second
day in town. I did the best I could to catch up with the burglar - my
friend had alerted me to his presence, inspite of our jet lag - but I
couldn't run quite fast enough, and wasn't willing to let him drag me with
his car. He got away, all our identity papers went with him.

My French friend went to the French consulate in Los Angeles and got a pass
to go home right away. I, as an American, had a whole different problem.

I went to the passport office in LA, where I was told I had to prove I was
an American citizen. Since every identifying document I had had been taken
in the burglary, this was a big problem for me. My problem was compounded
by the fact that the burglary took place on the first day of the three day
fourth of July weekend.

All my relative and friends in LA (my birthplace) who knew me were out of
town. The only piece of good luck I had was that our niece, whom I called
in desperation, and who was also out of town, had a friend who was
monitoring her answering machine. I had met her friend only once, but this
woman, out of the goodness of her heart, was willing to go with me to the
passport office and swear that I was, in fact, an American citizen. She is
dead now, of cancer, and I still grieve.

After this experience, the "prove you are an American citizen" bit still and
forever strikes home. BTW, I am a nice white middle class lady. And as
such, I despise the Arizona law. Been there, done that. I also realize too
well that the folks the Arizona law will be targeting do not have my
advantages of birth.

Donna Evleth

From: "Bill Bonde {Colourless green ideas don't sleep furiously)"

Organization: Our legacy is not the lives we lived but the lives we leave to
those who come after us.
Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty,soc.retirement,rec.travel.europe
Date: Wed, 05 May 2010 16:54:16 +0000
Subject: Arizona, Show Your Papers? So What!



Earl Evleth wrote:

On 5/05/10 18:41, in article ,
"Hatunen" wrote:

A lot of people don't have drivers licenses at all...

My daughter, who had a French license (still does, they are good for life)
use to use in Arizona to dodge tickets, smiling and pretending to
be this ignorant French girl.

However in visiting death row at Florence Arizona, the people
there insisted on a driver's license but did not like my French license.
They rejected my US passport and wanted a driver's license, which for some
stupid reason they thought was better. So I ended up showing my
my collection of ID documents (French ID card, French and American
passports and French driver's license). Dumb and dumbfounded they
accepted on of them.

Is "on" supra short for "none" or "one"? Did you get in?

Yes, we got in. I was there too, with the same "funny" documents.


Anyway, the keystone cops of Arizona will have a lovely time.

Finally someone will be doing something about illegals.

Finally someone will be doing something about illegals when they start
cracking down on the employers. Not a minute before.

Donna Evleth